| Author |
Message |
Jon P. Kofod (95f355c)
Member
Username: 95f355c
Post Number: 279
Registered: 8-2001
| | Posted on Friday, November 08, 2002 - 7:48 pm: | |
Folks,
Prices vary greatly between different sources in the US for most F car parts. I got several quotes for headers from several dealers. Ferrari of Washington quoted me $3200 per side, Shelton was $3800 per side and the cheapest was Algar which wanted $2800 per side. Lowest labor rate was about $600 from Ferrari of Washington (per side).
Same goes for the Tubi parts. I was quoted a high of $8000 for a complete tubi GT racing exhaust system with headers, exhaust, and mufflers. The cheapest price was from Independent Ferrari Service (John Tirell) at $5100.
Chris: For $6000 you should be getting the whole system not just the headers.
Regards,
Jon P. Kofod
95 F355 Challenge #23
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IJVPF355 (Ijvpet)
New member
Username: Ijvpet
Post Number: 9
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Friday, November 08, 2002 - 3:27 pm: | |
I've been pretty lucky. My '95 355 has not had any problems thus far after 15,000 miles. The reason the headers break is surprisingly because the headers are CAST. Cast material is rarely reliable under extreme heating conditions depending on its chemistry. Obviously, Ferrari has not looked deep enough into this. Another problem with cast is that they are a ••••• to weld. You can get welding rod for cast, but its a slow process because you have to keep the headers as cool as possible or else over heated zones appear, which creates crystalization, which creates an area that cracks with expansion (ie. intense heat). The best alternative in my opinion (if possible) is to get a set of custom stainless headers made. Using stainless tubing of diameter and wall of your choice. It might be a little heavier (not much), and it will never crack like the factory cast piece. I haven't checked the cost, however as someone in the steel fab business, the cost should be WELL BELOW what tubi is charging let alone what the factory is charging. |
Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
Junior Member
Username: Rickyn_f355
Post Number: 100
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Friday, November 08, 2002 - 9:04 am: | |
looks like ill be selling if/when i have this problem! |
Frank Parker (Parkerfe)
Intermediate Member
Username: Parkerfe
Post Number: 1495
Registered: 9-2001
| | Posted on Friday, November 08, 2002 - 8:35 am: | |
F.Y.I., you can buy most factory Ferrari and Tubi parts from England for 1/2 the price you pay in the U.S.A.. For example, you can get a Tubi exhaust for a 348 for $1700.00. |
Cmparrf40 (Cmparrf40)
Member
Username: Cmparrf40
Post Number: 489
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Friday, November 08, 2002 - 8:19 am: | |
The Factory headers are $4,500 a side, labor is probably $1,500 or more. So something that resembles $10,500 to replace both sides with factory headers.
Tubi headers are about $6,000 a set, the labor is the same, so about $7,500 and you do not have to worry about them breaking again.
Not a cheap deal. |
Manu Sachdeva (Manu)
Member
Username: Manu
Post Number: 521
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Friday, November 08, 2002 - 6:43 am: | |
Oh boy... US prices - I wouldn't have the first idea mate.
I think (with the emphasis on the uncertainty) its about a �2000 - �3000 job in the UK.... which equals oh SH!T in USD.. |
Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
Junior Member
Username: Rickyn_f355
Post Number: 99
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Friday, November 08, 2002 - 5:55 am: | |
i hear ya manu...
so worst case scenario, how much would it cost to replace the with stock units and factory labor? |
Manu Sachdeva (Manu)
Member
Username: Manu
Post Number: 519
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Friday, November 08, 2002 - 5:18 am: | |
Ricky - why would anyone change something which isn't broken... I reckon it's marginal as to whether they would have done and as to whther they will - but you must ASK... nothing ventured, nothing gained. |
Red (Redhead)
Junior Member
Username: Redhead
Post Number: 68
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, November 07, 2002 - 2:44 pm: | |
Ricky--Not good, but why not try? As well, they may have already been replaced and then you have no worries. Most good Ferrari Techs can tell just by looking at them. |
Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
Junior Member
Username: Rickyn_f355
Post Number: 97
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, November 07, 2002 - 2:09 pm: | |
Got my car from WWoC in September. My 3 month warranty and my 7 yr emissions warranty expire at the end of November...what do you think is the chance of me getting them to replace the headers under warranty if they are showing no signs of cracking? |
Red Lindell (Redhead)
Junior Member
Username: Redhead
Post Number: 67
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, November 07, 2002 - 2:01 pm: | |
Jon and Hans--
They are not the same headers, Ferrari has updated the design, and they are a fix, not just another band-aid.
Chris- Your dealer should still replace them, as the emissions wty. is 7 years, from the date of purchase.
Willis--You have no worries. The only problem the 360's were having was with the muffler. This was on the early 99 cars only.
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Mitch Alsup (Mitch_alsup)
Junior Member
Username: Mitch_alsup
Post Number: 206
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, November 07, 2002 - 1:12 pm: | |
I have a 95 F355 that had its headers (both of them) replaced only 2 months ago from the same dealer I bought the car from. I did not hide the fact that it had gone on the track 7 different days (two of these were sponsered by FoH and FoD. |
Cmparrf40 (Cmparrf40)
Member
Username: Cmparrf40
Post Number: 488
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, November 07, 2002 - 11:37 am: | |
Ricky, you can hear it if they crack.
A friends 355 header was so bad it sounded like a garbage truck!
mine makes a strange sound until it warms up and closes the crack.
If you suspect you have a problem, get it fixed, it can cause major problems including burned valves.
