| Author | Message | ||
| Aaron Williams (Aawil)
Junior Member Username: Aawil Post Number: 73 Registered: 8-2002 |
I wouldn't get upset about it. I went to a all american made show last fall and put in my newest camaro because it was already spotless for fun. The whole voting thing is a joke.It was just vote trading.You vote for mine I'll vote for yours type of stuff. I was quite dissapointed to see that. | ||
| Terry (Dogue)
Junior Member Username: Dogue Post Number: 219 Registered: 9-2001 |
Collin, I noticed you are selling your 308, I hope it isn't because you didn't get the result you wanted at the local Car Show!  Are you looking for a John Deere?? | ||
| Carl Roberts (Carl63_99)
New member Username: Carl63_99 Post Number: 36 Registered: 10-2001 |
Collin, The question is: did you have fun, and are you personally happy with your car? I've been judging at model car shows for almost 8 years, and see exactly what the other posts indicate. Popular vote categories get popular votes, i.e. everyone votes for what they like, NOT what is the highest quality out there. Most of the central Texas model car clubs have stopped popular voting in the contests because so few people actually take the time to fill out the card, and turn it in, that having 15 people vote when the gate attendance was 1000 doesn't seem like a popular vote. Then there is politicing, guys going around telling everyone to vote for their model. I saw once a guy was asking people if they were going to vote, and if not, give HIM their ticket! I haven't yet had the honor of kicking one of these jerks out of a show, but I'm hoping! I've had some category judges say that they were going to give a certain type vehicle first place because that was the car they loved. I had to correct them and explain that they must evaluate the quality of the work and award accordingly. If this was your first contest, you may not be familiar with the processes, and may want to spend some time chatting with the judges and see what they know and what they look for. Understanding where they're coming from is part of the contest. If you don't present it to them well enough, they won't see what you've got. I've got models that have won first place trophies, and not even places against inferior models at other shows. Case in point the Viper shown here. Came up empty handed at two shows, got first in category in two other contests, and got a best of award for best Mopar against about 17 other models at one of them. But I built it the way I wanted, and had fun doing it. bet your car is more fun to sit in than a '69 Camaro?  | ||
| Terry (Dogue)
Junior Member Username: Dogue Post Number: 206 Registered: 9-2001 |
The Porsche Club here holds a Sports Cars on the Green car show every year. They invite all the clubs. The Porsche Club does all the judging. One year the Ferrari Club brought 10 cars to this little show (about 60 cars total). They would judge all cars by chronology. One club member brought 3 cars all late 80's cars. Well there were only 5 cars in the late 80's class and he came away with a 3rd place. That was the only car that won anything. We had 2 cars that had just been delivered a 456 and a 360F1 and neither placed in the new car class. Almost every award went to a Porsche! They keep inviting us back, but there was a real sour taste in some of our member�s mouths over this. This year only 2 Ferraris showed, but one got a 2nd place award - the same car received a platinum at the FCA Concours here last October. Sometimes its Jealousy, sometime it is the wrong crowd or judges. Some shows care more about how polished the chrome is than weather everything is original. Hot Rod/American car shows are never Ferrari friendly, in my experience. It is still fun to meet the few that do care about your Ferrari and show that Ferrari owners are not jerks that don't mind sharing the experience, by showing the car. | ||
| ken rentiers (Rentiers)
Junior Member Username: Rentiers Post Number: 92 Registered: 2-2003 |
"I've spent some time south of the Mason Dixon line and it's a different world. <snip>... not to sound TOO insulting, but being born and raised in europe, and having lived in Boston and Los Angeles, I don't know if I could adapt to the redneck mentality very well" Wall shut mah mouth, all them Cavallino people at the Breakers last week was Rednecks! Shee-it! (spits) Last ah heard bein' raised in Europe just meant drinkin' warm beer and datin' hairy legged women! Damn you folks in Boston and LA are SO sophisticated! | ||
