| Author | Message | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5768 Registered: 5-2001 |
Racism is a form of structure to opress Narzism is the same with other methods. Both say it is okay to hate what you are not. Jesus was dran to the poor. The Koran preaches acceptance. Buddhism gives the same cloths to everyone and shaves thier heads so you can look past the exterior and see the inner of a person. It is those crazed radicals that take things out of context like attached social class and low rent as a criteria of good or bad. Yep, even the Unibomber though he was right! | ||
| Jeffrey Wolfe (86mondial32)
Member Username: 86mondial32 Post Number: 452 Registered: 5-2003 |
Martin.. you answered just as I expected. BTW she was still there yesterday. Long sleeve and no "rows". Hopefully she learned the lesson that in life there are rules.You might say she "sold out". But I say she now knows that no one person has the right to decide for others. It's called mainstream. | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5767 Registered: 5-2001 |
"At least in the old days "new money" worked to fit in." Fit in with WHAT? | ||
| Jeffrey Wolfe (86mondial32)
Member Username: 86mondial32 Post Number: 451 Registered: 5-2003 |
Joe.. it is not racism. I knwo that if we still had a class structure the we would not have movies like "8 mile". Where a mother tells her son that she likes oral sex and is not getting enoough. do we really need to examine the plight of the poor and make it a national obsession to level the field? HELL no. Upper, Middle, Lower.. whats the problem. If you are at the bottom you work to move up. If you are at the top you work to stay there. That has driven every society since time began. | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5766 Registered: 5-2001 |
Jeffrey, as to your question whould I shop there if I would know? Yes, because I can give a rats about what thier policy is. If they start treating me as a customer bad because I have a tattoo and wear braids then yes I would have a HUGE problem with that and would make a great efford to make their lives miserable. The girl has to decide what is more important to her. Her personal look opposed to where she works. The company does not own her they only owe her a paycheck for wor performed. And trust me that company policy would be out the window if she would be the top sales agent for that company. Now the correct question you want to ask me is what would I do if I was her. Answer I would stand in front of the store manager and calmly and collected tell him that he is an ignorant idiot and that I quit. I would not yell neither say the word discrimination. I would not sue nor shead a tear over that job. | ||
| Jeffrey Wolfe (86mondial32)
Member Username: 86mondial32 Post Number: 450 Registered: 5-2003 |
Okay.. Since we are being civil I will ask.. Martin... what is your opinion of the retailers actions? Do you really think they are wrong to expect a certain level of behavior? Would you check into the GeorgeV and be happy seeing a front desk person in jeans and wearing a tat? Of course not. AS you go higher up the levels of society we expect to see more refinement. it's called breeding. In the past much time was spent making sure that the young were prepared correctly to assume a role in society. The problem is that in America.... We have too many "new money" familes and no real class. At least in the old days "new money" worked to fit in. | ||
| Joe V. (Jts)
New member Username: Jts Post Number: 18 Registered: 8-2003 |
Jeffrey - I agree that the "anything goes", permissive attitudes of a lot of Liberals and their like-minded cronies on the left have created more problems than they have solved - but that's not the point of this post. I have always been a Conservative and I know I always will be.....BUT (and I preface the following by saying that I am relatively new here and I am asking you an honest question - not accusing you of anything) it seems to me that while you are definitely a conservative, you are also extremely racist. When you talk about "class structure", are you in fact referring to the good old days when the straight white Christian male was the king of the world and everyone else (women, minorities, immigrants, gays etc.) were "lesser" beings that were there to serve? Isn't it convenient that you won the lottery and were born a straight white Christian male? I feel that we may actually agree on several subjects, but the constant, underlying current of racism and hate that is evident in almost all of your posts really depresses me. | ||
| Jeffrey Wolfe (86mondial32)
Member Username: 86mondial32 Post Number: 449 Registered: 5-2003 |
Martin.. how do you go from racism to Nazism?..I guess in your book ANY type of control or structure is wrong? "King of the Hill" did a great story about getting stuck employing a druggie due to federal guidelines. IN you book even a Crackhead deserves a chance at the American dream. GOD help us all. | ||
| Pat Pasqualini (Enzo)
Member Username: Enzo Post Number: 883 Registered: 2-2002 |
"Where did some of you guys get from my posts that I look down on people with tattoos?" because you said "IMHO tattoos are for losers regardless of the image depicted thereon" | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5765 Registered: 5-2001 |
