| Author | Message | ||
| Ben Cannon (Artherd)
Intermediate Member Username: Artherd Post Number: 1037 Registered: 6-2002 |
Andy- the Mondy is rather forgiving, but don't forget there is a lot of mass out there. Get it in a parking lot, and get it our of control (spin!) then get it to the edge, and get to where you are comfortable getting the car BACK under control. Don't leave the parking lot untill you master this! You will be a MUCH safer driver afterwords knowing the limits of both man and machine! Best! Ben. | ||
| Andy Barre (Abarre)
Junior Member Username: Abarre Post Number: 82 Registered: 7-2003 |
I have never had the fortune to drive my Mondial on a track. As such, I've always been afraid to push the car too hard for fear of spinning it on a public road. Has anyone here driven a Mondial 3.2 cab near or at the limits? What happens when you start crossing the line? | ||
| Mitch Alsup (Mitch_alsup)
Intermediate Member Username: Mitch_alsup Post Number: 1164 Registered: 4-2002 |
"Would you agree that a torquey V12 (550) would be easier to explore power oversteer than a mid-engined V8 (355) ? " I don't know. My Vette was grip, grip, grip, snap spin. My F355 is grip, grip with warning, slip with warning, slide with control. I think it comes down to suspension geometry. F355s have a much better rear end geometry than 512TRs because the suspension forces are directed at the contact patch in the F355 and towards the inside edge of the tire on the TRs. When power is inserted or withdrawn from the F355, the toe of the rear is not changed by the force on the contact patch. The TR is different. Earlier in this thread William H indicates that the dance between US and OS is delicate and abrupt in a TR. I find a large play ground in the F355. I put this on the suspension geometry (hub attachment points). So, back to the quesiton at hand, the TQ of the mighty 575 would make getting into an oversteering situation easier, controlling it might be a different ball of wax (I don't know). However, in the right part of the rev band, the F355 engine has sufficient thrust to allow power oversteer well into the 120 MPH range (4th). A modern M3 will have a computer fighting your ability to induce and use power oversteer. Its called stability management! | ||
| Ze Shark (Ze_shark)
New member Username: Ze_shark Post Number: 42 Registered: 7-2003 |
Would you agree that a torquey V12 (550) would be easier to explore power oversteer than a mid-engined V8 (355) ? On the 355, I have experienced mild lift off-oversteer and progressive power oversteer when the rear tires were dead, but otherwise there's just too much grip. Mitch - I am more looking for the fun factor than sheer efficiency. Maybe I should buy an M3 and practice ... | ||
| Mitch Alsup (Mitch_alsup)
Intermediate Member Username: Mitch_alsup Post Number: 1158 Registered: 4-2002 |
I find myself in the position of A) wanting everybody to understand how to induce and control power oversteer in these cars, and B) not wanting people to attempt to develop this skill on public roads. Power oversteer is FUN, it is also dangerous. One can alter the setup of cars (with adjustible spring perches) so that power oversteer is easy to induce (raise rear) or rather difficult to induce (lower rear). Air pressure also plays a minor part. However, power oversteer is SLOW. A fast line is one where you are dancing with the car between dead neutral and just a touch of oversteer. Any more oversteer and you are loosing time getting off the apex, because the oversteer is directing some of the power to keep you on the road rather than accelerating you down the track. I like my car setup so that in a midsized, flat 180d turn (like the carosell at TWS): the car is balanced at a point where backing off on the throttle induces throttle off oversteer, and power induces power on oversteer. I use power (both more and less) to control the car and choose the exit point on this turn. But the acceleration vector is decidely neutral. | ||
| Brian Kennedy (Kennedy)
Member Username: Kennedy Post Number: 425 Registered: 3-2002 |
Well, I've got 4-wheel drift down pretty well (which is generally faster around a corner than power oversteer). However, there's a pair of corners at one track that I am working on taking with trailing oversteer (corner 1) and power oversteer (corner 2), in both cases trying to rotate the car quickly so that I can get back on the gas sooner. Autocross has more need for that than tracks typically do, but its hard to get enough runs on a particular autocross course to really master that like you can on a track. If you're goal is pictures/videos, find a big open parking lot... set up some cones so you have something to aim at so that you actually learn from each attempt... and then experiment. Just keep in mind that you may run through your rear tires... so, better if they are cheap... and if you have a choice of asphalt or concrete parking lot, go for asphalt... and preferably sealed (which can make the surface quite slick). | ||
| William H (Countachxx)
Advanced Member Username: Countachxx Post Number: 3273 Registered: 2-2001 |
the 308 QV is such a beautifully handling car, I used to slide her all along Big Bend at Lime Rock. The 512TR is a big brute, it snaps from understeer to oversteer extremely quickly & she doesnt like bumbs so you have to find the right place 7 do it very carefully. Then again she was awesome at the chicane at Watkins Glen where i used to throw he in sideways at 110 mph  | ||
| Ze Shark (Ze_shark)
New member Username: Ze_shark Post Number: 37 Registered: 7-2003 |
Wondering how many of you have managed to master the art of power oversteer and achieve nice slides with your cavallinos. Pictures or videos would be great ! |