| Author | Message | ||
| dave handa (Davehanda)
Intermediate Member Username: Davehanda Post Number: 1701 Registered: 5-2001 |
Hans, without a doubt, you 308 is the strongest running carb 308 that I am aware of, that doesn't have extensive mods. :-) | ||
| Hans E. Hansen (4re_gt4)
Intermediate Member Username: 4re_gt4 Post Number: 1666 Registered: 4-2002 |
1975 308GT4, with minor 'simple' mods: 198 at WHEEL. This is with 10K on the spark plugs, and 5 year old wires. I think the biggest acceleration problem in these cars is that you can measure the gearshifts with a CALENDAR. 1-2 is perhaps nearly 2 seconds, other shifts are easiely 1 second. My car will hold it's own if I get a rolling start at 4000 in 2nd gear (about 35-40mph). 0-60 suffers from no torque to get off the line, and the near 2 second penalty into 2nd gear. All told, we're talkiing 3 or more seconds wasted. Oh, and PS: My car is right dead-on 3100lbs with full tank of gas. | ||
| Ken Vicentini (Ken_v)
New member Username: Ken_v Post Number: 14 Registered: 4-2003 |
I have a U.S. 79 308gtb with electronic ignition, smog pump removed, and cat's removed. Bob Norwood dyno'd it and it put down 188rwhp. Bob said it was the most he had gotten out of a U.S. car. I know that the Euro cars have more power, but I previously owned a Euro 79 308gts that felt a whole lot more powerfull. It was night and day between the two cars. | ||
| Dave (Dave)
Member Username: Dave Post Number: 575 Registered: 4-2001 |
When I got my U.S. spec 1977 308gtb I put her on the dyno so I would have a baseline figure to work from. In the state of disrepair that the car was in it put down 179rwhp. The car now has electronic ignition, K&N filter, Tubi, rebuilt & rejetted carbs, and runs much stronger. At some point I will put her back on the dyno before I make further changes on the engine. | ||
| dave handa (Davehanda)
Intermediate Member Username: Davehanda Post Number: 1622 Registered: 5-2001 |
No, it was pretty quick feeling, but knowing that period articles pegged the 0-60 in the low 7's, means that while it didn't feel slow, it probably was. My current 328 definitely feels faster; hell, I beat my buddy's Daytona racing up a bridge in our neighborhood. We both did a rolling start in 1st gear... | ||
| James Angle (Jimangle)
Junior Member Username: Jimangle Post Number: 72 Registered: 9-2002 |
Dave, Would you describe your car as being slow? Jim | ||
| dave handa (Davehanda)
Intermediate Member Username: Davehanda Post Number: 1616 Registered: 5-2001 |
But you MAY be pleasantly surprised, or better yet, find it is down a bit, but that it is lean and just needs a simple rejetting to "uncork" it...I'd recommend doing it, just make sure they have a exhaust sniffer hooked up to see what it's doing during the run. | ||
| Newman (Newman)
Intermediate Member Username: Newman Post Number: 1249 Registered: 12-2001 |
Hard to say about the power Dave, it goes well but seeing real dyno numbers in this article makes me feel that it might be making the 255 ferrari claims after all the mods. Im also afraid to find out incase it sucks, I would almost rather not know at all. I plan on cams and more carb work this winter. | ||
| dave handa (Davehanda)
Intermediate Member Username: Davehanda Post Number: 1612 Registered: 5-2001 |
I don't have the Forza article handy, but my initial impression is that the K&N on a carb car would lean out the mixture, that is more air, but no extra fuel to compensate, thus less power. My car was found to be WAY lean when taken to the dyno shop. They slowly up the main jets from 125 to 130 to 135 to 140. Final result was an extra 20+ hp. BTW Newman, you should take your car to the dyno shop, as I bet your car is making some nice power with the mods you have. | ||
| Newman (Newman)
Intermediate Member Username: Newman Post Number: 1248 Registered: 12-2001 |
Just check out the forza magazine with a Euro GT4 engine on the dyno. K&N reduced power over the stock filter and all the tweeking they did produced only 225HP at the flywheel. Thats a more realistic number rather than the 255 ferrari is claiming. Max was 231 with venturies, timing and a tubi. | ||
| dave handa (Davehanda)
Intermediate Member Username: Davehanda Post Number: 1609 Registered: 5-2001 |
James, 78 and 79 cars are identical in the engine compartment. I dyno'd my 78 and got around 178-179hp (corrected to about 214hp at the crank). It had the following: K&N air filter stock exhaust with no cat air pump belt removed recent major service with new wires and extenders rejetted carbs with 140 main jets Crane Cams electronic ignition | ||
| James Angle (Jimangle)
Junior Member Username: Jimangle Post Number: 70 Registered: 9-2002 |
I drove a 79 308 gts, and by no means was it slow. The smog pump was removed, and it had an ansa racing exhaust, and it screamed. I keep hearing that these cars are slow, (I guess compared to a testarossa) but it didn't feel slow. Would the original equipment choke it that much? Has anyone ever dyno'ed a 79 308 with the smog equipment removed? | ||