Low rent does not mean low class. I can show you very well kept houses in low rent neighborhoods in Miami that I would be proud of living next to. They care about their LOW property and treat is like a mansion, although they can not afford more. I can also show you some Million Dollar houses run by cheap bastards that let their houses go to waste and bring down everything besides them with them. Ah yes, they leave every morning to work in a Lexus and wear suits. You can teach your daughter right and wrong. To assume that someone is a criminal raping your daughter in the oval office because he wears a tattoo is wrong. I will make an assumption here that we are ALL guilty off. You have driven and consistantly drive faster that the posted speed limit! You are guilty of not staying in the boundries of your structured society. You pick and chose which rules you want to obey while you break others. | ||
| Jeffrey Wolfe (86mondial32)
Member Username: 86mondial32 Post Number: 448 Registered: 5-2003 |
Forgive the typos.. I just get so worked up over Seeing my country ruined by lowered standards | ||
| Tillman Strahan (Tillman)
Member Username: Tillman Post Number: 878 Registered: 11-2001 |
What about religious tattoos, Frank?  | ||
| Jeffrey Wolfe (86mondial32)
Member Username: 86mondial32 Post Number: 447 Registered: 5-2003 |
As a note to back up my points. Just last week I was hanging out in the ofices of the MAJOR retailer I sub for. One of their girls was getting a corrective for her apperance. She was a young wht girl, I would guess mid-20's, and she had corn rows in her hair and one exposed tat. She was being addressed on how that was not fitting in their enviroment. Since they deal with a wide customer base she needed to be more proper. When she balked and started to yell about her "rights" she was reminded that she was in the private sector and had signed, as all did, an arbitration agreement along with a COS ( company operating standards) agreement. She was told to cover the tat and lose the "rows" or seek other employ. I guess if you knew which comapny you would stop shopping there Martin? It's wrong for them to prtect their image? | ||
| Jon P. Kofod (95f355c)
Member Username: 95f355c Post Number: 929 Registered: 8-2001 |
Ok Martin....with that intelligent post I will now support and vote for you as President !!!! I think you said it best! Regards, Jon P. Kofod 1995 F355 Challenge #23 | ||
| Frank Parker (Parkerfe)
Advanced Member Username: Parkerfe Post Number: 2841 Registered: 9-2001 |
Where did some of you guys get from my posts that I look down on people with tattoos? I don't....I just think that it was poor judgement to get one. I too have execised poor judgement and will do so again in the future. Not to get a tattoo though. I own and ride a Harley Fatboy too, without a tattoo. I am a member of HOG and Abate and know a lot of folks with tattoos. I often mention to them that I think their tattoos look like crap. Some of them laugh and claim I'm just jealous, but most of them say they agree and regret getting it. And, of course you can go to heaven with a tattoo. Once you accept Jesus as your savior all your past is forgotten and forgiven and God looks at you through Christ eyes as a saint. If you want a tattoo, go for it. It keeps the economy going I suppose by supporting tattoo artist, sic , tattoo removal shops and doctors who treat people for HIV, hepatitis and other ailments often transmitted through such foolishness. Good luck. | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5764 Registered: 5-2001 |
Can't help myself: Here is some structure for you from recent history: "Blacks ride in the back of the bus" "No admission for blacks" "Voting by men only" Here is some better ones: the ultimate structure as you may want to call it: a race of blond and blue eyes. Structure: all boys drop their pants and those that are circumcised will be put on the train to the Concentration Camps We have overcome those social classes finally. Most of them as late as in the last 50 years. We are fianlly overcoming others like accepting that a woman can work and bear children. That the man can stay home as a stay home parent and his wife works. That people with tattoos are part of our "social class". | ||
| Ermin Trevisan (Trevi)
Junior Member Username: Trevi Post Number: 80 Registered: 5-2003 |
martin, well said! trevi | ||
| Jeffrey Wolfe (86mondial32)
Member Username: 86mondial32 Post Number: 446 Registered: 5-2003 |
Gee Martin you are right. It's okay to be WHATEVER you want. Heck... we should let the president F**K young girls in the oval office. Who cares... we are not to judge. And teaching our young that everyone is an equal... why not? Even low rent trash that make records for 13 year olds containing sexual deviant behavior are people too. You can teach your daughter it's fine to date and marry some beaner right off the boat but don't you dare have the gall to tell me thats the way of the world. THANK god most people still look down on low rent behavior( even if they don't say it to your face). One thing I talk about to other owners is the fact that if we were in the early days of Ferrari EZNO would not have sold most of us cars. HE was picky about who got his machines. | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5763 Registered: 5-2001 |
I will make this really easy and will get off this because now I am getting pissed! If you discriminate against someone for * his cloths * his Tattos * his believes (religious or otherwise) * his skin color * his Nationality * his car (except if it is not a F-car  ) * and all the other things that set you apart from him, YOU are truely Ghetto. You are no better that the suicide bomber and the terrorist that flies an airliner into a building. You have lost all touch with reality and have put yourself out there with those that just can not accept others for what they are. If "social class" is discrimination against everybody you do not like, thanks to myself (God) that I am NOT part of THAT social class. Over and out! | ||
