| Author |
Message |
Modified348ts (Modman)
Member
Username: Modman
Post Number: 289
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Friday, August 30, 2002 - 12:07 am: | |
Wow it seems that they have accumulated millions of deposits to afford a showroom with peoples cars as deposits too as they tried to get me to sign over my car to them before going any further but that was going to far. These guys have way too much money to worry about, the deposits they collected are gaining great interest in their separate accounts. Is it possible that selling cars on consignment make more money than a direct dealership? with this company I find it hard to believe except by robbing money from potential buyers. This world don't need these kind of people and therefore I'm with Jim. I'm glad this site exits and I believe from this board we will be able to help others to not get scammed or purchase a car from them. By their wrong doing they will pay a lot more than what they gained from robbing people. For everyone who help spread the word out of this place thank you for as you are doing the right thing. |
Jim Schad (Jim_schad)
Junior Member
Username: Jim_schad
Post Number: 132
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, August 29, 2002 - 10:05 am: | |
I am not advocating violence, but how do these guys avoid getting their asses beaten? I mean you don't know who you are taking money from. I know some people who would go back with a baseball bat if they stole their deposits. They may not get their deposit back, but rest assured the scammers would be out of biz pronto. Think Joe Pesci in Casino.... |
Mark (Study)
Member
Username: Study
Post Number: 300
Registered: 10-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, August 29, 2002 - 9:45 am: | |
They have found the perfect con.
List a dream car at $30k less then the market and tell buyers that it is a perfect car. Now, tell everyone that calls in to give them $5k or the car will be gone tomorrow.
They must get 10 or more people on every add they list in AutoWeek... or Ebay.
I would just like to say Shame on any car magazine that will run their ad! (Auto-Week, DuPont) I have a lot of respect for them but they are helping to commite this scam if they do business with Exotic Cars Wholesale. |
Randy (Schatten)
Member
Username: Schatten
Post Number: 372
Registered: 4-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, August 29, 2002 - 9:34 am: | |
take note - they are also selling a few cars on ebay too!
http://cgi6.ebay.com/ebaymotors/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewSellersOtherItems&userid=360f1&completed=0&sort=0&since=-1&include=0&page=1&rows=25
is this the same company? |
Modified348ts (Modman)
Member
Username: Modman
Post Number: 287
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, August 29, 2002 - 12:38 am: | |
The two people I dealt with is Vince, and the owner I believe Richard. They both ignored my calls and messages knowing it was me, then I had a friend call in for a car and instantly they both are readily available for taking your money. They are born crooks, Vince tried to sell a car to me outside of the business so he could get all the commision for himself and turns out the car he found for me was a piece of *hit that was painted by spray can on the lower part of the car and it wasted my day of travel time and money. If we can get the word out as much as possible about these crooks it would be my pleasure to see these guys go to prison or the least go out of business permanently. |
Dr Tommy Cosgrove (Vwalfa4re)
Junior Member
Username: Vwalfa4re
Post Number: 250
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 9:31 pm: | |
What about the chassis # thing??
Isn't something fraudulent here as well? |
Howie F. (Brokerofexotics)
Junior Member
Username: Brokerofexotics
Post Number: 166
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 12:41 pm: | |
Martin,
Not all bad dealers are not in Florida. I have come across ones in CA, TX, NJ and more as well. I will in no way do business with any of these dealers. As a matter of fact, I have my "Black List of Dealers" sitting on my desk at all times.
(Some of the names may suprise you).
As a broker, sometimes it is necessary to request a deposit, but I do keep that up to the customer. For example, if a client in NY is very interested in a car in CA, and wishes a pre - purchase inspection, needs time to get financing together, etc., a deposit (yes, refundable!) temporarily takes the car off the market.
I have returned deposits, and believe it or not, the benefits of being true to your word significantly outweigh the quick buck. 9 time out of 10 after returning a deposit, I now have a customer that wishes for me to continue searching for that special car, and/or refers family, friends and associates.