| Lashdeep Singh (Lashss)
New member Username: Lashss Post Number: 13 Registered: 7-2003 |
My '76 (#20445) was a US Spec carbed GTB with no cats or emissions equipment and a good tune-up. I never got a chance to dyno the car, but it made very nice power. I ran head to head with a lightly modded 6spd LT1 Z28 from 10-60mph and it was a dead heat. My friend's car had a Flowmaster exhaust, underdrive pulleys, and a cold air intake. His best 1/4 mile time was 14.0@99mph and he is an *excellent* nationally competitive SCCA Solo II ESP driver. So, hard launches are his specialty. I also had an exercise with a slightly modded 3rd gen RX7 (boost controller and straight exhuast) from 60-110mph and pulled away slightly. The only change from stock was a K&N air filter. I don't think that car was typical, but the removal of smog equipment, a Euro exhaust, and a good tune-up sure does make a huge difference with the carbed 308s. Lashdeep | ||
| James Adams (Madmaxx)
Junior Member Username: Madmaxx Post Number: 172 Registered: 11-2002 |
Wow... I would have peged the car around ~2800lbs  Where is the bulk of the weight on the car? James | ||
| Jerry Fisher (Emtrey)
New member Username: Emtrey Post Number: 18 Registered: 8-2003 |
Road& Track listed USA 1977 308 GTB at 3085 lbs.. wish is were lighter..that's the 1/4 mile problem..its heavy.... | ||
| James Adams (Madmaxx)
Junior Member Username: Madmaxx Post Number: 171 Registered: 11-2002 |
What did the steel bodies tip the scales at? James | ||
| Robert McNair (Rrm)
Member Username: Rrm Post Number: 633 Registered: 5-2002 |
I have a road test of a 77 308 GTB from M/T. Here are the specs h.p. 240 torque 195lb/ft 0-60 8.2 qrtr mile [email protected] Here is an excerpt on the straight line performance quoted from the atricle "In terms of straight line performance the 308 and 246 could hardly be a better match.With the exception of the Dino's slightly lower shift points the two acceleration curves are almost identical. The Dino, hampered with considerably less emmisions equipment did the standing qrtr mile in 15.25 @ 92.11 beating the 308. It could be that the major diffrence was in the shifting. The 308 gearbox was stickier or more balky than was that of the 246 and each shift in the 308 took possibly a half second longer than in the Dino." Other facts list price was 29,525 and I was suprised to see the warranty was only one year or 10,000 miles. | ||
| dave handa (Davehanda)
Intermediate Member Username: Davehanda Post Number: 1586 Registered: 5-2001 |
Sean, Basically has it right. Period literature and articles match the HP he states, 240hp for 76-77, and 205hp for 78-79. Current FNA website claims ALL carb 308's had 240hp, which is dubious at this point.... | ||
| Jerry Fisher (Emtrey)
New member Username: Emtrey Post Number: 17 Registered: 8-2003 |
Car and Driver tested a 240hp USA version at 15.8sec in the 1/4 mile @ 89mph...Euro versions(255 bhp) @14.8 sec/1/4 mile..( tested by Autocar)...The Car and Driver test car was fiberglass but the weight difference was only 53 lbs. | ||
| Jerry Fisher (Emtrey)
New member Username: Emtrey Post Number: 16 Registered: 8-2003 |
I think Sean is correct..The 1976/77 cars had different cam timing and supposedly put out more power. If my memory is correct this was to accomodate the tighter smog standards for 1978. | ||
| Sean F (Agracer)
Member Username: Agracer Post Number: 335 Registered: 2-2003 |
The '76 and '77 carb cars had about 240 BHP in US trim, and 255 BHP in Euro trim (dry sump motor also). The 1978-1979 carb cars had about 205 BHP. While the factory says they hall had ~ 220. I've read numberous books, and several on this site have confirmed that the early carb cars have more power than the later ones. | ||
| Jerry Fisher (Emtrey)
New member Username: Emtrey Post Number: 15 Registered: 8-2003 |
I think the US cars were 0-60 in the low 7 second range. Early tests by one of the US magazines were in the 7.7 range but they disclaimed that something was wrong with the clutch on their test car. You are correct in saying they are not 1/4 burners and are best at mid-range punch and "point and squirt" type driving. Mine just had 15K service w/ new clutch and is running great at the moment but it would still probably get spanked by most of today's medium perfomance cars in 1/4 mile. However, I would not trade the driving enjoyment for anything else I could currently afford. The carbs cars are still a ball to drive and listen to.....hope this helped. I will dig out some of the old road tests are re-post times later today.... | ||
| James Adams (Madmaxx)
Junior Member Username: Madmaxx Post Number: 170 Registered: 11-2002 |
What would one estimate the accelration times of a carbed steel-body 308 to be? I know their not quarter-mile bandits or anything  James |