| Author |
Message |
tommy jones (360mode)
New member
Username: 360mode
Post Number: 10
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, September 26, 2002 - 11:11 pm: | |
i think the point people are missing when they say to "just enjoy it" is that it seems for you, it would be nearly impossible to fully enjoy it since these imperfections bother you this much. i know it would bother the hell out of me, especially if i had saved up for it and it wasn't something i bought with pocket change! good luck, hope wwoc works with you on this... |
Joel Belser (Driver)
New member
Username: Driver
Post Number: 1
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 2:03 pm: | |
Enjoy driving the car...dings and scratches are inevitable. If you want perfection, you'll have to lock it up in a hermetically sealed space!!! |
Martin (Miami348ts)
Advanced Member
Username: Miami348ts
Post Number: 2837
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 5:24 am: | |
I feel for you but would strongly advise AGAINST wetsanding it now. Wait till you have something else on the car and thenw et sand it.
My detailer has a paint gauge which measures how many mills of paint are on the car. He can tell you how often you can do a wet-sand before you hit the primer. You will be surprised how fast that is, especially if somebody did not know how to wet-sand.
Wait till you have a real scratch or something else that needs the attention. Once you take off the coat of paint it is GONE! |
Ben Cannon (Artherd)
Junior Member
Username: Artherd
Post Number: 62
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, September 19, 2002 - 12:29 am: | |
Well, there is of course concern that it could get WORSE with age, fast...
If you're picking up color on buffing, and it's base/clear paint, the clear is GONE...
This isn't good, and needs addressing. Possibly time to consider a full repaint.
You might just have fun with it for a few years, and then if you start to actually see defects.
Hey, just track the thing! Given the fact the car's not 'nitrogen chamber preserved' anymore, and a real automobile, just DRIVE it! Could give you an excuse to bring it out more...
Just a thought. Enjoy the car man. Enjoy it for all of us who hope to one day too have a 355 to call our own :D)
Best!
Ben. |
L. Wayne Ausbrooks (Lwausbrooks)
Member
Username: Lwausbrooks
Post Number: 336
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 4:47 pm: | |
I fit makes you unhappy, do what it takes to fix it. Regardless, your issue with barely-visible paint imperfections has nothing to do with WWoC. You can ask them to look at it and, if you approach them with the right attidude, they might send it out to a detail shop but most likely they won't be the solution to your problem. They definitely won't repaint the car for you for free, as they shouldn't anyway.
If it were me, I'd drive it and enjoy it. The next time around, I'd be more careful in inspecting a used car before purchasing, seeing as you put a lot of importance on cosmetics. |
Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
Junior Member
Username: Rickyn_f355
Post Number: 56
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 4:03 pm: | |
hehehehe...i know exactly what your opinion is Matt! |
Matt Karson (Squidracing)
Junior Member
Username: Squidracing
Post Number: 173
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 3:58 pm: | |
Bro....you know what my opinion is..... |
Mitch Alsup (Mitch_alsup)
Junior Member
Username: Mitch_alsup
Post Number: 150
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 2:50 pm: | |
I would just like to add that when a car is repainted, it is wet sanded before the paint is fully dry (about 3 months after the paint is sprayed). So wet sanding, glassing, and polishing are significantly easier with fresh paint than on hard old paint. So the hard old paint takes more time to polish than new fresh (even heat dried) paint.
Thought experiment: how often have you had some thing on you car repaired and painted. IT looks perfect, but about a year later, you notice a) a haze on the paint, primer sanding marks under the paint,... These are symptoms of getting the surface perfected before the underlying stuff has fully dried/cured. |
Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
Junior Member
Username: Rickyn_f355
Post Number: 55
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 2:47 pm: | |
i knew someone would feel my pain!
:-) |
Fred (Iluv4res)
Junior Member
Username: Iluv4res
Post Number: 104
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 2:43 pm: | |
Unfortunately, most dealers ususally don't look at the cars as closely as they should because most buyer's don't look at the cars as closely as they should. That's why the New Auto Toy Store is in business (not to switch topics).
