| Author |
Message |
Tim Hogan (Tojo)
Junior Member
Username: Tojo
Post Number: 57
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, September 08, 2002 - 8:38 am: | |
You may be interested to know there's a guy on the net who has a couple of manuals you can download. He says it is illeagal, but he has placed them there as a resource for owners who may be travelling away from home, for when they have problems with their car. |
wm hart (Whart)
Member
Username: Whart
Post Number: 504
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, September 08, 2002 - 7:41 am: | |
Martin: where do you draw the line? You can look at it a number of ways: like street crime, it starts at the lowest level (squeegee guys, remember, i live in NY) and if you don't stop them in their tracks, pretty soon, they graduate to B&E. Alternatively, people seemed to feel the same way you do about MP3 "file trading"; gee, the record companies are rich anyway, as are most of the big artists whose works are getting "swapped" (in actuality, copied and electronically proliferated), and the distribution of singles probably helps, rather than displaces, sales of authorized materials, or so the argument goes.
I'm not trying to be a moralist, but since this has been my specialty for over twenty years, i gotta tell ya, it puts the whole intellectual property scheme into question. Most people feel they have a right to copy so long as they are not re-vending, for profit (eg why should i pay for several different copies of the same recording, just to satisfy my need for one in the house, one in the car, etc.). That is not the law, but certainly where public sentiment is these days, made possible by digitization. But you seem to be willing to go even further, and allow somebody to create a profit making enterprise on the back of somebody else's rights. If the CD Roms this turkey is selling were copies of an individual artist's or author's work, would you feel the same way? Cause the principle is no different, unless you are willing to make an exception for copyright owners that, for one reason or another, are "undeserving" of protection. |
Martin (Miami348ts)
Advanced Member
Username: Miami348ts
Post Number: 2736
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, September 08, 2002 - 7:13 am: | |
They sell these all the time. Of course its copyright infringement but I agree who cares. I have a copy of the 308 I believe and I have copies from the 348 Work-Shop and Parts Manual. I actually give them free to my customers as a little perk just so they can look up some things themselves.
I can not see the crime in that. It is not that somebody is not getting his/her royalties. Ferrari still makes money of the parts they sell that the person found with the manuals. |
Michael Davidson (Cabrio_fan)
New member
Username: Cabrio_fan
Post Number: 14
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, September 08, 2002 - 1:00 am: | |
Thanks for the info William. I thought the ebay auction looked a little suspicious.
Mike |
arthur chambers (Art355)
Member
Username: Art355
Post Number: 634
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, September 07, 2002 - 1:00 pm: | |
Thanks William, I might have done something stupid.
Art
|
wm hart (Whart)
Member
Username: Whart
Post Number: 503
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, September 07, 2002 - 10:26 am: | |
Electronic copies are copies. Posting is copyright infringement. Translating is copyright infringement. Supplying others by email is copyright infringement.Don't assume that because the thing is old, or doesn't have a copyright notice that its not protected. Almost all countries' copyright laws are more, rather than less protective than the laws of the U.S. Anything that is offered, downloaded, or made available in the U.S. is subject to our copyright laws. Don't confuse likihood of getting sued as an individual consumer who purchases or downloads for free (low and more of an issue of establishing jurisdiction than having liability just for having received a copy) with whether it is legal to distribute or redistribute these (activities which could undoubtedly get you into trouble with a big T).Ferrari is litigious. Also, i don't think they are too interested in making deals for other people to distribute(electronically or otherwise) their stuff, even if they themselves are not fully exploiting that particular market. Just to clarify, in case i misunderstood your question, if someone had acquired legitimate copies of the owner's manuals and wanted to sell those actual items, they are of course able to do so under virtually any copyright law in the world; this is something,we in the U.S. call the First Sale Doctrine, and it is why video stores exist (eg the store buys a copy, then rents it to you, without having to pay a fee to the studio). but that doctrine does not permit the owner of a legitimate copy to make additional copies. So while you could sell your first edition Naked Lunch will impunity, if you made copies and offered those, you'd be "exposed" to liability. |
arthur chambers (Art355)
Member
Username: Art355
Post Number: 632
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, September 07, 2002 - 8:56 am: | |
Mike:
Are these in English? Maybe we could buy them, and put them on line? Maybe not, probably get sued for copyright infringement?
Art |
Marq J Ruben (Qferrari)
Junior Member
Username: Qferrari
Post Number: 97
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, September 07, 2002 - 4:57 am: | |
Eamon, unless I'm mistaken, Ferrari does offer free/downloadable/printable copies of their owners manuals on the Ferrari Owners Site. However, no parts/workshop manuals.
|
Eamon A Blaney (Eamon)
New member
Username: Eamon
Post Number: 38
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, September 07, 2002 - 3:39 am: | |
Of course it's illigal but who cares ? I think there is a sort of rough justice given the outragous markup Ferrari charge on all their spare parts, even when it is something simple as a manual. Considering that there is zero marginal cost of production and that you are going to be making a purchase as a result of having the spare parts manual etc., wouldn't it be nice if Ferrari Spa itself would consider giving something back to it's customers ? Maybe starting with free electronic versions of manuals. |
Michael Davidson (Cabrio_fan)
New member
Username: Cabrio_fan
Post Number: 13
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, September 07, 2002 - 2:56 am: | |
My apologies if this question has been posted previously. I scanned the archives to no avail.
My question is: What legal issues are entailed with electronic versions (Adobe Acrobat PDF docs) of Ferrari manuals on CD? I've read a number of posts in the archives that refer to them but no one questioning their legality. Are there any copyright issues pertaining to Ferrari pubs?
This question came up when I saw an ebay auction for "EVERY FERRARI MANUAL UP TO 2001." The list starts with the 166 and goes through to the 550 Barchetta. The item is coming out of Spain. Does the fact that this is from outside of the US have any ramifications to its legality in the US?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1857344222
Interesting item if its legit.
Mike |
|