| James Glickenhaus (Napolis)
Member Username: Napolis Post Number: 692 Registered: 10-2002 |
Mike The same thing Shelby thought when Aggipou cut his belt and used it to make a hindge for the tail section that Bruce brought back to the pits. You could only use items that were in the pits to repair cars at LeMans and after Ferrari protested the duct tape because it didn't hindge Aggipou used Carol's belt to make a hindge. Best Jim | ||
| Ken (Allyn)
Member Username: Allyn Post Number: 745 Registered: 10-2001 |
People who collect muscle cars generally have done hundreds of hours of restoration on them. They have worked hard to get them in to the shape they're in, and the judges take all that in to account. When you bring your Ferrari, the perception is you bought the car as is and just drove it over expecting a prize. I had a very frustarting experience myself. I entered my 1972 Lotus Europa in an exotic show against Ferraris, Lamborghinis, other Lotus', etc. My car is not concourse but shows well. I've spent hundreds of hours and many thousands of dollars restoring this lovely car. Well, I lost to an off the shelf Esprit with cool paint and a Contach that was stock. The coolest cars like a Muira and some exotic I never even heard of were ignored as well as several vintage Ferraris. So, I had a great time and learned that I love my car more than the public...but I don't have it for the attention from others. I have it for myself. | ||
| Mike B (Srt_mike)
Junior Member Username: Srt_mike Post Number: 62 Registered: 12-2002 |
James, What did Helmut think of being thrown down by Bruce at LeMans? ;) As for the show - don't let it get to you. I've spent some time south of the Mason Dixon line and it's a different world. I remember being in Missouri and people were talking about the new Chevy pickup coming out, while I was more interested in the latest M3. I have friends who worked at some of the big 3 and used to relate stories of being afraid to drive their non-US made car to work, for fear of it getting keyed, etc. That's one of the big reasons I don't know if I could live out that way... not to sound TOO insulting, but being born and raised in europe, and having lived in Boston and Los Angeles, I don't know if I could adapt to the redneck mentality very well | ||
| Modified348ts (Modman)
Member Username: Modman Post Number: 461 Registered: 11-2001 |
Having been to a lot of car shows in the past and entered a few I learned that if you enter your car at a particular event you have to know what their judgement is based on. Just because you have a high dollar exotic don't mean you'll even place. Hey if it makes you feel any better when I entered my 348 with a lot of mods done to it from interior to exterior I didn't get anything out of it and the judging sheet showed mostly zeros as you can see it was totally sabotashed because the main reason why was the person who judged my car was in the similar type of business in aftermarket accessories, he's just a jealous A-Hole but didn't stop the car from winning best exotic at the next show where he didn't judge. | ||
| Horsefly (Arlie)
Member Username: Arlie Post Number: 830 Registered: 5-2002 |
The fact is: No matter how much one reveres their Ferrari, Corvette, Dusenberg, Mustang or whatever; there are plenty of folks out there who couldn't care less about your beloved automobile. It's just not their cup of tea. Some guys build chrome plated show cars and spend years of their life perfecting those cars that appear to me to be nothing more than gaudy, tacky, red-necky, money pits that would make a ratty mobile home look GOOD. But to each his own. | ||
| Collin Hays (Chaysintexas)
Junior Member Username: Chaysintexas Post Number: 56 Registered: 4-2002 |
Duesenberg?? Why...I thought that was a ... blimp! No? | ||
| Alex McNaught (Alexm)
New member Username: Alexm Post Number: 7 Registered: 5-2002 |
Think of it this way instead... How would a John Deere place at a Ferrari show? Perhaps back on the farm he could take solace from his friends on how the Ferrari folks didn't pick such a great machine and how they couldn't relate .. I mean, what was WRONG with them? :-) Alex. | ||
| BretM (Bretm)
Advanced Member Username: Bretm Post Number: 3201 Registered: 2-2001 |