This is also evidenced by the majority of responses in this thread, whereby opinions were just to drive it and enjoy it without worrying about the minor blemishes.
Owning an F-Car is a personal affair, which is meaningful to different people in different ways. Personally, I like to look at them even standing still and find it exciting. perhaps that is why I am more particular than most when it comes to blemishes.
If you are unhappy with the paint, no matter what anyone here tells you, you're probably always going to be unhappy with it until it is corrected. However, keep in mind, the finish from the factory sometimes has blemishes.
Repainting would be more harmful than good, IMHO. I would have them try to remove the scratches as best as possible with buffing and/or wax-type chemicals. Then decide if you want to pursue it further.
Definite bummer. |
Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
Junior Member
Username: Rickyn_f355
Post Number: 54
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 2:18 pm: | |
not me arlie, i'd look down and see which one has better toes, then i would go to town!
:-)
|
Horsefly (Arlie)
Junior Member
Username: Arlie
Post Number: 234
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 2:15 pm: | |
I do know that if Britney Spears or Carmen Electra came knocking at my door, the first thing I would do is grab a bright fluorescent light and scan them from top to bottom looking for the slightest imperfection so that I could continue to worry over and over about it. I would totally overlook the good fortune of simply having them close at hand, and continue to fret over the imperfections. |
Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
Junior Member
Username: Rickyn_f355
Post Number: 53
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 2:14 pm: | |
swirls came out but the water spots and scratches look like they are actually beneath or in the paint |
John Delvac (Johndelvac)
Junior Member
Username: Johndelvac
Post Number: 89
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 2:11 pm: | |
Wet sanding is a good way to remove bad water spots or factory orange peel. It doesn't sound like they properly polished it when they were done. In other words, the job is not finished. The only harm done is that your paint is a bit thinner and much care should be taken the next time it is sanded (if ever). Why won't the swirls & scratches (spider webs) polish out? |
Mr. Doody (Doody)
Member
Username: Doody
Post Number: 457
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 10:48 am: | |
this is an interesting issue.
my understanding is that the car didn't have had clearcoat removed en masse, and it hasn't been repainted.
however, at some point some not-too-bright individual didn't quite treat it optimally.
as a result, there is some volume of "paint defects" visible only in extreme conditions.
on one hand, if you paid a premium price you deserve a premium car.
on the other hand, if you had a PPI, why wasn't this caught? would this normally be caught in a PPI? did the dealer or the PPI inspector represent that the paint was perfect?
do remember that you're talking about a seven year old car. i don't know how many miles are on the odometer, but it is a used car.
i guess my take is that if your dealer or your PPI inspector represented that the paint was perfect then there's an issue. if your PPI process should have caught this, then there might be an issue.
my 355 had a few minor paint whacks on it. totally minimal stuff that no human being other than myself has ever noticed. this includes the dealer who bought and sold it, the former owner, and the hauler who brought it to me (and they are INSANE guys). as the owners, we're spazzes. that's just the way it is :-).
enjoy the car. don't sweat the paint. you're gonna get a ding, a whack, or maybe something worse. if it's only visible under extreme conditions you might just avoid those conditions ;-)
good luck. in the end i let the little paint things slide on a car that was represented as "not a flaw" re: the paint. it wasn't worth the hassle of dealing with it. and i don't regret that decision for a moment now.
doody! |
Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
Junior Member
Username: Rickyn_f355
Post Number: 52
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 10:28 am: | |
i don't know...i hear what some of you guys are saying but if i owned one of the biggest dealers in the country, i would actually look at every car i put my name on under a flourescent light...people should take pride in the things they respresent...we treat every client with respect, no matter if they are a $50Million or $400MM client. |
Chris A. (Asianbond)
Junior Member
Username: Asianbond
Post Number: 60
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 10:05 am: | |
Dude, you even said yourself that it is only noticeable under close inspection with a fluorescent lamp, what happen to "what you see is what you get"? Put yourself in the dealer's shoes, he takes in the car as a trade, it looks fine from a normal and even close distance, he offers the seller a fair price base on this. Or does the dealer examine it with a fluorescent lamp and tells the buyer that the paint is damaged and it needs to be painted and will have to offer the seller less. Besides, if your dealer had repainted the car it would be worth less.
