| Author | Message | |||
| Matt Lemus (Mlemus)
Junior Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 236 Registered: 8-2002 |
348's run a lot of toe on the alignment. Your shocks could be getting bad causing an increase in toe. more so then usual. You should get it checked out soon. | |||
| Ben Cannon (Artherd)
Junior Member Username: Artherd Post Number: 92 Registered: 6-2002 |
Comments like that crack me up. DUH, it's a mid-engine car! Repeat after me Csaba! I Will NOT Lift! I Will NOT Lift! I Will NOT Lift!" :P The 348 is a freaking go-kart if you actually know how to drive it. (it'll be needing new rubber these days though  Najib, your car should not be breaking the tyres loose at 'low' levels of agressiveness, it should be really cooking before that happens! However, this car isn't a chevy, it's a supercar, and it IS VERY CAPABLE of hurting you if you don't touch it properly. I'm betting something's 'wrong' with your car however, be it old rubber, alignment, etc. You need to find someone with a 348 and compare notes/drives. Best! Ben. | |||
| Matt Lemus (Mlemus)
Junior Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 234 Registered: 8-2002 |
There is actually a brief mention to the 348 in the November Car and Driver. Csaba Csere mentions in his editoral, "the steering cloumn" that, "The Old Ferrari 348 is a perfect example of a car that achieved a lofty skidpad number -0.90 g- but was diabolical on the road. Not only did that Ferrari transition into pronounced oversteer if in midcorner you lifted off the throttle, but when you reapplied the gas to balance the car as you might in the older porsche 911, the 348's tail swung out wider." | |||
| Ernie Bonilla (Ernie)
Member Username: Ernie Post Number: 379 Registered: 11-2001 |
Justin Impressive setup you have there. Your car must be so much more fun with the extra power. I bet you surprize quite a few 355's with you car. Is the exhuast Tubi, or custom? Have you considered getting the heads and intake manifold ported and polished. I have been told that you can get an extra 40-60hp, depending on how radical you get with the porting. | |||
| Justin Randall Kenyon (Kenyon)
New member Username: Kenyon Post Number: 3 Registered: 10-2002 |
Craig, Its takes about half an hour to put the cats back on for MOT. Only needs to be done once a year for the MOT, its worth it. Justin
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| Chris Richardson (Boozy)
Junior Member Username: Boozy Post Number: 219 Registered: 11-2001 |
Ease on and off the throttle. It is not an ON-OFF switch. Smooth throttle application and you'll feel it break loose well in advance. A mid-engined car is a wonderful thing in skilled hands. I highly suggest you get some formal high performance driving training. You will love your car much more. | |||
| Craig Williams (Craigw)
New member Username: Craigw Post Number: 23 Registered: 4-2002 |
Justin, what do you do when its MOT time re emmissions? | |||
| Dave Penhale (Dapper)
Member Username: Dapper Post Number: 269 Registered: 4-2002 |
So I guess I should look into changing my 11 year old Bridgestones RE71's then! | |||
| Najib Amanullah (Najib)
Junior Member Username: Najib Post Number: 220 Registered: 4-2001 |
Tazio You are probably correct. Prior to this I have only driven German saloons with a much lower power to weight ratio. The problem probably is a heavy right foot and hard tyres. I like your description of the outcome if I lifted my foot off the gas on a full slide, though. In my case I have never been testing the car's adhesion to such an extent. I cannot afford to replace this one just yet. | |||
| Justin Randall Kenyon (Kenyon)
New member Username: Kenyon Post Number: 2 Registered: 10-2002 |
Ernie, I have had the cats removed from the car, straight through exahust with a small single box at the rear. The exhaust is 316 stainless , polished inside (like Dairy pipework), The ECU has been chipped, K&N air filter, upgraded fuel regulator and racing platinium KNG plugs. I have had it on the rolling road pushing out 375 BHP at 8000 RPM (10 BHP off a 355). The only thing with the cats removed the emissions are higher. The car screams like a F1 car. It reads 120 decibles at max. Their is no power steering on any of the 348 models. It was on the 355. Also the 348 spider was stopped early 1995 because the 355 came out in 1994. They continued with the 348 spider and used it as a bench mark to develop the 355 spider. The late 1994 early 1995 348 spiders had the 355 brakes and suspension set up. Remember only the spiders. I have been told at the ferrari factory in Italy this and also the 348 spider had its seals strengthed compared to the GTS and GTB due to it being a spider (convertible) this was to make the body of car more rigid. The results are that the spider is actually a better handling car on cornering. I have been looking at a quick shift system on my car from ferrari. Its a triptronic type gearbox. Its costs around �6000.00 plus tax. Not cheap. I do really like the gearbox thats on it. | |||