| Jeffrey Wolfe (86mondial32)
Member Username: 86mondial32 Post Number: 445 Registered: 5-2003 |
Humm..."think outside the box" what a catchy buzzword. And you are right.. it is so much better that our standards have allowed us to "think outside the box" and grow to accept such things as RAP, PUNKS, BODY ART, Girls gone wild, Colleges that advertise their "party" status and the list goes on and on. What was I thinking.. it is soo much better to be Free to be what you want.. CRAP!! Structure is one of the building blocks of a society. Classes are neeeded to define growth. And for your information... most of the "suits" that screwed up today were the "outside the box" thinkers you love so much. Todays leaders were the first generation of losers from the 60's. In the words of the great Dirty Harry. " A man's gotta know his limitations". Sadly we are a society that confuses forward thinking with fads and schemes. | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5762 Registered: 5-2001 |
Ghetto trash? What is wrong with this country and so many other "civilized" countries is that you have lost the meaning of diversity. All you can think of is in suits and T-shirts. What you have to teach your kids is that it is okay to express themselves. Now this also means that you do not HAVE to get a tattoo because it is fashion today, it means you can listen to classic music and still be cool and yourself, it means if you like rap and you are not black that is okay for as long as you like it because of what it is. Your remark means that you have lost that ability. The 58 year old biker is probably happy while you are stuck in your banker suit trying hard to be someone you are likely NOT. You are the poser the one that is not true to himself. If you feel like wearing a T-shirt to work, do you? Now that is Ghetto to me! Wannabes! Posers! Be what you are and what you want to be, not for the fashion but for what you feel like that day. I don't exp[ect a suit in a bank. I am very happy if an investment broker can think outside the box and express himself by not going the main stream way! Actually that is what I would be looking at. Those are the guys that will make you good money while the SUIT fails on the Enron pick! | ||
| Jeffrey Wolfe (86mondial32)
Member Username: 86mondial32 Post Number: 444 Registered: 5-2003 |
To weigh in here... Several here used the arguement that many sucessful people have tats and that they are not only for "bikers and druggies" anymore. That the more recent generations have made it acceptible. I can only add.. THATS THE PROBLEM !! We are doing a great job of following Rome into the history books. Gee... a banker that wears jeans and tats makes 20 milion.... Is he a sucess... Nope he is still trash with cash. And G. Green's list of owners.... ALL TRASH. The biggest problem with America today is the loss of the class structure and lessening of personal values. Tats are not a sign of good breeeding. I don't care how much money you have. I see well off kids driving in the family Ferrari while listening to RAP and looking like Whiggers. Yes they will go on to get degrees and good incomes but they are classless. I have no problem with tats... but I would not get one. They are not a sign of one's independance or "wild side". They are only, like 58 year old men on Harley's, attempts to be what one is not. Pity we don't spend more time teaching our young that being like ghetto trash is not cool and having a sense of class structure and cluture is. Sadly... it is too late. | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5758 Registered: 5-2001 |
"In the bible God says "Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, which you have borrowed from God? You body is not your own; So glorify God in your body." 1 corinthians 6:19-20 " Besides the obvious that you are living by someting that was written down by a bunch of monks ONE THOUSAND THREE HUNDRED YEARS after it supposedly happened, this may as well be interpreted the other way. Glorify God in your Body. I guess if you get a Jesus tattoo you would just do that. Glorify him. Just as the Church is so lavishly decorated with gold and glitter stolen and beaten out of hard working people for thousands of years. Temples of glory to those that have beaten and killed in the name of the Lord! Amen! | ||
| Jonas Petersen (Karsten335)
Member Username: Karsten335 Post Number: 533 Registered: 11-2002 |
Useless discussion. It's up to yourself. If you want one, get one. If not, don't. Yes, it's actually that easy | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5757 Registered: 5-2001 |
Do you need commentary from a third party Thomas, I would love to contribute to your book. | ||
| Thomas I (Wax)
Junior Member Username: Wax Post Number: 122 Registered: 7-2003 |