"the women are all corn fed" Henry, LMAO | ||
| robert biscan (Tn_ferrari_bob)
New member Username: Tn_ferrari_bob Post Number: 4 Registered: 1-2003 |
I think Mike is right. If you do it for the fun of the event to talk cars and look at others thats great. I think it is possible you got a good number of votes but the counters were only tracking their buddies cars. Basically you were in Indian territory. Must of been a real nice JOHN DEERE. | ||
| Mike Fisher (Mikef)
Junior Member Username: Mikef Post Number: 168 Registered: 11-2001 |
I know the feeling. I entered a regional charity car show and they put my Maserati Merak in the KIT CAR class! But it was a lot of fun. I was amazed at some of the younger crowd and how passionate they are about their low riders and rice rockets. Conversly, I entered the Cavallino Classic this year with my 77 308, and boy did I get shot down. After having extensive work done by a Ferrari dealer, I had no idea how much non original and incorrect pieces they put on my car. But it is still a beautiful car and I enjoy it immensely. If I only entered to win something I probably would not ever do it again. It's the fun that counts. | ||
| Henryk (Henryk)
Member Username: Henryk Post Number: 518 Registered: 8-2001 |
I entered a local car show with my 88 TR, here in Wisconsin. All winners where American muscle cars. The people liked to look at the Ferrari, but......NO VOTE!!!!! I once entered a TVR Griffith........they didn't have a CLUE about the car......NO VOTE!!!!! Most guys here are into NASCAR.....drive Chevy pickups.....and have 1/4 mile dirt track cars that they race. The women are all corn fed. No more shows for me. I'll just enjoy cruising with it during the summer months. | ||
| DES (Sickspeed)
Advanced Member Username: Sickspeed Post Number: 2578 Registered: 8-2002 |
Awesome. | ||
| James Glickenhaus (Napolis)
Member Username: Napolis Post Number: 689 Registered: 10-2002 |
Des The dirt and the dent in the tub sill that was made when Bruce McLaren threw down his helmut and ran off to retrieve the tail which had blown off on the Mulsanne are still there... | ||
| Frank Parker (Parkerfe)
Intermediate Member Username: Parkerfe Post Number: 1851 Registered: 9-2001 |
I held a car show for my daughter's high school drama dept. a few years back. A friend of mine brought his 250TdF which was in Pebble Beach condition. He failed to place and the show was won by a 1967 Corvette. The people who voted at the show were American car fans. Most didn't even know what a TdF was. | ||
| DES (Sickspeed)
Advanced Member Username: Sickspeed Post Number: 2575 Registered: 8-2002 |
James, do you still have the dirt...? | ||
| James Glickenhaus (Napolis)
Member Username: Napolis Post Number: 687 Registered: 10-2002 |
I wouldn't take personally. I own a Duesenberg that won in class at Pebble Beach, A major prize at Louis Vitton, and is a CCCA National prize winer. All of this happened before I bought it at auction. It is very beautiful but when I tried to drive it it was a disaster. I took it to Sal at WWOC and we took it apart. The spare tire was filled with water. (Probably from washing it to often) The exhaust diverter that is cockpit controllable was rusted closed which caused the car to overheat cracking the exhaust headers. The wheel bearings were gone. The grease had turned to cement. Brake lines were crimped. The instruments didn't work. Gas lines were rusted. 80 bolts were corroded. Brake cylanders were worn out. Only the surfaces that faced the Judges had been painted. When I get done it will run and everything will work. This car was a national prize winner but except for driving off the trailer, onto the field, and back onto the trailer it hadn't been a car for years. At another famous concours a Judge looked at my MK-IV and said distainfully:"There's dirt under the headlight covers!" "That's true" I answered "but that dirt is from LeMans." Many Judges wouldn't know a great car if it bit them on the ass... | ||
| BretM (Bretm)
Advanced Member Username: Bretm Post Number: 3199 Registered: 2-2001 |
I don't know that beer drinkers necessarily envy wine drinkers especially considering that what many spend on doing a trick American car could buy them a 355 or 360 if that was their thing. I think they just don't care, just as most people would respond to a 57 Chevy showing up at an FCA concourse. | ||
