| Author | Message | ||
| Jim Schad (Jim_schad)
Intermediate Member Username: Jim_schad Post Number: 1202 Registered: 7-2002 |
I think taking the time to be informed is the key. I had no idea on the range of prices before this I found this site. I didn't know about services being so important and I didn't know about reputable dealers vs the shady ones down Martin's way. If I had suddenly won the lottery I would have driven to or flown to the closest dealer and plopped down whatever their price was. Then when the car had problems I would have just assumed it was part of the Ferrari package. I think some are still intimidated by the Ferrari mystique. I still admire it, but I am not affraid of it anymore. It is just a car, the owners are just regular folks some with more money than others, but still just people. | ||
| P. Thomas (Ferrari_fanatic)
Junior Member Username: Ferrari_fanatic Post Number: 217 Registered: 4-2003 |
Jim, the money in lieu of time is known as "Opportunity Cost". If I do "X" I could not do "Y" therfore it is cheaper for me to just pay more. What is the probabilty that the seller can find ANOTHER bonafide buyer that shares in his philosiphy?? (very small market segment). Also, if this guy makes 2 Mill per year, there was a much more simple solution: Um, here is a concept: hire a broker! He can find the perfect car for him, provide MULTIPLE choices, and will work for a flat fee. | ||
| P. Thomas (Ferrari_fanatic)
Junior Member Username: Ferrari_fanatic Post Number: 216 Registered: 4-2003 |
In ANY dynamic (versus static) market, you are going to have sellers that "took such great care of their asset (house, car, whatever) through maintaince, improvments, etc., that THEIR asset is worth significantly more. Question is: does the market recognize the "Value", and can you actually find someone to consumate the deal at that price?? The goal of appraising ANYTHING is a "Paired Analysis". This means what has recently SOLD that is in every respect identical to yours?? If it is not 100% homogeneous then you have to make SUBJECTIVE agjustments up or down REPRESENTING what the MARKET perceives. F-Cars are pretty homogeneous, as there are (sometimes nominal) differences in mileage, maintaince, # of previous owners, etc, etc. The variables regarding condition, price, etc, run the whole gamet. The fact remains the same: Many of the people that visit this site ARE buyers. Many are very affluent and it has been a business practice not "waste any money" regardless of their net worth. In selling ANYTHING at the highend of the market, you will have to penetrate a market segment that perceives the high end widget to carry that extra value. Here is my concern: The F-Car market is relatively small. There are many people that can easily afford an F-Car. Due to priorities in their lives they never follw their dream. So as far as BONAFIDE (ready, willing, able) buyers are concerned, you are dealing with a relatively small group. If you are at the high end, YOU HAVE JUST NARROWED your market. Question remains: Right, wrong, or indifferent, can this seller find the "Needle in the hay stack", ie the ONE buyer that either 1) Does not care?? 2) Values his time more than the difference in sales price 3)Is not informed??? | ||
| Jim Schad (Jim_schad)
Intermediate Member Username: Jim_schad Post Number: 1200 Registered: 7-2002 |
I think Ricky's point is that if you make $2mil a year then your time to find a bargain is worth more than the money saved. He could possibly have been working on a deal and made $100K in the same time. Kind of like a brain surgeon volunteering to hammer nails for the habitat for humanity. His time/value would better be spent doing free brain surgery. I for one am poor so please beat those prices down!!!!! | ||
| Frank K Lipinski (Kaz)
Member Username: Kaz Post Number: 283 Registered: 11-2002 |
The price one pays is a value judgement... Last year I bought my 97 355 Spider from F or SFO. One owner - pristine, sold and serviced by same dealer. Asking $122 - Bought for $115 - included in sale was fresh 30K. Dealer charges 7,500 for the service, so now sale price is 107,500. During the service they also replaced the water pump and discovered a small crack in the exhaust rail on one bank. Rather than weld, they replaced both manifolds. Included was a 12 month - no mile limit - FNA warranty..let's say that's about 1500...so now my real price is down to 106,000. The car runs perfectly. Took 1st in a car show last month and I have piece of mind with the warranty (I'm doing a cross country run next month). I looked long and hard before finding this particular vehicle. It was "just" what I was looking for, and to be truthful would have even paid a little more if the dealer would not have moved on the price. I saw similar cars on the net and private party for 87K (salvage title), high 90's but failed PPI, had a story or the car in person did not meet my expectations. My budget permitted me to buy a 360, but I wanted a 355...exactly like the one I bought..and represents a value to me in smiles per mile, pride of ownership and achieving a personal goal. I would do it all over again... | ||
| Rob Lay (Rob328gts)
Board Administrator Username: Rob328gts Post Number: 4810 Registered: 12-2000 |
Yes, dealers will be the most trust worthy when it comes to warranties. Some independents do great warranty work too. James Patterson at Norwoods stands behind his work very well. I didn't even know something should be under warranty after he did my 30k, but 2 years later would say something was. I didn't even buy the car from him, just had the 30k done. | ||
| Frank Parker (Parkerfe)
Intermediate Member Username: Parkerfe Post Number: 2275 Registered: 9-2001 |
There is an advantage to buying from an authorized dealer as well as having a major service done there. Its called WARRANTY and their ability to stand behind the warranty. | ||
| Vincent (Vincent348)
Junior Member Username: Vincent348 Post Number: 240 Registered: 4-2003 |
I agree. You don't make money by throwing it away. Some of the most finicky (pricewise) buyers and clients I have are patient enough to look around and learn before they follow their impulse. | ||
| Mike B (Srt_mike)