Modman, I wish you luck. May I ask who you dealt with at ECW?
|
Martin (Miami348ts)
Advanced Member
Username: Miami348ts
Post Number: 2682
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 10:26 am: | |
brabling,
what I wanted to say is, you have to be a little on the cautious side. Why send them a deposit? What for? If it starts smelling is likely is foul.
And we all remember Chris Sawyerr... |
Martin (Miami348ts)
Advanced Member
Username: Miami348ts
Post Number: 2681
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 10:21 am: | |
Let me say one thing that is kind of misunderstood.
Having no showroom is not necessarily a bad thing. I don't have one, I have a warehouse where I keep stock cars. All of the other cars are clearly maked on the website as "consignment " cars. Although I had several local owners offer me to bring their cars to my "showroom" on consignment I told them flat out, we do not take them. If we have a buyer we will get in contact with them and arrange the meeting between them.
I am sure Exotic Car World has a lot of consignment cars, possibly the only way how to run this business somewhat effectively. Surely makes good looks and from what we all know on Exotic Car World they are one of the good guys in this business. But then we also know that a showroom does not guarantee anything. I am thinking about the New Auto Toystore, just as an example.
Why are most of the bad dealers in these cars in Florida?
Florida is a export driven market. Most of them end up in export or with local newly rich that do not care if the car has been crashed before and is marked as "Bondo by Enzo". |
arthur chambers (Art355)
Member
Username: Art355
Post Number: 616
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 10:20 am: | |
Modman:
You don't have to go to Florida to get them. Sue them in Federal Court. Tell your counsel that they have sufficient contacts with the State of California to provide jurisdiction, use the people on this chat for proof of same: they advertise here, they solicit here, and they will (allegedly deliver here). Since they committed a fraud on you, you can claim over 75k in damages, thus providing for federal jurisdiction. I bet once they are served you will get your money back.
Just my thoughts.
Art |
Fred (Iluv4res)
Junior Member
Username: Iluv4res
Post Number: 71
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 8:54 am: | |
Yes, they do have a location/showroom in Pompano Beach, FL. |
Fred (Iluv4res)
Junior Member
Username: Iluv4res
Post Number: 70
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 8:53 am: | |
I dug aroung a bit....The department that regulates automobile dealers is the DMV of Florida.
The office that would handle ECW is located in Plantation, Florida. The site link as well as the information is below. Scroll down to DMV district offices-other motor vehicle services. You have to go through a maze to speak with a person.
Each person would need to file a comlplaint. They will send you the forms.
http://www.hsmv.state.fl.us/offices/broward.html
DMV District Offices - Other Motor Vehicle Services
Dealer licenses, complaints and investigations of dealers
Rebuilt inspections City Street Address Phone Number Office Hours
Plantation 4450 W. Sunrise Blvd., Bldg C-109 33313-
Map to location (954) 797-8436
Pass this around to all the other chat boards,etc... Hopefully, if enough people complain, they will loose their license.
|
Howie F. (Brokerofexotics)
Junior Member
Username: Brokerofexotics
Post Number: 165
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 8:52 am: | |
FYI: I just heard through the grapevine that ECW now has a showroom in Pompano Beach, FL. |
Fred (Iluv4res)
Junior Member
Username: Iluv4res
Post Number: 69
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 8:28 am: | |
FYI... Attorney General, FCC, BBB and other governmental agency complaints are usually not going to hurt the business.
The typical chain of events are that once a complaint is filed, a letter is sent to the business. The business must respond to the letter, but unless an unusually large number of letters are unanswered and/or an unusually large number of complaints are not resolved, there's not much that they do. They are like every other gvt. agency. Too much to do, not enough staff, staff doesn't really care too much.
The best way to hurt them is to speak with the States Atty's office if they have committed fraud and/or any other criminal action. If enough people can convince action, there will be criminal charges filed and possibly get some restitution.