Tattoo History from Royalty to Mutiny on the Bounty... http://www.tattoo.co.uk/history.htm Your necklace may break, the fau tree may burst, but my tattooing is indestructible. It is an everlasting gem that you will take into your grave. (Verse from a traditional tattoo artist's song) http://www.pbs.org/skinstories/history/ Go ahead - tell one of my Maori or Samoan friends they're lowlifes. Don't blink, because their reaction will be the last thing you'll ever see. NFL Players wouldn't stand a chance going toe-to-toe with these guys, either. I read my bible, and am writing a story based on Revelations which the bible says I'll go to hell for, since I'm not putting everything in, and I'm adding some things. (Revelations 22:19 If anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, may God take away his part from the tree of life, and out of the holy city, which are written in this book.) Big deal. I'll have all those who aired their moral superiority cloaked in condescension who were the reason I left the church so long ago to torment as my reward. You see, God doesn't want them either. I'll have plenty of company. If anyone thinks they can claim this, that and the other with such typical smug arrogance we've seen displayed here and be a "witness for Christ" - they're their own worst enemy and God's enemy at the same time. You want to convert some folks - better change your tone. But first, you have to change yourself before you'll change anybody's mind. Doesn't matter to me as Christianity is a myth, and I intend to profit from it. Only difference between me and all the Bible-thumping sheisters is I don't have a fake smile, bucks in the bank and/or a mistress on the side. No tattoos either. | ||
| Manu (Manu)
Member Username: Manu Post Number: 813 Registered: 2-2002 |
This is a great thread.... THIS is why I like this website soo much. P.S. I don't like tattoos - could not see myself EVER getting one.... PEACE. | ||
| Ermin Trevisan (Trevi)
Junior Member Username: Trevi Post Number: 76 Registered: 5-2003 |
rob, could you please establish a bible circle on ferrarichat in a separate room ;-) frank, i was thinking about getting a tattoo just because of your arguments....but finally i realized that i have only an entry level ferrari. trevi | ||
| N'din (Abangdin)
New member Username: Abangdin Post Number: 17 Registered: 7-2003 |
How aweful !! | ||
| Bert Kanters (Bert308)
Junior Member Username: Bert308 Post Number: 89 Registered: 11-2002 |
But would that still look good 20 years later?  | ||
| MarkPDX (Markpdx)
Member Username: Markpdx Post Number: 283 Registered: 4-2003 |
I'm not particularly fond of Women with tattoos and I find it rather bizzare that people will permanently ink corporate logos into their skin. Of course I will make exceptions... Are IN-N-OUT Burgers just a California thing?  | ||
| Jeff B. (Miltonian)
Member Username: Miltonian Post Number: 531 Registered: 12-2002 |
Anyone heard of the expression "Agree to Disagree"? Anyone have it tatoo'd on their bum? | ||
| Red (Redhead)
Member Username: Redhead Post Number: 310 Registered: 12-2001 |
Terry-- I agree 100% with you. And like the previous links, its shows it can start a conversation. This IMHO is not a deterent to the "Temple of Christ", but rather yet another way to express ones Christianty. This once again is MHO. | ||
| Terry Springer (Tspringer)
Member Username: Tspringer Post Number: 747 Registered: 4-2002 |
John... What if you got a tattoo of Christ on the cross with John 3:16 printed underneith? Do you eat any high fat food? Are you overweight at all? Do you exercise every day? If not.... oooops. I believe that text is more relative to what you do with your body, ie: actions you take with your body more than decoration or specific appearances. As long as a tattoo is not causing or related to an individuals separation from God, I see no problem. Its a matter of personal preference. I doubt I would ever get one mostly because I cant think of any image I would still want 50 years from now. That Cavallino Rampante done today would look like a dead and decaying dog when Im 70. Temporary Tattoos seem like much more fun. That way you have no long term commitment to it and you can do different images whenever you want. Someone should do a website where people can submit their own images and you mail them the temp tattoos for a price. | ||
| JohnR. (Rivee)
Member Username: Rivee Post Number: 262 Registered: 1-2002 |
I can see Frank's point here. Whenever I see a young, old, female, or male person with tatoos, I wonder about their integrity and their beliefs. Are they like sheep following the one in front of them? It appears so. Do they get tatooed because everyone else is? What is so wonderful about them? Does it show you can withstand the pain? We shouldn't scar ourselves for anyone. In the bible God says "Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, which you have borrowed from God? You body is not your own; So glorify God in your body." 1 corinthians 6:19-20 This is one of the reasons I don't. Wrong or right it's my belief. | ||
| Dave (Maranelloman)
Advanced Member Username: Maranelloman Post Number: 2640 Registered: 1-2002 |
Maybe Frank had a "special" relationship with a sailor in his past that embarasses him...  | ||
| Tim N (Timn88)
Advanced Member Username: Timn88 Post Number: 3348 Registered: 6-2001 |
I still dont see why frank is so worked up about tattoos. Sometimes, not all the time though, the tattoos have special meanings to the people who get them. | ||
| rob guess (Beast)
Junior Member Username: Beast Post Number: 196 Registered: 5-2003 |
If i looked down on people because they have a tattoo, i would have to make judgements on 95% of my students. The key thing to point out here is that you cannot judge a book by it cover. Take a look at these pictures of myself from when i raced.  Does this make me a devil worshiper???  Does this one make me a pervert??? The truth of the matter is a good friend bet myself that i did not have the attachments to race with those #'s. I proved him wrong and lightened his wallet in the process. | ||