Junior Member Username: Srt_mike Post Number: 181 Registered: 12-2002 |
Just because someone over pays for a car it doesn't dictate the market, just like someone getting a great price doesn't dictate the market. Someone has to be at the top and someone has to be at the bottom of the "what did you pay" scale. For what it's worth, usually the more affluent folks are the ones who are more careful with their money. Just my experience. | ||
| Rob Lay (Rob328gts)
Board Administrator Username: Rob328gts Post Number: 4808 Registered: 12-2000 |
Allan and I agree!!! It's the end of the world.  Ricky, I understand your friends position, actually I don't, but I can imagine. $10k really isn't going to break the bank either way for him. For some the best piece of mind is the A+ dealer treatment. Ferrari of Dallas has been just absolutely perfect through the purchase of my 355 C. I couldn't of asked for anything more. I did get a great price for it too though. | ||
| allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Member Username: Allanlambo Post Number: 484 Registered: 6-2002 |
I dont think anyone gets to financial security by throwing money away, regardless of whether you make 200,000 or 2 million a year. Just because you buy a car from Ferrari dealer doesnt mean it is any better than a proper car from an individual. Using my recent purchase of a 1997 355 Spider with 5500 miles, absolutely pristine, all service records, one owner car for mid 80's as a reference, id say anything over low 70's was too much. | ||
| Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
Member Username: Rickyn_f355 Post Number: 326 Registered: 8-2002 |
hey rob, everyone is entitled to an opinion... i pay $375 a year to carry a platinum amex card, so why wouldn�t I want to pay $10,000 more for peace of mind of buying a clean ferrari from an authorized dealer. My particular friend makes $2 million a year and i know he couldn't give a rat's ass about whether he paid $10,000 or $20,000 too much for a car...what he does care about is time, and that lack of it so for him the extra $10,000 he spent more than made up for the time he would have had to spend looking for a car...same thing went for me when i was looking I can respect the fact that some may think buying from an authorized dealer is stupid, but i would just argue that both a $20 prostitute from hunt's point in the Bronx and a $2,000 Vegas call girl are both female (hopefully) but clearly the they are in different leagues. I would argue that the people who do care about prices do log onto FC and are not the typical Ferrari buyers so maybe there or 2 or even 3 different markets for these cars�it�s all about an individual�s indifference curve and what he ranks higher or lower in terms of what he can do with that incremental dollar. So, I stand by my original post. | ||
| Rob Lay (Rob328gts)
Board Administrator Username: Rob328gts Post Number: 4805 Registered: 12-2000 |
Again Ricky, I think your perception of the 355 market is high. No one, including your friend likes to hear they paid the high end of the market for their car. That's why most dealers ask $10-15k above what is realistic, because most buyers don't have FC and don't know what you can really get these cars for. | ||
| Jonathan Peck (Jonathanp)
Junior Member Username: Jonathanp Post Number: 53 Registered: 7-2002 |
Scott, Thank you for your call. It was nice talking with you. Thank you Byron, I look forward to hearing from them. By chance can you send me their name so I know who it is when/if they call? Thank you again, Jonathan Peck 214-289-8915 | ||
| Jonathan Peck (Jonathanp)
Junior Member Username: Jonathanp Post Number: 52 Registered: 7-2002 |
Thanks Ricky | ||
| Byron (Bmyth)
Member Username: Bmyth Post Number: 650 Registered: 10-2002 |
Jonathan, I may have a buyer for you. I will provide your contact info to him. | ||
| Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
Member Username: Rickyn_f355 Post Number: 325 Registered: 8-2002 |
Jonathan, i hear ya... P.S. Scott, I'd jump on Jonathan's offer...sounds sweet...95s sound better and have a touch more HP too... | ||
| Jonathan Peck (Jonathanp)
New member Username: Jonathanp Post Number: 50 Registered: 7-2002 |
Ricky, I will agree with you that alot of members on this board come up with some amazingly low numbers on cars. Although they have to come up with the number somewhere, one or two cars being sold at low numbers shouldn't dictate the entire market.... Scott, If you are interested, I have a 95 355 Berlinetta available to me: Rossa Corsa with Tan 9K miles fresh 30K service(within the last 6 months and few hundred miles) Absolutely pristine car. I can sell the car for $84-85K Car is located in TX. Call me if you are interested, Jonathan Peck 214-289-8915 | ||
| Ricky Nardis (Rickyn_f355)
Member Username: Rickyn_f355 Post Number: 321 Registered: 8-2002 |
these guys will tell you that anything over $70,000 is a rip off but most of them are 18 years old and couldnt afford the cover for the car and the others think ebay is a real market or that wholsesale is something every american is entitled to...if the car is mint and you are getting it from an authorized dealer i'd pay mid to high $90s. Take $5K to $10K off that it its a private seller who perhaps has to liquidate. I bought a clean 955 GTB w/ 15K miles almost a year ago for $91 from an authorized dealer. My buddy just bought a 96 GTB with 7,000 miles from an authorized dealer and he paid $94K. | ||
| Jonathan Peck (Jonathanp)
New member Username: Jonathanp Post Number: 49 Registered: 7-2002 |
Scott, Wholesale pricing on that car would probably be in the high $70's to low $80's or so.....But as always, the car is worth what you will pay for it if it is the "right" car for you and your desires... | ||
| Scott DeGhetto (Scott63)
New member Username: Scott63 Post Number: 28 Registered: 4-2003 |
I have located a 97 355B red/tan car that has 21K miles on it. It has all books, records, tools, etc. The 30K service has been performed recently and a new clutch has been installed. It is a one owner car that has been dealer maintained. The only extra on the car is a Tubi. What would be a good price/offer. Thanks, Scott |