| Author |
Message |
Edvar van Daalen (Evandaalen)
Junior Member
Username: Evandaalen
Post Number: 139
Registered: 10-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, June 01, 2003 - 12:52 pm: | |
Wayne, the worldwide used VIN system is a certain ISO standard. This standard doesn't oblige that the tenth digit should represent the model year. On the other hand, the USA has more demands regarding the VIN: the ninth position should always be a check digit, and the tenth should represent the model year. So, on all cars made for the USA, the tenth digit is the model year. However, Europe just uses the ISO standard, so here it is NOT obliged to have a model year or check digit. It's the choice of the manufacturer what the meaning of the character is. I hope this helped a little bit ... |
L. Wayne Ausbrooks (Lwausbrooks)
Intermediate Member
Username: Lwausbrooks
Post Number: 1771
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, June 01, 2003 - 11:14 am: | |
"...the only Ferraris whose 17-digit VIN states a model year are those made for either the North American market or the Middle East market."
Unbelievable. All I can say to this is that the rest of y'all need to get with it! :-)
Seriously, I learn something new every day. Is this the same for all new cars, or is it only the case for Ferraris? |
Edvar van Daalen (Evandaalen)
Junior Member
Username: Evandaalen
Post Number: 138
Registered: 10-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, June 01, 2003 - 9:27 am: | |
May I add one more extreme case: a car was built in November 1994. The first owner never registered it, as he wanted to keep it in his private museum. The first registration was in March 1996. So, is it a 1994 car? a 1995 car? a 1996 car? Or do we need to look at import papers or something like that?? Nice food for thoughts, right :-) |
Mark Collins (Markcollins)
Junior Member
Username: Markcollins
Post Number: 233
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, June 01, 2003 - 9:22 am: | |
Wayne
I'm sure it's not perfect but when a car's age is determined in the UK it is sold as the year it was registered to it's first owner and a V5 document (similar to your pink slip?) is issued.
It may be that with volume models the vehicle has sat in a field for a year or more!
Gerald
i can see from the lack of an age related VIN character that it can cause problems in markets where these are used |
Gerald L. Roush (Ferrmktltr)
Junior Member
Username: Ferrmktltr
Post Number: 72
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, June 01, 2003 - 6:16 am: | |
Wayne, to the best of my knowledge the only Ferraris whose 17-digit VIN states a model year are those made for either the North American market or the Middle East market. In all other markets the ninth and tenth digits in the 17-digit VIN are a 0 (that's a ZERO).
This is a constant problem with gray market cars. Let's use the F355 Berlinetta as an example. S/N 103934 was built in November 1995 (per data plate in door) as a USA model and is a 1995 model--full VIN is ZFFPR41A8S0103934. But if it were a European version its 17-digit VIN would have been ZFFPR41B000103934, with no model year designation. If it was first registered in many European countries in Dec 1996 then its paperwork would indicate it to be a 1996. Say it gets sold to the USA gray market . . . What model year is it?
Now the other extreme. USA model F355 Berlinettas made in July 1994 were declared by Ferrari to be 1995 models, for example ZFFPR41A7S0100037. Now a European car built in the same time frame and sold new in Europe in, say, September 1994 would carry the 1994 designation!
|
L. Wayne Ausbrooks (Lwausbrooks)
Intermediate Member
Username: Lwausbrooks
Post Number: 1769
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, May 31, 2003 - 8:17 pm: | |
Mark/Gerald, wait a minute here. I don't see how the country in which a car is sold or the date a car is registered could in any way affect the model year designation. As Gerald stated regarding Ferraris, model year is designated by the manufacturer and is reflected in the 17 digit VIN number assigned to the car. Is this not international?
Being in the new car business, I can tell you that the current trend is for manufacturers to launch new or heavily revised models in the spring or summer of the previous year. For example, an all-new-for-2004 model might be launched in Spring of 2003, that way its introduction doesn't go unnoticed amongst the multitudes of model year updates and change-overs that occur in the fall. Regardless, its VIN will reflect that it is a 2004 and not 2003 model. |
Gerald L. Roush (Ferrmktltr)
Junior Member
Username: Ferrmktltr
Post Number: 70
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, May 31, 2003 - 7:45 pm: | |
It is not true with USA Ferraris that the cars that come out in September would be considered the next year's model. As Steve points out, the USA model year as declared by Ferrari has to do with configuration, not build date. In other words when Ferrari declares a car to be thus-and-such a model year in the 17-digit VIN they are stating that the car meets all the USA federal requirements for that model year (and they do change from year to year). Ferrari has been known to start declaring cars to be the next year's model on examples built as early as June--I have seen June 1981 production 308 GTSi/GTBi whose 17-digit VIN states they are 1982 models (i.e. 10th digit = C) and in other years December dates of production on cars that were not yet declared to be the next year's model.
Also because of problems with different models meeting the new model year standards there have been years in which different Ferrari models new model year dates of production have varied by a month or more.
You mentioned October 1995. For the USA market cars manufactured in October 1995 (as well as November and some December) were still declared by Ferrari to be 1995 models (i.e. 10th digit = S).
Now a question for members in other countries. Using Mark's answer, a car made in October 1995 but first registered in January 1996 would be a 1996 model? So what about a higher serial number car, manufactured in November 1995 and first registered in November 1995. Is it then a 1995 model even though it has a higher serial number and later production date? |
Steve Magnusson (91tr)
Intermediate Member
Username: 91tr
Post Number: 1833
Registered: 1-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, May 31, 2003 - 2:37 pm: | |
JON -- US model cars are defined by "model year" (which really describes their configuration rather than their build date), and it's part of the VIN (10th digit) -- see:
http://www.ferrariclub.com/faq/vin.html |
Mark Collins (Markcollins)
Junior Member
Username: Markcollins
Post Number: 231
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, May 31, 2003 - 2:35 pm: | |
In the UK it's the date registered so would be a '96. In addition we also often see following 'model year' being released in September or so, so ias an example it's common on volume manufacturer cars to see a car advertised as a registered Oct '02, 2003 Model year |
JON BAER (Bobaer)
New member
Username: Bobaer
Post Number: 31
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, May 31, 2003 - 1:58 pm: | |
What year would you consider a F355B with a build date of October 1995, where the first owner registered the car in January of 1996. Would this car be considered a 1995 or 1996. I know with american cars, the cars that come out in September of (2003 for example) would be considered a 2004. Any idea? |