You may also get a slow down light that can not be explained.
I have not heard of this problem on a 360, but it is early. |
Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
Junior Member
Username: Rickyn_f355
Post Number: 96
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, November 07, 2002 - 11:01 am: | |
stupid question, how would u know if you are headers are cracked or if they are cracking? |
Willis Huang (Willis360)
Intermediate Member
Username: Willis360
Post Number: 1001
Registered: 8-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, November 07, 2002 - 11:00 am: | |
Hmmm...I wonder if the cracked header problem will happen on my 360? |
Cmparrf40 (Cmparrf40)
Member
Username: Cmparrf40
Post Number: 487
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, November 07, 2002 - 10:54 am: | |
Jon, I did not even call the dealer.
Since mine is a 95,the odds they would warranty is slim.
The Tubi headers are light years ahead of the factory headers in quality and since I do not plan on selling my 355, I wanted to deal with this one time.
Thanks for your comments!
Chris |
Jon P. Kofod (95f355c)
Member
Username: 95f355c
Post Number: 278
Registered: 8-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, November 07, 2002 - 1:01 am: | |
Hans,
To my knowledge they are the exact same headers. Most headers will crack around 10-15 thousand miles. As little as these cars are driven I don't think FNA is too concerned about having to do it twice and under federal guidelines (EPA/DOT) I don't think emmissions parts are regulated past 7 years (in terms of holding the manufacturer liable for replacement).
The Tubi headers that I purchased are a much more "sturdy" design and a much thicker piping. A few of the 355GT's that were campaigned in the FIA Sports Car Championship back in the late 90's got two seasons out of them and this is with highly modified 355's that are putting out more power and heat.
Hope this helps.
Regards,
Jon
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Hans E. Hansen (4re_gt4)
Member
Username: 4re_gt4
Post Number: 426
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, November 07, 2002 - 12:21 am: | |
Are the 'official' Ferrari replacements a permanent solution? Or are they the same pipes that will split again? Is the Tubi (or other) a better (longer lasting) idea?
Just curious, as I am a potential 355 future owner. Someday. |
A.Tonokaboni (Senna1994)
Junior Member
Username: Senna1994
Post Number: 65
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, November 07, 2002 - 12:14 am: | |
I have a 95 355 Berlinetta with a Tubi and just had my Headers replaced by Ferrari of OC free of charge, they were very helpful and treated me very well. |
Jon P. Kofod (95f355c)
Member
Username: 95f355c
Post Number: 277
Registered: 8-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 06, 2002 - 10:18 pm: | |
Chris,
I had the same thing happen to my 95 F355 (Challenge). This has happened to many 355's especially ones that see track time. Before you install the Tubi check with your Ferrari dealer and FNA. Many folks were getting their headers replaced free of charge because FNA didn't want dealers trying to weld them (mine were welded at least four times).
If you bought your 355 through an authorized dealer and have been getting it serviced there FNA might replace them. From what Ferrari of Washington told me last winter, it's a case by case basis and a lot of factors come into play such as where the car was bought, where it was serviced most of the time, and other issues such as it being street legal and a US car.
FNA knows the history of my car (last 355 in the US converted to a Challenge car) and refused to replace the headers because it's a Challenge car. From what FOW told me the headers are technically an emmissions part and therefore FNA was replacing them for up to 7 years from the original date of purchase.
There is no "official" recall or service bulletin but in some cases they replaced them.
If you decide to go the Tubi route the best system is their Tubi GT racing exhaust which can be run unmuffled (or muffled) and with or without catalytic converters. This system was used on several 355GT cars that competed at the Daytona 24 hour races in 99 and 00. The Kuhmo sponsored 355GT that ran in 01 also had this exhuast I believe. The stock headers wouldn't even last 12 hours I would venture to guess but the Tubi system is much better.
I paid about $5100 for my system but have seen them as high as $7000 from dealers. Call Tubi direct.
Hope this helps. By the way your F40 looks awesome in Forza. You need to come up to the Glen sometime and run with the Empire Region. A guy there has an F40LM and a F40 GTE from the European BPR Series.
Regards,
Jon P. Kofod
1995 F355 Challenge #23 (last one built)
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magoo (Magoo)
Advanced Member
Username: Magoo
Post Number: 3427
Registered: 2-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 06, 2002 - 9:49 pm: | |
Chris, I know this seems hopeless and probably doesn't warrant discussion but wouldn't you think Ferrari would own up to this knowing it is a defect on their cars. Did you check it out through any Ferrari channels? It just seems it is a like it or lump it attitude. |
Cmparrf40 (Cmparrf40)
Member
Username: Cmparrf40
Post Number: 486
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 06, 2002 - 9:12 pm: | |
Well, last year when we rebuilt the heads on my 355 and brought them up to 1999 specs I tried to put on Tubi headers, but the only ones Tubi sold in the US were competition headers with no heat shields. I did not need them, but everybody said the factory headers would crack.
(You can not use the competition headers because of the heat, they tend to catch street cars on fire!)
Well, I heard that terrible sound about a month ago, and I knew I had a cracked header.
I knew it was just a matter of time, I have 4 355 friends that replaced at least one header in the last 5 months.
It does not seem to matter if it is a 95 or a 99, they just crack and you can not fix them.
I ordered new Tubi street headers for my F355 about a month ago, I just got a confirm that they will be here next Tuesday.
I already have a Tubi exhaust, so I will put on test pipes (mine is a '95)just to see if it gives any extra punch.
I will keep you posted!
If you own a 355 it is not IF you will need headers it is WHEN will you need headers!
Chris
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