Next best, I'm sure that there are rules and regulations regarding the ownership of a automobile dealer's license. If everyone complained to the Florida division of business and professional regulation or whoever handles automobile dealer's licenses for Florida, they could loose their dealer's license.
Another way is to contact the local news station and try to ruin their local reputation, without getting yourself in trouble for slander/libel.
Lastly, is to sue them in civil court. If enough people have had issues with them, you may be able to get a judgement against them. Weather you will ever collect on the judgement is another story, however.
From all of the posts, it's clear that they do not return deposits despite their indication that it is fully refundable.
They have some cars on e-bay right now. Perhaps there's a way to warn others. |
BobD (Bobd)
Member
Username: Bobd
Post Number: 597
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 8:23 am: | |
William, pretty interesting post on the NSX board... ECW tells you they have the exact car you're looking for, then takes your $5000 deposit and attempts to go find one for you. Wow. Yep, I'd stay far away from these guys. |
William Huber (Solipsist)
Member
Username: Solipsist
Post Number: 336
Registered: 9-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 7:27 am: | |
Here's something I found on NSXprime about ECW
http://www.nsxprime.com/FAQ/Reference/dealers_and_service/exoticcarwholesale.htm |
Modified348ts (Modman)
Member
Username: Modman
Post Number: 285
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 28, 2002 - 2:55 am: | |
I am also a BBB member and had made a complaint with those bastard lying thieves of Exotic cars wholesale in Ft. Lauderdale but they can only do so much as a letter written to them and that's it. That **shole owner wrote a letter back to BBB saying that I shouldn't get my deposit back for wasting their time? those **sholes wasted my time for not finding the car I was looking for. After 3 months later I gave up with those lying thieves and bought a car elsewhere then what do you know?, they get all pissy that I did that and decided to keep my deposit. A contract was made in writing and signed by them that if we didn't come to an agreement of price of purchase I would get my deposit back, well that didn't happen. I would be more pleased that they be put out of business permanently and it would do potential car buyers a huge favor to not loose money or waste their time with them. |
Dr Tommy Cosgrove (Vwalfa4re)
Junior Member
Username: Vwalfa4re
Post Number: 238
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 8:52 pm: | |
Does anybody know why they say their 1983 308 is chassis #79033?
There is no such thing. |
Rob Lay (Rob328gts)
Board Administrator
Username: Rob328gts
Post Number: 1991
Registered: 12-2000
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 12:10 pm: | |
I'm glad Mike was able to post about "Exotic Car World". There is no relation at all except the acronym. Exotic Car World in Dallas is very reputable and also a valuable sponsor of FerrariChat.com. |
Frank Parker (Parkerfe)
Intermediate Member
Username: Parkerfe
Post Number: 1259
Registered: 9-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 11:26 am: | |
Just when did being "screwed" become a bad thing ? |
Michael E. Weaver (Exoticcarworld)
New member
Username: Exoticcarworld
Post Number: 2
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 11:21 am: | |
To the best of my knowledge "Exotic Car Country Club" is another business created by Richard Wiesman the owner of "Exotic Car Wholesale". |
D B (Threesixty)
New member
Username: Threesixty
Post Number: 38
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 10:54 am: | |
Did anyone else notice the plaque on the wall in their "showroom" in the one pic in that auction? It said "Exotic Car Country Club"...maybe the same as www.ec-cc.com ? Maybe that's where they get their cars from? Just a thought..... |
Michael E. Weaver (Exoticcarworld)
New member
Username: Exoticcarworld
Post Number: 1
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 10:30 am: | |
Hi all, I'm Mike Weaver the owner of "Exotic Car World" in Irving. I too have my own experiences with Exotic Car Wholesale and they were less than pleasent. I may be able to help with this thread. We are members of the Better Business Bureau and I have recently been personally nominated for the board of directors of the Better Business Bureau. The BBB is the cheapest way to effect change on a business' actions. It is my recommendation that anyone that has been unfairly treated (not just unhappy or should have done more research on your own) but truly unfairly treated contact the BBB and register a complaint. This agency is not the end all do all, but it is a good place to notify others of a companies unscrupulous actions. Speaking personally, I built "Exotic Car World" because of a passion for cars, but also because I was ripped off by a couple of nameless dealers in Florida and I wanted to build a place that people can trust. The Robb Report picked up on this and did a nice spread on us and posted it off their home page at http://www.RobbReport.com Look for our picture on the upper right corner. BTW, the Exotic Car World girls are wanting another Ferrari gathering!!!! Any takers??? |
Don Norton (Litig8r)
Junior Member
Username: Litig8r
Post Number: 105
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 7:47 am: | |
I'd suggest running it by the State's Attorneys Office in the county where they have their business office. Same goes for Chris Sawyerr. If you can get them interested, they'll do the whole thing for free. And they of course have unlimited assets.
