| Author | Message | ||
| Toby T (Tobyt)
New member Username: Tobyt Post Number: 9 Registered: 3-2002 |
Let me expand a little. Having a Ferrari is a dream of mine. My first dream was to own a 69 Chevy Camaro which I still own. That was my teenage dream. I bought the car when I was 18 and I am 33 now. Ferrari is my adult dream.(other than getting married, buying a home and having kids)(been there, doing that) A Vintage Ferrari is what I want. A 330 of any type or a 250 GTE are my choices as they offer what I am looking for in a lifetime "investment" within my budget. I almost feel I am looking for a new addition to my family when I look for one of these pieces of art on wheels. I say investment as I do not want to be taken but I know I will drive the car as much as I can without wearing the car into another full restoration. Cars are built to be driven yes...I agree..It is a shame to see trailer queens. I work very hard for the money I earn.I will most likely will never be able to afford a f40 or 250 SWB, so this is so so very important that I make the right choice as a 330 is my ultimate as is a TR or GTO is to others. I just know in todays world there is a scam going on at EVERY level so I know I have to be very careful. Thank you all for the input so far. | ||
| David P. Smith (Dave330gtc)
New member Username: Dave330gtc Post Number: 3 Registered: 3-2002 |
My suggestion is not to buy an older Ferrari of this type for investment purposes only. These cars are made to drive. If you can get your money back when you sell it or even make a little, that is just an extra bonus. Buy the car if you want to have fun with it; not just to make money with. | ||
| Ken (Allyn)
Member Username: Allyn Post Number: 293 Registered: 10-2001 |
How I got my Europa may also be of interest. These are very rare in top condition although basket cases abound. I wanted a top car as I'm more in to driving than restoring. After many months, one appeared almost on my doorstep, in "Mint, pristine, showroom condition" according to the ad. It was not driven in 7 years except to pass emissions and get maintainence. Except for the 'storage' issues it was mechanically top rate and the cosmetics were not bad either, full records to the date of purchase as he was the only, original owner. Still, he asked a high price for what was not as pristine a car as advertised in spite of all its obvious good points. There were isuues with suspension, brakes and transmission leaks. I countered at 70% of his ask on the phone after seeing the car the day before. He got all insulted and virtually hung up on me! A month later I saw it for sale in an ad for a little less than his original ask. I called him with a slightly higher bid. He said lots of people saw the car and he was sure it would be sold soon. Another month passed and he calls me. He's moving to Europe and needs to sell; he asked only $1k more than my bid and we met in the middle at a price about $5k than his original ask. In spite of my "I gatta have it" and his "This is a perfect car", we got together at a fair price for both of us. The car was indeed *perfect* and $5k later spent by me is now even more perfect! That money was budgeted in when I settled on what I truly wanted to pay for that particular car. I'm not worried about "investment" as Europas do not sell for anything near what the cost of a full restoration costs but I bought the car to drive, so I'm a very happy camper! Maybe some runaway inflation will help my investment? | ||
| Christian (Christiank)
Member Username: Christiank Post Number: 307 Registered: 1-2001 |
Ferrari as an investment? This is the kind of story I am trying to sell to my wife but she is not buying it. Sorry, don't want to insult anybody here. | ||
| TomD (Tifosi)
Member Username: Tifosi Post Number: 492 Registered: 9-2001 |
if it was for investment only then you would not care about the tail and the car's joy,  We all understand. Seriously, it is very hard to predict the future of prices but if you want any hope of return on an investment you must get the best car out there, which this sounds like, but of course you want to pay a reasonable price - oh the classic catch 22. | ||
| Toby T (Tobyt)
New member Username: Tobyt Post Number: 8 Registered: 3-2002 |
I have not driven the car yet as it is still being completed. This car will not be driven much as it will be for investment only. My thoughts are... should I go for and pay 20 to 30K more for a nice America when I can find a great 330 GT 2+2? Production #'s are much less for an America and I like the tail of the car much better but I feel I would get as much joy out of a 50K+ 2+2. On the flip side the America might go up in value much faster than a 2+2. I also have to watch my cash flow. 75K expands my outer limits. Thanks for the imput all! | ||
| Christian (Christiank)
Member Username: Christiank Post Number: 306 Registered: 1-2001 |
Have you driven the car? Don't buy those cars just from looking at them! They are very old cars and drive like that, even in outstanding condition. Good luck! Christian | ||
| Alberto (Aabreu)
New member Username: Aabreu Post Number: 47 Registered: 9-2001 |