| Tazio Nuvolari (Nuvolari)
New member Username: Nuvolari Post Number: 16 Registered: 9-2002 |
Having read all of the posts, the solution to the problem seems rather simple. Seeing as the lack of rear grip happens at low speeds, it is obvious that it is related to mechanical grip and not physical vehicle dynamics (ie. weight transfer). There are 2 mechanical things to look at: 1. Most likely are the tires. Regardless of how much tread they show, they are old and hard. Their elasticity and traction are but a memory and new tires are #1 priority. 2. There is the possibility that the diff is a little out of adjustment or not operating properly and that would surely affect traction coming out of slow bends. This is a more remote possibility. Chances are the problem resides in a heavy right foot. If you read the original post you will see that the correction to the drift was a lift off the throttle. If that car were anywhere near the limit of adhesion and you lifted off the gas mid-corner, you would find yourself with a much shorter car and much emptier wallet. | |||
| Ernie Bonilla (Ernie)
Member Username: Ernie Post Number: 375 Registered: 11-2001 |
Ok ... so spacers seems one of the ways to go. Who has them that WILL NOT rip you off, price wise? Next will be lowering it, then the 18's. But I wonder if you can get away with 19's? Justin, 185mph???? in a 348. Are you sure that was right? I'm willing to bet your speedo is off big time. If it isn't what did you do to your engine to get the extra horsies needed for that speed? Oh yeah..... I was wondering if any of the 1994/1995 cars had power steering in them. Also can the cable system for shifting be swapped out for a mechanical one? | |||
| Justin Randall Kenyon (Kenyon)
New member Username: Kenyon Post Number: 1 Registered: 10-2002 |
Guys, I am writing from the United Kingdom. I have a 348 Spider 1994. The 1994/1995 models have wide track were the pre-1994 did not. I have wheel spacers, 225x45 on the front, 275x35 on the back from Falken tires 451's. I have 18" momo wheels and its been lowered by 25mm using eibach springs. I have had 185 mph at silverstone race circuit, its excellent/cool. The 348's handal better than the 355, its a go-kart !!!! The weather is not that great in the UK - it rains a lot. Regards, Justin | |||
| Najib Amanullah (Najib)
Junior Member Username: Najib Post Number: 219 Registered: 4-2001 |
Thanks for all the toughts. I think basically its the first time I'm driving a mid-engined car and with a considerable amount of power so I have to get used to treating it with more respect. Also I will try to switch to wider tyres as the existing rubber (Bridgestone Expedias) is looking a little worn although they still have some use left in them. I will try to drive another 348 just to make sure they all handle the same way. Being a 1994 car I hope its nothing serious but I will have these things (alignment, dampers etc.) checked at the next service soon. | |||
| billy bob (Fatbillybob)
Junior Member Username: Fatbillybob Post Number: 56 Registered: 8-2002 |
348's run too high air pressure in the rear. The spec is like 35/37. Try running 34/34 cold. It makes a huge difference. The 348 has a light clutch/flywheel setup. it can spin tires up fast if you get on the gas and have a tendency to twitch the car or hook it when you turn. Some like sex hard and some like it smooth and silky. The fast guys look slow and the slow guys work way to hard. if that does not work for you increase the negative camber by 1 degree. If that is not good enough add the wheel spacers. If that does not work go to a wider wheel tire combo. By todays standard the 348 has skinny tires stock are 215/255's! Don't neglect the dampers either. If you have an early 348 it is over 10 years old! | |||
| Modified348ts (Modman)
Member Username: Modman Post Number: 370 Registered: 11-2001 |