I used to represent some car dealers and I can tell you that there are few things that Judges and law enforcement people hate more than car dealers. |
Dr Tommy Cosgrove (Vwalfa4re)
Junior Member
Username: Vwalfa4re
Post Number: 237
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 7:12 am: | |
Has anyone seen their new 308 for sale?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1854435448
1983 308 with a chassis # 79033. Am I the only one that thinks there is a little problem here? |
Martin (Miami348ts)
Advanced Member
Username: Miami348ts
Post Number: 2672
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 3:44 am: | |
The way I see it is more of the revenge point. If it costs another $1,000 to get them, so be it. In most cases you can even tag the attorneys fees onto the case.
Letting them get away is what brings us people like Chris Sawyerr. Screwing somebody for $ 1,000 knowing they do not want to spend another $ 1,000 to fight for their money. So they do it to 30 people and collect $ 30,000 and have to return the money on 5 that actually go after them and still they are $ 25,000 ahead.
The FBI, who should investigate these cases, is busy finding Osamas and has no time to "waste" with this petty sh*t. |
Modified348ts (Modman)
Member
Username: Modman
Post Number: 284
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 27, 2002 - 1:43 am: | |
I've talked to my attorney and showed him the documents which can prove them wrong, but the problem remains the same- time, money, laws which my attorney nor I know of Florida's laws. I can dig up the documents and when I have the chance I can call you and then fax them over. |
Craig Dewey (Craigfl)
Member
Username: Craigfl
Post Number: 433
Registered: 1-2001
| | Posted on Monday, August 26, 2002 - 12:06 pm: | |
Here's the info on ECW:
EXOTIC CARS WHOLESALE, INC.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
PRINCIPAL ADDRESS
1490 N. FEDERAL HWY
POMPANO BEACH FL 33062 US
Changed 05/20/2002
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
MAILING ADDRESS
1490 N. FEDERAL HWY
POMPANO BEACH FL 33062 US
Changed 05/20/2002
Document Number
P97000031986 FEI Number
650744366 Date Filed
04/08/1997
State
FL Status
ACTIVE Effective Date
NONE
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Registered Agent
Name & Address
WEISMAN, RICHARD
7040 WEST PALMETTO PARK RD
#2131
BOCA RATON FL 33433
Name Changed: 04/07/1998
Address Changed: 05/04/1999
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Officer/Director Detail Name & Address Title
WEISMAN, RICHARD
7040 W. PALMETTO PK RD, SUITE 2151
BOCA RATON FL 33433
|
Jim Schad (Jim_schad)
Junior Member
Username: Jim_schad
Post Number: 101
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Monday, August 26, 2002 - 10:06 am: | |
Bruce, I know we are talking about Florida, but Evan worked for Ferrari of Dallas and said he applied at ECW. We have a "new" place in Irving called ECW. We actually had a photo shoot with models there last month and Ferrari of Dallas has a rep for being difficult so just wanted to clarify. Our DFW-FCA chapter is working with FoD to try and establish a new, good relationship with them. |
Howie F. (Brokerofexotics)
Junior Member
Username: Brokerofexotics
Post Number: 164
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Monday, August 26, 2002 - 10:00 am: | |
One thing that really confuses me is that the exotic car industry is such a "tight" industry that even the thought of being dishonest can put an entity out of business.