I suggest that you just enjoy driving the beautiful car and not worry too much about these minor imperfections.
Good luck, hopefully the dealer can get out the imperfections for you, I definitely would avoid a repaint. |
Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
Junior Member
Username: Rickyn_f355
Post Number: 51
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 9:50 am: | |
i'm not sure I paid a premium but i'm going to drop the car off in the next couple days...will let you know what comes out of it.
thnx |
ELI (Titanium360)
Junior Member
Username: Titanium360
Post Number: 181
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 7:27 am: | |
Ricky:
If i had paid the top dollar you did on your 355, i would make sure wwoc pays for it no matter what the problem is. you have paid a premium and you are entitled to it. |
Andrew Menasce (Amenasce)
Junior Member
Username: Amenasce
Post Number: 234
Registered: 10-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 6:28 am: | |
I knwo how bugging this can be , i have some imperfections to on the hood of my alfa that are barely noticeable , but i know they are there , so it kind spoils the fun to look at her ..I wont repaint her because that would be a nonsense financially speaking and its nobody's fault , but in your case , i think you should let the manager @ WWoC know the 355 was sold .Afterall you did buy a $100k + car , so they should have told you about these imperfections if they knew about it ! |
ross koller (Ross)
Member
Username: Ross
Post Number: 305
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, September 18, 2002 - 5:24 am: | |
so who walks around inspecting car paint w/ a fluorescent light in hand? like magoo said, just drive it and enjoy it. |
David A. Spear (Detailman)
New member
Username: Detailman
Post Number: 23
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 9:42 pm: | |
Sounds like somebody didn't know what they were doing if they sanded, (if they did know what they were doing they wouldn't be their) it would not have swirl marks. I also have a red 355, 95' as for the water marks those will come out with some work depending on wether or not sombody put wax on top of the water marks. let me know how that turns out. |
magoo (Magoo)
Advanced Member
Username: Magoo
Post Number: 3141
Registered: 2-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 8:49 pm: | |
Ricky, Enjoy your Ferrari. My Grandaddy used to say,"Pickin' the flyshit out of the pepper will drive a sane man crazy." Regards, |
Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
New member
Username: Rickyn_f355
Post Number: 50
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 8:41 pm: | |
my cousin said the paint Ferrari used on the 95s is a single stage german paint....starts with a G, and most cars did not have a clear coat in my year |
wm hart (Whart)
Member
Username: Whart
Post Number: 508
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 8:36 pm: | |
I don't know who Nick S. uses these days either, but i do know the detailer that went over the car today (i recommended him) and while its certainly worthwhile to get a second detailer's opinion, it sounds like the problem may be more than "skin deep." (Sorry). I just sent Ricky an email, which in essence, asks some questions WWoC can answer (like, are they the ones who attempted to wet sand the car) and some that are beyond my knowledge of paint and clearcoat on modern paintjobs (like what effect wet sanding has on both, since if ricky was lifting color, hasn't he already lost some of the clearcoat?). Sounds to me like this may go beyond the province of a "mere" detailer, and require the knowledge of somebody that has real experience with paint jobs. I also suggested that rick contact the Pateraks in NJ since they are really good detailers of the "do no harm" variety.(BTW, Bruce, Nick would probably be insulted if characterized as a detailer, since he has been an independent dealer of F and other cars, including race cars, for quite a few years, and has had some pretty famous ferraris pass thru his place on their way to other broker/dealers, celebrity owners, Pebble Beach,etc. Not defending the guy, just trying to "correct the record." |
bruce wellington (Bws88tr)
Member
Username: Bws88tr
Post Number: 859
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 8:23 pm: | |
you type fine,,i got the content,,good luck
bruce |
Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
New member
Username: Rickyn_f355
Post Number: 49
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 8:10 pm: | |
dam, i cant type...that last post should have read:
funny that nick's name comes up...my friend Mario was the detailer at nick's shop from like 96 to 98...not sure who he uses these days but i'll give him a shot...pretty sure wetsanding will be a must. |
Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
New member
Username: Rickyn_f355
Post Number: 48
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 8:08 pm: | |
funny that nick's name comes up...my friend Mario was the detailer and nick's shop from like 96 to 08...not sure who he uses these days but i'll give him a shot...pretty sure wetsanding will be a must. |
bruce wellington (Bws88tr)
Member
Username: Bws88tr
Post Number: 858
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 7:58 pm: | |
ricky
there is a detailer in the white plains area , his name is nick soprano, he used to do all the corvettes in my club when i raced and showed vettes..look him up, he was fair priced and excellent work was his forte..