Yes Martin I've heard of the spacers but I like the way the car feels now and it already has a good amount of negative camber and don't want to risk the way the car handles now. I have a lucky combo on this car and it was made for me the way I drive it around corners, every time someone asks for a spin and they really want to see how this car drives I make them buckle up and warn them. When I loop through the entrance of the freeway they •••• bricks in fear as the car gets sideways and then lock up as it enters the freeway, I'm gonna find a way to put a hidden cam in the car pointing to their heads so I can show everyone what they experience, it's so funny.. Najib, we need to watch you drive when you are making your turns, the only thing I can think of is how far you are turning and where the position of your front wheels are when you gas it or your tires are made of plastic rubber, alignment? get with someone who has a 348 and drive theirs and have them drive yours and you would know for sure.... | |||
| Ben Cannon (Artherd)
Junior Member Username: Artherd Post Number: 88 Registered: 6-2002 |
no way it should happen during a normal drive. What kind of rubber do you have on there now? If it's hiddiously old, REPLACE! I'd recomend some nice 18" Speedlines (or similar upsize) and run big Pzeros, etc. Best! Ben. | |||
| Chris A. (Asianbond)
Junior Member Username: Asianbond Post Number: 69 Registered: 5-2002 |
Of course if you gas hard in a turn or whenever the wheels are not almost straight the rear may break tractions a bit sideways, it al depends on road surface, your car's setup, tires and your level of speed and how hard you gas it. The car is just telling you that you have a lot of horsepower back there, a corvette or mustang will do the same. I'm just saying that under normal and even hard driving my 348's handling is very predictable. | |||
| Najib Amanullah (Najib)
Junior Member Username: Najib Post Number: 218 Registered: 4-2001 |
Guys I'm not talking about losing the rear wheels on a track. This is normal driving in the city. If I step on the gas a little, coming out of a U turn or sometimes at just a slight angle, the tail does a wiggle which can be corrected but gives the impression of lack of adhesion of the car. At first I thought the tyres were still cold but it happened once more and seems like a 348 trait. Martin, I will be looking at both the Yokos (which are available here) and Kuhomos (sp) which I will try to find. Have you fitted wider tyres to your car? Neal suggested 275x40's on the rear wheels and seems to have solved his car's problems with twitchiness. | |||
| Chris A. (Asianbond)
Junior Member Username: Asianbond Post Number: 66 Registered: 5-2002 |
Modman hit it on the nail, the rear provides a lot of notice when pushing it to the limits. When your tail is sliding progressively out and squealing like a banshee the car is telling you something. I have never lost the tail yet, of course this does not apply to wet or surfaces coated with a light coat of sand. | |||
| Martin (Miami348ts)
Advanced Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 2952 Registered: 5-2001 |
no I have not tried to drift it, although sometimes it just does. Well, driving hard I guess. The important thing is to get the platform into balance before you get the car into the corner. Most brake too late and start the corner with an offset car. That will spin you around in a flash. Especially if you are under braking already turing in. The AVS are great tires. Just posted that on the other topic you had posted Najib. I would opt for the wheel spacers as well if I were you. Koenig in Munich Germany sells a great set. The handling improves to the later Challenge and GT models. It also gives is a greater � in the wheel to the road for better cornering. Runs the tires down faster but hey....can't have it all. | |||
| Modified348ts (Modman)
Member Username: Modman Post Number: 367 Registered: 11-2001 |
On my 348 with 18" AVS sports I've gotten it losing the rear end right to left and corrected with no problem and never ever lost control of the car or spun out. I can literally drift sideways on my car and hold it but it is not easy to do as the car will catch traction real quick and you have to prepare yourself with the wheel and throttle. I have not heard anyone experience this doing a drift in a 348, you have to just do it, practice on an open track without barriers but tires make a difference on slipping points too. Martin has AVS sports but I don't know if he tried to drift in his car but I'm sure it handles lovely as I've experienced. I like the rear end slipping a little for predictable handling. | |||