| Bruno (Originalsinner)
Intermediate Member Username: Originalsinner Post Number: 1014 Registered: 5-2002 |
It was all envy. You were a wine drinker with a bunch of budweiser boys. | ||
| William H (Countachxx)
Intermediate Member Username: Countachxx Post Number: 2062 Registered: 2-2001 |
why did you go to a car show where they display tractors ? probably a bunch of dumb jealous hicks | ||
| Mike Charness (Mcharness)
Member Username: Mcharness Post Number: 282 Registered: 8-2002 |
My 308 has won "1st in Class" trophies at more than a half dozen non FCA car shows. If there is a Sports Car class, you'll generally do very well against other cars. The "people's choice" thing depends totally on the crowd that the particular show draws, so you might want to avoid shows where those are the only awards. | ||
| Jeff Green (Carguy)
Junior Member Username: Carguy Post Number: 180 Registered: 10-2002 |
Hey Collin...I've been there and done that too. In the past I've always had vettes. The nicest being a nuts & bolts resto. '63 split-window coupe. This car was darn near perfect, and I frequently lost out to "lesser" quality vettes. A gold '86 with all the body-cladding you could stick on usually showed up to the same shows and would always beat me. I mean the wheel wells were dirty, tires brown from tons of tirefoam, it was abismal. These guys are right, popular vote shows favor big family and big friends, not the best car. All my vettes up to my ZR-1 have been near concours...but no trophys to show for it. Just bloody knuckles and dry skin. We have a large car show here in May, and a Lambo Diablo comes down regularly from Richland. The car causes a huge stir, people taking pictures next to it...kids with big grins....there is a constant crowd around it. But he has never got any recognition either. It's what the great unwashed masses identify with....nostalgia and memories. Granted a lot of cars do deserve to win on their own merits. But more often than not it's the ol'd buddy system that determines the winners. I just wish that those that win understand that a trophy does not a great car make, and that they know deep inside that perhaps another's car was nicer than theirs but it's owner was not "part of the network". But I can hand them their heads when I take the Testarossa out on cruise night! Traffic Stops! | ||
| DES (Sickspeed)
Advanced Member Username: Sickspeed Post Number: 2562 Registered: 8-2002 |
Collin, like John Ames, i would just laugh it off- definitely seems a little unusual that you couldn't make it into the top 40, but i guess the people there were really into the american muscle-- now losing to a tractor, that's something to roll on the floor about- you definitely weren't in the right event... i hope you brought something home with you- a score card or something, just to hang up to remember it by; you'll definitely laugh about it, down the road... | ||
| Eric Eiland (Eric308gtsiqv)
Member Username: Eric308gtsiqv Post Number: 624 Registered: 11-2001 |
It is an interesting phenomena, Collin. Ben brought up a very interesting point as well -- most, if not all, of the local shows are hosted by the local car clubs (hot rod / muscle car) and they really push the membership thing....so I'd venture to guess that there is some good old pattin' on the back going on. But, like John said, sometimes it's quite nice being in the minority. | ||
| Ron Thomas (Ronsupercar)
Member Username: Ronsupercar Post Number: 479 Registered: 5-2002 |
You shouldn't take your Ferrari to a Nascar Event just the same.. | ||
| Collin Hays (Chaysintexas)
Junior Member Username: Chaysintexas Post Number: 55 Registered: 4-2002 |
Hey don't get me wrong... it's not the end of the world. But sure is interesting. Actually John I DID get beat out by a couple of VW's. Just wanted some input to see if this was unusual - not needing a shrink or anything. | ||
| John Ames (Ameshouse)
Junior Member Username: Ameshouse Post Number: 80 Registered: 1-2002 |
Most people at these kind of shows are reminiscing about cars they remember, or have owned. Most of them have never even seen a Ferrari let alone remember them from their youth. We were at a show last year with our 1980 308 GTSi and there was only one other foreign car. It was a copy of "Herbie" the Volkswagen. Guess who won the foreign car plaque... We laughed when we heard him boasting to his friends that he had to beat a Ferrari to win it. Life is too short to worry about not winning a trophy. Besides, you own a Ferrari. What else do you need?? | ||
