| Author | Message | ||
| Malcolm Barksdale (Malcolmb)
New member Username: Malcolmb Post Number: 40 Registered: 4-2002 |
why does this thread repeat so often? A few hundred dollars for piece of mind seems a good idea to me. I think it is not about liability, except to yourself. | ||
| Frank Parker (Parkerfe)
Advanced Member Username: Parkerfe Post Number: 2536 Registered: 9-2001 |
If you are getting a bumper to bumper warranty from an authorized Ferrari dealer, no. If not, you need a PPI. | ||
| Norm (32storm)
New member Username: 32storm Post Number: 25 Registered: 5-2003 |
Get a 3rd party to inspect it. That's assuming of course that it's beyond your capabilities. as Martin stated, there may be problems that a dealer may not be aware of. Hey dealers do get stuck with problem cars from time to time. One may slip by them in trade. But, that's their problem, just don't let it become yours. | ||
| Steve Burns (Sjb509)
New member Username: Sjb509 Post Number: 7 Registered: 6-2003 |
Martin, Thanks for the advice. I didn't think of the legal side of it. I guess my skepticism comes from when we bought our BMW from an authorized dealer and they did their PPI on the car. $1200 later we had a PPI and warranty until 100k, which was fortunate since it has saved us a few times that amount in repair bills for the car in the last two years. When we left in was supposed to be in "perfect condition" but was in the shop about four months/6k miles later for new brakes (very normal driving, not covered under the warranty but should have been disclosed in the PPI). This experience was what made me question the real value of the PPI performed at the same dealership as the car is for sale. I know someone will post that BMW is not Ferrari, but the fact is that dealerships are there to sell cars. Just some of them realize that the guy buying the 348 now might be buying a 575 or 360 later, and they should ensure that their dealership will get that second sale as well as the first. | ||
| Ron Vallejo (Ron328)
Junior Member Username: Ron328 Post Number: 195 Registered: 3-2003 |
PPI, IMO, should be done by a third or independent party. Though finding one who'll do it for you may not be easy depending on where you live. In my case, the Ferrari mechanic I talked to wasn't willing to drive 4 hours where the car was located. He wanted it brought to his shop. But the dealer (NOT Steve Harris)wanted me to pay for the car first before it is brought to the mechanic for PPI. Oh, well... PPI, as you know, is not an assurance. Where does it end? Well, as you stated...you just have to accept that the dealer is trustworthy. There's some gamble in it. It's easy to get neurotic about it. I'd say I was lucky. I know where to get my next Ferrari. | ||
| larrybard (Larrybard)
New member Username: Larrybard Post Number: 10 Registered: 6-2003 |
Martin, with all due respect I think that for a number of reasons it's inadvisable (to put it mildly) for anyone to have the same selling dealer perform the PPI. Even if -- and I suspect this is rarely if ever the case -- the dealer is willing to warrant for some time that the car is essentially perfect (or any "imperfections" are scheduled). Obvious conflicts aside, there will inevitably be, for example, subjective judgments concerning wear, appearance, etc. and parts which will fail in the future and thereby raise the issue of whether the untimely failure could have been predicted at the time of sale by a careful inspection. And yes, I know that many sellers (dealers and otherwise) get into post-sale controversies with buyers when parts happen to coincidentally fail soon after the sale is consummated -- though the seller did not know, and indeed may not have reasonably been able to tell, that there was an impending problem. | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Advanced Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 4870 Registered: 5-2001 |
Steve, first of belts very very very rarely snap. In fact when you do a belt service you will see the belt looks just fine and like new. The tensioner and pully bearings is what fails and causes the belt to jump, not snap. As for the PPI you can have that done at the same dealer. It may look idiotic but if you get written report from that dealer that everything is fine and it is not when you receive the car, you have legal recourse. It is a fraction of your purchase price and well worth it, trust me. I recommend it to all my clients. Those that don't will have to sign a release of liability from now on, since I got burned on a deal where the customer elected to not have one done and actually negotiated on that, then turned around and sent me his lawyer on my back for some stupid stuff like a burned out light bulb and other pedly stuff. | ||
| Steve Burns (Sjb509)
New member Username: Sjb509 Post Number: 6 Registered: 6-2003 |
And at some point you have to accept that the dealer is trustworthy. Thank you all for the responses so far. | ||
| Steve Burns (Sjb509)
New member Username: Sjb509 Post Number: 4 Registered: 6-2003 |
If you are already at a reputable dealer, who do you have do the PPI? The same dealer? Most places in the US are not Southern CA, Texas, New York or Florida where there appear to be many dealers, both good and bad. For instance, if you are in Denver, Ferrari of Denver would pretty much be your only choice. If you are looking at a car there to start with, who would you have to do the PPI? If a car came to them in trade needing a 30k for example, why wouldn't they do that knowing it will help the car sell? They can perform the service significantly cheaper than it would cost you or me, probably less than the difference in sale price for doing it versus not. So in the end they make money on the service, AND sell the car easier, AND have a customer with a car with no immediate service requirements. This brings up another point. Who is to say that the last service record wasn't falsified? Belts with 30k miles about ready to snap can look the same as belts with 1K, right? Should everyone be getting PSI as well (post service inspection)? Don't get me wrong, I see the value of a PPI, but where does it end and you just accept the fact that you buying a 10, 20, or 30 year-old car that will have problems. | ||
| Ron Vallejo (Ron328)
Junior Member Username: Ron328 Post Number: 193 Registered: 3-2003 |
Hi Steve. PPI is highly recommended when buying second-hand Ferrari's BUT... in my case, w/o PPI, I bought an '89 328 from Steve Harris Imports last year and have been very happy with it. Your 2nd paragraph applies very well to this very reputable dealer. Martin, just the fact that you do your best to identify and "fix" all the problems to the best of your ability before selling a car makes you a "reputable" dealer. | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Advanced Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 4866 Registered: 5-2001 |
Steve, from experience: There is no reputable dealer! Sometimes we, the dealers, are not aware of problems that can come out at a PPI. I try to get everything done on a car before I sell it. That does not mean that the car has to be 200% perfect but only that we fixed what we saw and what needed to be done. A PPI is always a wise idea no matter where you buy. Thank you BTW for your confidence, gladly apprechiated. $500 off on your next purchase  | ||
| Jim E (Jimpo1)
Intermediate Member Username: Jimpo1 Post Number: 1913 Registered: 7-2001 |
The answer to your question is, are you willing to trust that the dealer you're buying it from has integrity? Just because they're a dealer doesn't mean they're honest. ALWAYS get a PPI. | ||
| Steve Burns (Sjb509)
New member Username: Sjb509 Post Number: 3 Registered: 6-2003 |
Does anyone have an opinion on this one? This is my question, if I were to buy a used 308/328/TR from a reputable dealer (such as Bobileff, Cavallino, Ferrari of "X", etc), would you still need to get a PPI before purchase? It seems to me that they would have performed their own PPI before taking the car in trade to make sure they are not getting stuck with a neglected car in poor condition. In addition, it would be in their best interest to present the car to a new buyer in a straightforward manner to build trust with the new Ferrari owner. Ferrari owners in general seem very loyal to the brand and dealers by the posts on this board, and you'd think the reputable dealers would like to nurture this loyalty. Keep in mind I'm not talking about the fly-by-night Ebay joints, or private sellers. PPI for them should be mandatory (kind of like a $300 "truth insurance policy"). I am talking about well-known and trusted dealers that have been mentioned on this board. Thanks |