good luck ricky..
bruce |
Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
New member
Username: Rickyn_f355
Post Number: 47
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 7:53 pm: | |
i'm in westchester, NY...i went to Mel's for the detail and to Mastroddi Auto Body for the prognosis... |
Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
New member
Username: Rickyn_f355
Post Number: 46
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 7:50 pm: | |
hahaha...thnx for the repsonse bruce...
already did step 1 so step 2 is brekaing some chops at WWoC |
bruce wellington (Bws88tr)
Member
Username: Bws88tr
Post Number: 857
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 7:48 pm: | |
hey you have every right to be anal, its not a dodge dart or a pinto...
to make you sleep better at night, get yourself the best detailer in your area, (where do you live?)and see what they say...if not happy with their answer, bring it back to wwoc and see the manager or owner and then break some chops... |
Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
New member
Username: Rickyn_f355
Post Number: 45
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 7:40 pm: | |
i hear dude, life is short...but this is my first f-car and I busted my ass to get the $ to pay for it...so i'm anal |
bruce wellington (Bws88tr)
Member
Username: Bws88tr
Post Number: 856
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 7:40 pm: | |
hey ricky
i agree with arlee,,,when you get your first real scratch or dent{hope you never will} all this fuss about swirls and waterspots will be forgotten..believe me it happened to me..dont sweat it buddy, just enjoy....it.. remember 9/11
bruce |
Horsefly (Arlie)
Junior Member
Username: Arlie
Post Number: 232
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 7:33 pm: | |
Isn't all the concern being just a bit nit picky?
Imagine how distraut you will be WHEN somebody actually puts a genuine scratch or dent on the car. After all, it's just a car subject to the rigors of the real world. |
Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
New member
Username: Rickyn_f355
Post Number: 43
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, September 17, 2002 - 7:18 pm: | |
Ok, so as most of you know I bought a red F355 from Wide World of Cars one month ago. I have had the car at my place for 2 weeks and it�s been at WWoC the other 2 weeks getting some minor repairs done all under warranty. I washed the car the other day and noticed tons of scratches, swirls and water spots. I tried using 3M Imperial Hand glaze and noticed I was picking up some paint. I brought the car to a respected detailer and he used a buffer on it. He was able to remove the swirls but not able to get the water spots out. HJ=e said that the car was never painted but someone tried wet sanding, probably to get the water spots out. I went straight to my cousin�s autobody shop (he�s one of the best in lower NY) and he confirmed the detailer�s assumptions. The car was never repainted but someone had tried to wet sand it, creating tons of scratches in the paint. The water spots are still visible. Mind you all of this is only noticeable under close inspection under a fluorescent like light. Out in day light it�s not noticeable but I hate knowing the imperfections are there. My cousin said that it�s so minor I might be asking for more trouble by trying to wet sand because then I might be forced into repainting. My question is: do you think Wide World of Cars should pick up the damage if they tell me it needs to be wet sanded or/and ultimately repainted? Second question: should I trust whoever WWoC uses if they are willing to pay for it?
I'd really appreciate anyones opinion. |