| Michael Fennell (Mfennell70)
Junior Member Username: Mfennell70 Post Number: 70 Registered: 7-2001 |
Changing the ride height may affect the way the car handles but not from weight distribution. You can't change the front/rear weight distribution by any appreciable amount with ride height changes. OTOH, lowering an end of the car should give you some more negative camber and *that* can certainly help. | |||
| Noelrp (Noelrp)
Junior Member Username: Noelrp Post Number: 80 Registered: 8-2001 |
I spun off once making a left coming out of the parking lot with the stock non-spyder wheels. Either get rear spacers or upgrade to 18" wheels. It makes a world of difference. -n | |||
| Ernie Bonilla (Ernie)
Member Username: Ernie Post Number: 373 Registered: 11-2001 |
Najib, It is the car. I have spun mine a few times. Just last week I had it spin on me, and I wasn't even going fast, maybe 35 mph. The other thing is that the car feels to have a bit of over steer. There is a point at which I can feel the front tires grab as I'm turning, and if I don't sence it right away, you guessed it the tail comes right around. I have heard by lowering the car will help solve the problem. But by how much? You all know that it is already a pain to get in and out of driveways at the stock height. Any other suggestions? Cause I would like to get rid of this nasty little trait on my car also. | |||
| Mitch Alsup (Mitch_alsup)
Junior Member Username: Mitch_alsup Post Number: 174 Registered: 4-2002 |
Ferraris are so adjustable, that I bet you can calm the rear end with a simple adjustment of ride height (e.g. static weight distribution front to rear). Raising the nose or dropping the tail will shift static weight from the front tires to the rear. With more static weight on the rear, the car will understeer more, and loose its twitch under brakes. | |||
| Chris A. (Asianbond)
Junior Member Username: Asianbond Post Number: 65 Registered: 5-2002 |
I haven't experienced the problem you mentioned. I drive my 348 quite hard and find that it does a very good job communicating its traction limits. My car generates noticeable tire squeal when pushed, I prefer that over silent cars where the tail will spin without much warning. I suggest you check the conditions of your tires and alignment/camber settings. I personally think the 348 possess the perfect balance of handling and power. Impossible to believe your SUV will handle better than a 348. | |||
| Dave328GTB (Hardtop)
Member Username: Hardtop Post Number: 260 Registered: 1-2002 |
Najib, When I had a 348, I found that the rears do, in fact, break loose with alarming ease and without much warning. Other 348 drivers have told me the same. 348's can really handle in the hands of someone really good, but their reputation is for being tricky and twitchy. I had an open mind when I bought mine and learned to handle it pretty well with lots of track time, but I always refered to it as a beast. I found that if I trusted the car, I could take curves at insane speeds (on real roads that is) but it never felt good doing it. That's one of the reasons I sold it and went back to a 328 which, while not as fast, gives me good vibes and a lot of confidence to drive it near the limit. Just my opinion, you are about to hear others, I'm sure! Dave | |||
| William H (Countachxx)
Intermediate Member Username: Countachxx Post Number: 1474 Registered: 2-2001 |
If you have never driven a mid engine car before that could be it, They take more finesse than front drivers. Also depends how fast you are going in the corners. I know I'd like to run a wing on my 512TR at Watkins Glen, rear gets light in the middle of the esses at 110Mph+ | |||
| Najib Amanullah (Najib)
Junior Member Username: Najib Post Number: 214 Registered: 4-2001 |
I find that the rear wheels on my 348 are fairly easy to get unstuck. I could partly blame the fine sand that drifts on to roads here but it almost seems my SUV can corner harder. Does this mean a new set of tyres is required or something more sinister? It just seems very twitchy going round corners and I have to take my foot off the accelerator to rectify the drift. Has anyone else experienced the same? |
Modified 348 Spider