| Ben Lobenstein 90 TR (Benjet)
Intermediate Member Username: Benjet Post Number: 1013 Registered: 1-2001 |
"It was strictly a peoples vote event" - meaning you didn't bribe the right (or enough) judges ;) -Ben | ||
| Dave (Maranelloman)
Member Username: Maranelloman Post Number: 831 Registered: 1-2002 |
Matt, LOL!!!  | ||
| Rob Lay (Rob328gts)
Board Administrator Username: Rob328gts Post Number: 3811 Registered: 12-2000 |
I take the 328 to many muscle car shows as my friend has a very nice muscle car collection. It's usually 50-50 how things will go. Sometimes they love you because they don't see many Ferraris and other times I get my butt kicked in the 80's class by Buick Grand Nationals, which are nice cars BTW. | ||
| Eric Eiland (Eric308gtsiqv)
Member Username: Eric308gtsiqv Post Number: 622 Registered: 11-2001 |
If it makes you feel any better Collin, I've had the same experience as well. Have shown the 308 at quite a few local area car shows in the past year, and have yet to even get an acknowledgement from the event "officials" that my car was even there. The crowd loves it, as they do other "exotics" as well; but, for some reason, the antique/muscle-car/hot rod scene always steals the show in the judging dept. I like to bring the car to the shows just to annoy them . Plus, it's just another excuse to polish her up, and drive her! Must say, though, that the owners of most of the cars at the shows are great people, and I enjoy meeting them and talking about all sorts of cars. They are really into the hobby, and most really know their stuff -- even when it comes to Ferrari's. | ||
| Dan Gordon (Ferruccio)
New member Username: Ferruccio Post Number: 14 Registered: 2-2003 |
I live in Kansas and we just had a car show last weekend and there wasn't a Ferrari or a Lamborghini there. I think most people from the Mid-west like American cars and can't even give Exotics a chance. I think its mainly for 2 reasons: 1. Most people in the Mid-west rairly see any Ferraris therefore they believe (wrongly) that Exotics cost a fortune. They think they will never be able to afford one so its hard to let themselves "dream" about that car. 2. They grew up with American cars. | ||
| Collin Hays (Chaysintexas)
Junior Member Username: Chaysintexas Post Number: 54 Registered: 4-2002 |
Oh, yeah, I forgot to tell yuh....the show wuz in Amarillo (Amuhhh Rilluhhh) Texas. Does that splain anything?? Good thoughts so far. | ||
| Matt Lemus (Mlemus)
Advanced Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 2622 Registered: 8-2002 |
You also should have entered it as a Pontiac Fiero | ||
| Matt Lemus (Mlemus)
Advanced Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 2621 Registered: 8-2002 |
you should have put a gun rack in the rear window. | ||
| Ken (Allyn)
Member Username: Allyn Post Number: 742 Registered: 10-2001 |
Sheeet, is that a feerin job? Ain't seen nothin like that 'round these parts. Meebe it's one of dem keet cars? Hey Ma, looky dat combine over there! Now THAT'S suweeeet!! | ||
| Dave (Maranelloman)
Member Username: Maranelloman Post Number: 829 Registered: 1-2002 |
Clearly, the show's focus--whether announced or not--was domestic iron/muscle cars. Sounds like the crowd didn't know what to make of one uh them thar furrin Eye-talian jobs.  | ||
| Collin Hays (Chaysintexas)
Junior Member Username: Chaysintexas Post Number: 53 Registered: 4-2002 |
I entered my 1982 308 GTSi in a local car show this weekend, and I didn't even make the top 40!! What is up??? I need some input!!! Here are the facts: - Show had 320 cars - mostly T-birds, vettes, mustangs, and street rods - older cars. - Almost no imports, and certainly no other Ferraris. - My car is darn near perfect, and IS perfect to the naked eye. - My location was exceptional, and crowds of people thronged around my car snapping pictures, etc. throughout both days. - It was strictly a "peoples vote" event, with the top 40 vote-getters getting a prize. My 308 lost to marginal vettes, mustangs, etc., even a JOHN DEERE TRACTOR for pete's sake. I am stumped! Especially after I busted my *** for 3 weeks getting the car ready. Ideas or theories as to how a near mint red Ferrari can get beat out by at least 40 other cars????? |