| Randall (Randall)
Member Username: Randall Post Number: 626 Registered: 1-2003 |
Tee hee hee...... You's guys are so funny. | ||
| Red (Redhead)
Member Username: Redhead Post Number: 309 Registered: 12-2001 |
http://christianteens.about.com/library/weekly/aa010501a.htm http://christianteens.about.com/library/weekly/aa010501b.htm Frank, I shared a lot of the same beliefs as you. Shared is a KEY word. I do not look down on people because they have a tattoo. Who are you or I to judge someones charecter or life based on a tatoo. Read the above article that I found doing a brief google search and learn that even youth pastors have tattoos. Is that a church you would go to? The church I used to visit in HS, the pastor had a fish tattoo and rode a Harley. Used to preach in Jeans and a white T-shirt with a black leather vest. They had to expand to 4 services, one on Saturday night, he was so popular. Who are you to judge. And btw, at 26 y/o, I have probally driven more Ferrari, Bentleys,Lotus's and RR's then most on this board, and even have flown the Goodyear blimp. But do I mention it..do I try and make other feel inferoir sp?then me...NO. But, I have an insight and I use MY personal knowledge to assist others. | ||
| Tyler (Bahiaau)
Member Username: Bahiaau Post Number: 965 Registered: 12-2001 |
"I would really like a survey of the FC posters that have tattoos AND own Ferraris." Frank, I don't have a tatoo so I can't help you there. I don't really know what your survey would show? If you are trying to establish a link between material wealth and tatoos I don't think that type and year of Ferrari owned would be a good place to start. The richest people I know don't own Ferraris and they have no desire too. I, just like you, firmly believe in paying CASH for toys. Many owners have different beliefs for different reasons. Personally I could not care less about how someone manages their money. Until I can write checks out of their account it doesn't matter. Same goes for tatoos. It's not on MY body so I don't really care. One of the supposed hallmarks of christianity is the willingness to forgive others and to let God be the judge. Why is it that some of the most rabid "christians" don't seem to follow any of those things? | ||
| G. Green (Mr_green)
Junior Member Username: Mr_green Post Number: 107 Registered: 8-2003 |
And you wonder why somebody would key a Ferrari! | ||
| Hubert Otlik (Hugh)
Intermediate Member Username: Hugh Post Number: 1258 Registered: 1-2002 |
Frank, I don't feel inferior (to you), but thanks for taking the time to point that possibility out. It only underscores what type of person you really are. | ||
| Frank Parker (Parkerfe)
Advanced Member Username: Parkerfe Post Number: 2840 Registered: 9-2001 |
Wm Hart, I acknowledge that tattoos have became more mainstream. But, that still doesn't mean it's good to get one. That's a similar argument I have heard from my children " Jamie saw that PG13 movie so why can't I " . Good judgement is not determined by how many execise it . I suspect there are more examples of poor judgement out there than good, wouldn't you ? As far as lawyers are concerned, I know of some that have tattoos. I think they exercised poor judgement by getting them too. Hey, I don't discriminate. And Hubert, I would really like a survey of the FC posters that have tattoos AND own Ferraris. FYI, I currently own a 21 year old Boxer myself and have owned two entry level Dinos, a 328 and a 348. Just because my comments may have made you feel inferior doesn't mean I think you are. By the way, my son-in-law has a tattoo and I think he was stupid to get it, and I told him that to his face .Lighten up guys ! | ||
| Alan Leach (Speedy308)
New member Username: Speedy308 Post Number: 48 Registered: 12-2002 |
The problem with them is the police catalog them on your arrest report. Can you imagine "Look for the speeding yellow Ferrari with the driver with a Prancing Horse on the right forearm!!" Luckily, my reports started before I was old enough to get in a parlor!! LOL. And then of course there's Hep C. Watching a cute girl die from that right now. I'd go temporary, if I was you. | ||
| Tom Bakowsky (Tbakowsky)
Member Username: Tbakowsky Post Number: 541 Registered: 9-2002 |
Frank..Who gives a flying •••• if sombody has a tatoo or not?? Why are you so stuck in judging people by the amount of money they have and what kind of Ferrari they have!! Maybe some people have abrain in their head and CHOOSE to drive an "entry level" Ferrari beacuse they don't want to be taken advantage of by Dealers and or shops. Maybe that person that owns that 308 or whatever has tatoos, drinks beer,farts,stinks up the washroom worse then an elephant could, has more money then you would ever see in your life!! You are sounding like the snobby Ferrari owner almost everybody on this sight hates!! Don't judge people by what they have Frank..judge them by who they are. Money is only good to buy stuff with. You could be the richest person in the world and be very sad. Just look at the Dupont family,look at all the mega rich stars who are •••••• up because they don't have any real friendships and they know it!! Why do you think it's so hard for these people to find sombody to care about? Because they know most people judge them and want to be with them only because of their position in life. The guy with the tatoo and the entry level Ferrari more than likly has more sense then you will ever have,because he's not scared to be who he is know matter what people expect him to be. Frank your comming across as a complete ballwasher | ||