Perhaps my own experience may help you Toby: I started looking for a 308, saw about 6 cars, all beat to hell, so I decided I would bite the bullet and move up to a 328. When I looked for a 328, I looked at about 10 or so cars, passing a bunch of them because I was sticking to my guns about condition, records, books, tools, etc. As a result I ended up looking for about 10 months. In the end, I found an outstanding 328, with all records, all books and all tools, mechanically and cosmetically in excellent condition, but needing the belt service. Seller was asking about $5,000 more than what everyone was telling me and what the books said market was. However, based on my own search and actual asking prices, the differential was really more like $3,000 to $4,000 above market. Based on the cars that I had seen and speaking with a couple of collectors, I decided to buy the car for one simple reason: It was simply the best 328 that I could afford. I fretted and debated and stressed and went sleepless nights on account of the thought that I was going to overpay for the car. Now that I have it, I have ABSOLUTELY NO regrets. This taught me a valuable lesson about these cars: buy the absolute best you can afford, even if you have to overpay; cars in above average condition are worth the premium over current market, (that is, if you want a car in good condition, if you want to bottom feed, which it seems you don't, then forget it). The real question, which is what you are debating about, is how much to overpay for the best (once you are convinced you have found the best; there are a lot of overpriced "nice" cars out there which do not deserve a premium). My suggestion (with no basis on anything other than my recent experience) is that a 10% premium is reasonable, if you are really buying the best. Your car is a little over 10% above published market price, I would offer $70,000, which is within 10%, and possibly go up to $71,000 if I really wanted the car (this is on the basis of the price guide alone, I don't know anything about actual, street prices for 300 A's.) Good luck and I hope this helps. | ||
| magoo (Magoo)
Intermediate Member Username: Magoo Post Number: 2293 Registered: 2-2001 |
When it comes to buying any car human nature is human nature. The seller has a price in his mind and how low he will go. The buyer has a price and how high he will go. If the seller doesn't have to sell the car quickly to get his price he may hold out for the last dollar. If the buyer wants the car so bad, he must have it, then he will pay it. Be careful emotion can overcome reason at this point. Like Steve says offer what you think is right for the car. Your research should tell you something. There is a point of being had. Is that where you are???? BRGDS, | ||
| Toby T (Tobyt)
New member Username: Tobyt Post Number: 6 Registered: 3-2002 |
Thank you for the information but still...is it worth 75K when Cavallino only gives 65K to such a car. My gut tells me even with a car of this quality...its still not worth 75K but if I really want it...maybe so. I wonder then if this will be the highest valued 330 America ever? Did these cars once go for more? Will they ever get into the 100K+ range anytime soon? I guess I will have to keep soul searching. Thanks again! Anybody else? | ||
| Lee Sanders (Lsand007)
New member Username: Lsand007 Post Number: 3 Registered: 3-2002 |
Let me jump in here guys. I've seen it, driven it, etc. I know Mike and have also done business with him. If you want a 330 America, this is as good as it gets. You buy these cars on the quality of the mechanicals. The cosmetics are nice, but a great looking junker is still a junker. This car is rebuilt both mechanically and cosmetically. Sheehan wrote an article on this car's history in this month's Sports Car Market magazine. You should read it. Is it worth $75k? Yes if you want the best 330 America on the market. Buy the very best you can afford. Good luck. Lee Sanders | ||
| Toby T (Tobyt)
New member Username: Tobyt Post Number: 5 Registered: 3-2002 |
yes its 4975. I guess you have seen this car too. The car is beautiful but worth 75K? | ||
| Steve Magnusson (91tr)
Member Username: 91tr Post Number: 647 Registered: 1-2001 |
Toby -- I don't think it ever makes sense to try to convince the seller he's asking too much -- or are you trying to convince yourself to pay more? Why not just offer what you're willing to pay? PS SN 4975? | ||
| Toby T (Tobyt)
New member Username: Tobyt Post Number: 4 Registered: 3-2002 |
He is actually an editor for Cavallino and I am taking the market value from that mag., as they list all Ferrari's and the prices. I have had no reply to that subject but it is an "in progress" subject. I woould think that the car would have to be a 100 point car to get 10K over the highest level. | ||
| TomD (Tifosi)
Member Username: Tifosi Post Number: 486 Registered: 9-2001 |
when you point this fact out to him, what does he say? If he has a perfect example and he is an upfront guy- split the diff | ||
| Toby T (Tobyt)
New member Username: Tobyt Post Number: 3 Registered: 3-2002 |
The guy I am looking to buy off of is a well known Ferrari guy but he is asking about 10K over what the market is getting for a next to perfect example. | ||
| Toby T (Tobyt)
New member Username: Tobyt Post Number: 2 Registered: 3-2002 |
thanks I follow this guys restoration but I need someone who knows values etc.... THANKS | ||
| TomD (Tifosi)
Member Username: Tifosi Post Number: 485 Registered: 9-2001 |
toby here is your website for 330 america info http://www.tomyang.com/cars/ferrari.html?http://www.tomyang.com/cars/ferrari.htm | ||
| Toby Tripp (Tobyt)
New member Username: Tobyt Post Number: 1 Registered: 3-2002 |
I am looking at a 300 America and ned some help. THANKS!!!!!!!!!!!! This is my first post and first Ferrari purchase. |