How do these dealers survive?
|
bruce wellington (Bws88tr)
Member
Username: Bws88tr
Post Number: 767
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Monday, August 26, 2002 - 9:44 am: | |
florida , jim
bruce |
Jim Schad (Jim_schad)
Junior Member
Username: Jim_schad
Post Number: 97
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Monday, August 26, 2002 - 9:24 am: | |
Evan: are you talking about Exotic Car World in Irving, TX or the Exotic Car Warehouse they are talking about in Florida? Just want to clarify... |
Ken Ross (Kdross)
Junior Member
Username: Kdross
Post Number: 114
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Monday, August 26, 2002 - 8:44 am: | |
Who are the owners of Exotic Car Wholesale? |
Martin (Miami348ts)
Advanced Member
Username: Miami348ts
Post Number: 2668
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, August 26, 2002 - 8:35 am: | |
Kevin to you and Modman and all the others,
I have talked to my attorney a few weeks ago about Modman's case and he said he could defend it in small claims. He would have to see the contract on which you guys sent the deposit. If you want to send me the contract by fax feel free and I will run it by him during lunch this week.
A class action may not be the most effective line to go by. If it is enough money they may either just fold up or they may defend it and run up the cost. I think you can stick them best by going small claims. Easy on each pocket book. Once one case is won the next will be so much easier.
My phone: 305-867-7676 or fax it to me along with correspondance 305-867-7901 Attn Martin.
These idiots make it so much harder for us to work and be honest! |
Mitchel DeFrancis (4re308)
Member
Username: 4re308
Post Number: 631
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Monday, August 26, 2002 - 8:29 am: | |
I want to call them and act like I know nothing about Ferraris, and tell them I am ready to buy...just to see what they act like and do. Maybe screw with them a little. |
Fred (Iluv4res)
Junior Member
Username: Iluv4res
Post Number: 62
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Monday, August 26, 2002 - 8:26 am: | |
I almost bought a car from them. They were supposed to be consigning the car, however, they pitched a fit when I contacted the owner (only to ask questions, not to try and go around them). They then decided to raise the price of the car. Really pisses me off. Not good business practice.
Also, they really push hard for an up-front deposit. I refused, thanks to the postings on this board. Glad I didn't pay them up front. |
Evan Jones (Jonesn)
New member
Username: Jonesn
Post Number: 14
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, August 25, 2002 - 8:15 pm: | |
Kevin, good luck with your suit. I could really care less for ECW, they're such a shady establishment. I used to work for Ferrari of Dallas last year, and about a week ago I went to ECW to ask for a job. They refused, saying that anyone who worked for FoD was worthless and impossible to deal with. My coworkers at FoD were some of the best people I've ever worked with, great guys. That just shows, to me, how much these guys need to be corrected.
Best wishes. |
Kevin Moore (Kevinm)
New member
Username: Kevinm
Post Number: 27
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, August 25, 2002 - 8:00 pm: | |
The past week or so I have seen some posts regarding ECW and their bad faith business dealings. I have traded E-mails with Modman and decided to take a head count of the number of people who have been unable to redeem their deposits with Exotic Cars Wholesale. If we can get enough folks toghether Modman and myself are considering going forward with a class action lawsuit. (Obviously, this would mean that the members of the class would have to share in legal expenses) Please, drop me a line if you have been a victim of ECW or if you know of someone who has been a victim.
If there are any attorneys from Florida who are members of the board and who would be interested in handling the case please email me so that we can exchange phone numbers.
Thanks
KevinM
'87 328 GTS
Saratoga Ny |