| G. Green (Mr_green)
Junior Member Username: Mr_green Post Number: 106 Registered: 8-2003 |
Frank, Ferrari owners past and present who have tattoes. (These are the one's I know of I'm sure there is alot more) Dr.Dre- 360 Spider Ice T- 360 Spider David Coverdale- 308 Tommy Lee- Testarossa Axl Rose- Murcielago (I know it's a Lambo) Sammy Hagar- Boxer Vince Neil- mondial cab Ritchie Blackmore- Daytona Cher- mondial cab Jessie James- 360 coupe | ||
| Racer Nika (Racernika)
New member Username: Racernika Post Number: 41 Registered: 7-2003 |
Frank - I don't think you SEE the point here. It's not an issue for or against tattoos. I personally HATE them... I do not nor will I ever GET one. BUT I will not now or ever judge a person by markings on their skin. In my *few* years of Ferrari ownership I couldn't care less who had one and who didn't BUT I can say that a very important Wall Street Banker has a tattoo (his wife told me...I didn't ask to see) and one of my friends who collects Ferraris - has about a million dollars worth of F-cars in his stable - well he just told me of his second tattoo ....in a business suit you couldn't tell. So unless you've seen club members nude......I would not be so quick to judge if they do or do not have ink. It's a personal choice - and for some young people a very stupid choice but at no time does it take away from a persons moral being or lessen them....unless ofcourse the person judging is so shallow that appearance is more important than soul | ||
| wm hart (Whart)
Intermediate Member Username: Whart Post Number: 1588 Registered: 12-2001 |
Frank: you are totally out of touch. Tatoos are no longer confined to sailors, ex-cons and hardbitten types. While i am not among their number, the Gen X,Y and Z's find them much more acceptable than you do. So, just to remind you, in case you forget, not everybody will fit into your definitions of what is acceptable, yet somehow, they have meaningful lives too. (Or, as a senior lawyer once told me when i was just a kid lawyer, don't think you are any different than the guy that comes to fix the plumbing; he reads the same books, has the same fancy appliances in his kitchen and goes on just as nice a vacation as you do, and believe it or not, he does not have a law degree and may not have even finished college. My senior didn't mention that he might also be sporting a tattoo). | ||
| Hubert Otlik (Hugh)
Intermediate Member Username: Hugh Post Number: 1256 Registered: 1-2002 |
Frank, if your intention was simply to purvey that: tattoos were beyond your depth of percieved "good judgment" then you should have left it at that. Your tangent comments were pure sterotypically driven rhetoric. And, the "story" was my own. No biblical inspiration on my end. But, there is one point I'd like to address, it's this. YOu say: >>I never meant to imply that I thought I was superior to anyone else because I don't have a tattoo.<< But, then you go on to say: >>I would like to know how many tattoo bearers are Ferrari "owners" rather than just Ferrari fans, and how many of those Ferrari owners(few I suspect) own older entry level V8 cars and how many own either later model V8 or V12 cars ?<< Here AGAIN you're tying a persons "moral" worth , to what YOU percieve to be their fiscal worth; i.e., the lowlevel ferrari owners can be discredited by the fact that they're not aristocrats (since they don't own NEW v12 f cars), and can't possibly be equivelant in your scheme of what "class" is. It's this sort of hypocritcial commentary that makes me question what you REALLY think, Frank. | ||
| Frank Parker (Parkerfe)
Advanced Member Username: Parkerfe Post Number: 2839 Registered: 9-2001 |
Hubert,the original story comes from the Bible. It says something like don't point out the splinter in your brother's eye when you have a tree in your own. I must say I am surprised by the comments on this subject. I never would have imagined that so many in the Ferrari community would be so favorable to tattoos. In my 15 years or so of Ferrari ownership and attendance at many FCA and other events, I can count the Ferrari owners on one hand that had a "visible" tattoo. And those were people that had it done while in the military or when they were too young to know better. I would like to know how many tattoo bearers are Ferrari "owners" rather than just Ferrari fans, and how many of those Ferrari owners(few I suspect) own older entry level V8 cars and how many own either later model V8 or V12 cars ? Even you tattoo lovers out there have to admit that tattoos are not normally associated with the base that normally buys a Ferrari. I never meant to imply that I thought I was superior to anyone else because I don't have a tattoo. I only wished to state my opinion that I believe it is an exercise of poor judgement to get one. And from the scars on the many clients I have seen over the years from having tattoos removed, I can state that there are a lot of former tattoo bearers out there that feel the same. | ||
| sindo rodil (308qv_miami)
Junior Member Username: 308qv_miami Post Number: 87 Registered: 5-2003 |
guys really all you need to lighten up, this is the reason several of the ferrari clubs aren't doing so well because of all this petty s--t! Lets enjoy our F cars and it's diverse members recardless of social status, tattoos etc.. And by the way there's an excellent tattoo place in Ft.lauderdale called Stevie Moon, the artist name is Audie and aside from all tattoos, his passion is for ferrari related ones. You really have to drop by and see these whether or not your're getting one, they're amazing.I'm considering getting one on my shoulder,have to think it over. | ||
| Hubert Otlik (Hugh)
Intermediate Member Username: Hugh Post Number: 1255 Registered: 1-2002 |
The Modern Hypocrite. A short story. Mr. H. goes to church on sundays, but beats his wife and child monday through saturday. Manages to bang a couple hookers on the side, and snort a few lines of coke in the company bathroom (but is clean as a whistle otherwise... oh, aside from the 12 pack he slings down every night, and the 1/5 that he's got in his desk). Mr. H sings the praises of his own morality (while he's raping his daughter... c'mon, be a good girl) , curses the abomination that the world's becomes (while he's burying the dead hooker in swamp behind his house, and photographing his neighbors wife changing), and yet stares at everyone elses feet while standing in his own pile of bullsh!t. The End. | ||
| Il Commenadatore (Ilcommenadatore)
New member Username: Ilcommenadatore Post Number: 27 Registered: 8-2003 |
x | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5752 Registered: 5-2001 |
 LOL he said the A-word | ||
| G. Green (Mr_green)
Junior Member Username: Mr_green Post Number: 103 Registered: 8-2003 |
Frank, When I get the bill from my attorney I feel like I have the words "sucker" tattoed on my forehead! | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5751 Registered: 5-2001 |
Ryan, I must admit you are right about what you are saying. This conduct though is also wrong! It is those that conform to meet these social standards that sell out to their own inner peace. I have been a rebel in school and had the punk hair and the punk outfit, wore my jeans inside out and all it did for me was define who I am today. I do not dress up for a social affair. I do not own a tux neither would I wear one. I do not own a tie neither would I wear one. It did not change my success in life neither did it hold me from great job opportunities. My clients apprechiate it because they judge me on the basis of my performance. Most of my clients in the real estate investment side have made 400% profit in 3-5 years on their investment. Some (just sold the property today) have made 600%+. And all of that in Jeans and T-shirt. It is the person and the conduct of the person no matter what he/she looks like. As I said though, I agree with you that is the way it is currently unless we all work on changing that. Statements like Tattoos are for losers don't make that happen. As I said Non-Enzo owners are losers! | ||
| Ryan Alexander (Ryalex)
New member Username: Ryalex Post Number: 30 Registered: 8-2003 |
Whether it's right or it's wrong is obviously very subjective. What's true though, is that some people WILL judge people with tattoos. Depending on lifestyle and career choice, certain social groups will frown on them. For example, I can't seeing them being widely accepted among the investment banker, country club, or politician set. This does not make those people bad, either. But they have social standards that define their acceptable conduct. I understand Frank's argument. Without making a personal call on tattoos, I will say I disagree with the statement made that what's on the outside doesn't matter nor affect the inside. Voluntary deformation, excessive piercing, extreme/shocking hairstyles, poor hygiene, etc. are blatant indicators that someone has issues. That's not to say I didn't have "punk" acquaintences in high school (pink/blue hair/piercings et al) that weren't nice or good people - but they did have serious personal/family/stability issues that led to such behavior. Their seeing their own appearance will reaffirm the person's self-evaluation. If you don't agree, I suggest an experiment: try not shaving, brushing teeth, combing hair, clipping nails, using deodorant, changing your clothes, wearing makeup (for women),etc. for a week or two. Note your demeanor and feelings about yourself. Then shave, wash, clean up, comb up, dress in clean clothes, and freshen up your appearance and see how you feel about yourself. That said, John's Ferrari tattoo is not the end of the world. | ||
| John M.Pisacane (Chazferrari)
New member Username: Chazferrari Post Number: 20 Registered: 8-2003 |
GUY's Guy's let it go...sheeesh ~Chaz~ | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5746 Registered: 5-2001 |
If you don't buy an Enzo you are a loser! | ||
| DES (Sickspeed)
Senior Member Username: Sickspeed Post Number: 5765 Registered: 8-2002 |
Jack - not only is that totally effing funny, but it's probably the most logical point anyone's made here, yet...! You know how your eyes get just before you cry...? Kinda teary and hazy in a way...? That's how mine are right now, 'cause of how hard i was just laughing... | ||
| Jack (Gilles27)
Intermediate Member Username: Gilles27 Post Number: 1330 Registered: 3-2002 |
Now, Frank, you are a licensed NFL agent. How many of your clients have tattoos? I'll bet those without are in the minority. Do you consider those with ink to be losers, and if so, do you let them know how you feel? Or do you only retain tattoo-free talent? | ||
| Kds (Kds)
Junior Member Username: Kds Post Number: 118 Registered: 5-2003 |
One of the mechanics at the MB dealership where I worked had the 3 pointed star tattoed on the back of his calf....about 3" in diameter in fact. He now works at BMW.............I haven't seen him since he started there and if I did I'd love to ask the obvious question. | ||
| Tyler (Bahiaau)
Member Username: Bahiaau Post Number: 963 Registered: 12-2001 |
Frank, normally I enjoy your hard-edged comments(damn I miss Ed Gault!) but I think you are a little off here. I don't have a tatoo, but I don't think ANYTHING that affects your outward appearance changes who you are on the inside. I'm glad that you have armed yourself with a formidible education, but don't assume that those without advanced degrees cannot achieve. I don't have a college degree but I seem to have gotten by reasonably well. | ||
| wm hart (Whart)
Intermediate Member Username: Whart Post Number: 1586 Registered: 12-2001 |
I dunno Frank. I try to accord respect to everybody here, unless they are truly off the wall. Personally, i'm not gonna get a tattoo, but i don't equate someone having one with being a total loser. As to the Jewish prediliction against them, i thought it was not just religious, but also a reaction against the concentration camp tatooing of numbers on flesh. As to virtue, or worthiness, i think you already know that all the degrees and material possessions in the world won't make a difference when you get to your reward. So, why should the fact that somebody had a bad haircut, or questionable (in your view) taste in personal accessorizing hurt their chances in the spiritual realm? | ||
| Bill Sawyer (Wsawyer)
Member Username: Wsawyer Post Number: 899 Registered: 2-2002 |
Here's my favorite Tatoo:  | ||
| DES (Sickspeed)
Senior Member Username: Sickspeed Post Number: 5764 Registered: 8-2002 |
Damn... Don't you hate it when "chicks" rip into you like that...? | ||
| will h (Willh)
Junior Member Username: Willh Post Number: 185 Registered: 3-2003 |
"I got "360 Modena" tattooed on my arm" The earlier 360 tattoos were plagued by expensive to resolve problems. When did you get yours? I guess it doesn't really matter - I hear that resale prices have taken a dive, so you might as well hang in there with it. See: http://www.ferrarichat.com/discus/messages/21/303474.html?1061227537 I've had a velcro backing strip sewn into my arm, so that I can easily switch marque & model allegiances. | ||
| MarkPDX (Markpdx)
Member Username: Markpdx Post Number: 276 Registered: 4-2003 |
Looking for advice. I got "360 Modena" tattooed on my arm but now I keep hearing that Ferrari is going to replace it with a 420. What should I do? | ||
| Racer Nika (Racernika)
New member Username: Racernika Post Number: 40 Registered: 7-2003 |
Frank - you are not illiterate are you? - to read the meaning of my post. I fail to see where I became I liar..... What I do see is a hypocrite � you hide behind your God, licenses, degrees and almighty attitude but fail to see the basics of what true faith and religion is based on � compassion, kindness and humbleness. I don�t want to go back and re-live theology class but even Jesus himself � if I remember correctly washed the feet of the common man. But this isn�t about religion � it�s about attitude. Your slam of a tattoo artist as being a lowlife � what is the base of that opinion? Just because they paint on skin not canvas � does that career automatically make him a person without character? It�s THAT kind of close-mindedness �.your cheap shots at my character�that makes me pity you. Judge yourself before you judge others Frank � don�t hide behind your Sunday confessions � be a better person in the days in between. Modesty, kindness and acceptance of others will get through your pearly gates Frank � not a stack of papers. And the next time you look in the mirror � take a closer look at the er�man that stands before you � with your attitude I find it hard to believe that you are respected at all. | ||
| will h (Willh)
Junior Member Username: Willh Post Number: 184 Registered: 3-2003 |
"Willh, I knew a fellow in the Navy that tattooed his wife's name on his arm. It was great until after the divorce." Frank, no divorce for me, but speaking hypothetically, I guess I would try hard to persuade any future Sally, Jane or Danica that my pet name for her is "Mary." | ||
| Jim E (Jimpo1)
Intermediate Member Username: Jimpo1 Post Number: 2358 Registered: 7-2001 |
Remember when we used to come to this site to talk about Ferraris? Now it always gets to some kind of charachter debate. None of you are right, none of you are wrong, and your opinions won't be shared by all. Lighten up. | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5745 Registered: 5-2001 |
Gheez Frank on this one you are WAY off base! I mean WWWWWWWWAAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYYYYY | ||
| DES (Sickspeed)
Senior Member Username: Sickspeed Post Number: 5763 Registered: 8-2002 |
Frank, it was sarcasm; you're so rich in licenses and recorded education and so poor in common sense and character. You need a doctorate in having a personality; get a license to not be such a prick... "i wonder about a person's judgment when i see abrasive statements like Frank's." | ||
| Frank Parker (Parkerfe)
Advanced Member Username: Parkerfe Post Number: 2838 Registered: 9-2001 |
DES, she said it, not me. I assumed she would tell the truth in what she posted. How was I to know she was lying when she made the statement about what she thought would get you far at heaven's gates. Bruce, I too know a lot of people who are very successful who never went to college. There are exceptions to everything. Willh, I knew a fellow in the Navy that tattooed his wife's name on his arm. It was great until after the divorce. And Nika, I have already earned the respect of many others that are significate in my life. You and DES are not them. |