| Author | Message | ||
| David W Burnett Jr (Dbdreams)
Junior Member Username: Dbdreams Post Number: 80 Registered: 3-2003 |
Mike,Modman and MikeB, Good advice, I also am a tinter by trade. Personally I use SunGard but I am friends with most of my local competitors and it seems we all have preferences even among the same brands sometimes just a different line. MikeB........That is a very strong point "I'd rather have 3M film installed perfectly than whatever is "the best" installed badly." I would definatly agree but I would say that I'd rather have any decent film installed perfectly than whatever is "the best" installed badly." I also hate to hear someone trying to sell me something say that everything else is crap. Brand of film or how long it will last isn't necessarily the most important thing to think about. Proper installation is. As someone suggested earlier that tint is not permanent, it can be removed although sometimes costly and a mess. I think all Tinters will agree there is no one film that is immune to film failures. Even the so called "best" have had their share of bad films. So do your best to get the best installer. Feel the tint guys out, the one who will actually be the one doing the work. In your case try to pick one who isnt bubbling over about your Ferrari but one that definatly respects the magnitude of responsibility about to be bestowed upon him. Again from another angle Ferrari or not the windows on the sides are very similar to any other normal car. The back window on a 308 would be the only thing I would see as somewhat of a challenge. Since you only want the sides done that is just one thing you dont have to worry about. As I said I prefer SunGard but here are some other popular brands that seem to have a good reputation Solar Guard Llumar 3M Johnson Madico (I hate) and of course my fav SunGard All of the above make several lines of film having a choice of a low line to higher grades. I think it is safe to say that all have some that is crap and probably all have some that is good. So here is what I suggest, Never go with a low grade film in any brand. Some films hold up differently in different areas and climates and each professional will have their preferances by what has worked best for them. What works best for one may not work well for another. But if you choose a reputable shop that has ben around for a while they will probably know what works best for them. Think about it, No successful and reputable shop will intentionally use cheap tint that will only cause him headaches down the road and possibly ruin his name. Another credit to Mike's sugestions, Ask the local "car guys" be it Mustang club, Honda, Corvette or whatever, who do they prefer? You can bet what Mike said is true, one name will come up over and over. Set expectations before hand, look at other cars they have done. Make sure their work has acceptable fit and finish. The film should look clean and optically clear and should be free of foreign material such as dust, hair and in the worst of cases bugs. (I have seen it all) Cleanliness is the key to a good tint job. If the tinters personal car looks good ask him if you can expect the same level of professionalism on your car. | ||
| Modified348ts (Modman)
Member Username: Modman Post Number: 655 Registered: 11-2001 |
Mike B, I agree with you there on any shop saying that everything is "junk" except what they use and I never intended even if it sounded that way but I did explain well on how to choose a shop. There are a lot of film products out there but only a couple of products I could even consider. Many like yourself are not going to know what product is better without the tools and knowledge of tinting. Some products could last a decade if the car is not in a hot climate area, mostly foggy, or parked oftenly under shade or in a garage. For example I have tinted a car for a person who lives in the Bay Area (S.F.) with a cheap dye film guaranteed for only 3 years and did one for another car in my area which gets really hot and sunny in the summer and obviously the one here where in Sacto. showed age and the one done for the car that resides in the Bay Area showed so very little age that the only way you could tell is place the original "new" film next to it. Also very important, don't let the looks fool you, check it through a meter and you'll be surprised how much have degraded in such a short time especially in my area. I will always be able to show my customers what they are paying for and compare against most all known products, and that is not me saying everything else is junk but what I'm saying is I can prove what I compare against "is" junk. I always say, seeing is believing but most importantly don't let your eyes fool you, catch 22 - understand what you see... | ||
| Mike Procopio (Pupz308)
Member Username: Pupz308 Post Number: 407 Registered: 10-2002 |
Modman, Mike B, Martin, and other folks helping out on this thread--thank you very much for your help. The last two posts have been especially informative. I think I'm going to go ahead and do this once I find the right shop... I'll post back how she looks! Thanks again guys and take care... --Mike | ||
| Mike B (Srt_mike)
Junior Member Username: Srt_mike Post Number: 249 Registered: 12-2002 |
Mike, I've had several cars done, and I think I understand what you were saying to Modman in your last post  I found what worked for me was to go to the shop and just talk to the folks. No offense to Modman, but whenever someone tells me "everthing else is junk, except what I use" I tend to get suspicious, becaure rarely are some things wonderful and others junk. I've had 3M film on 3 cars and one of them still has it after 9 years and it still looks the same as the day it was applied. Maybe there is something better - I don't know and all I know is what I have is satisfactory for me. I'd rather have 3M film installed perfectly than whatever is "the best" installed badly. As for the shop, the place I use is pretty picky. They will tell you right up front what they do, how they do it, etc, etc. I'd just ask to see some of their other work, and MOST importantly, I'd set expectations up front. That's usually the problem. If you're a picky SOB, let them know. Tell them you plan to inspect the job very very closely and if you see anything wrong, that you will refuse the work - so ask if they can handle that. Tell them you'll pay more if necessary for a "perfect" job - but MAKE SURE you set expectations up front. Some things from my experience that should be discussed 1) Will they use a single piece of film per window? (answer should be yes) 2) Will they guarantee it will be bubble and distortion free when it's fully cured (it may appear bubbly and distortioned when it's still wet, IME) 3) If there is a problem, what will they do about it? What if they consider something "no big deal" but for you it's a problem? SET EXPECTATIONS! 4) Check other work to be sure there is a small but perfectly even gap between the tint and window edge. Is it raggy like it was cut by hand or does it look "from the factory"? 5) Ask if they see anything about your car that will be difficult? For example, on rear windows the dot-matrix stuff can cause problems. Ask them what they can do for you and if there is anything you need to know first I wouldn't worry about it TOO much. Talk to some of the local "car guys" and I bet there will be a shop name that will pop up again and again. Go there. | ||
| Modified348ts (Modman)
Member Username: Modman Post Number: 653 Registered: 11-2001 |
Finding the right tint shop will take some effort as there's so many of them as some of these shops opened up thinking it would be a gold mine and most people who get their cars tinted don't know what to look for as far as perfection. You could go to each shop and ask for a live demonstration in comparison to other film products and ask what they use in their solutions that they use to mount the film. Years of experience means nothing so don't bother asking how long they've been doing it. Have the warranty from the manufacturer shown to you and see if they have a policy of 100% parts and labor warranty. Ask if they do all back glass seamlessly, and check out some samples of work they are currently working on and not some work done on their own cars. Ask for some aged samples if they have any. Don't be fooled just because they have done some high end cars it means they know how to tint good, I've seen some really bad jobs done from the so called high end shop, and going to SEMA in Las Vegas seeing all the terrible tint jobs makes me wonder how the hell people can accept such rashy workmanship. I could go on and on about this topic but this should be a good start when looking for a shop. Also ask to see if they have other brand names to compare with. I am currently using the brand of Llumar and testing Madico films. | ||
| Mike Procopio (Pupz308)
Member Username: Pupz308 Post Number: 405 Registered: 10-2002 |
Thanks guys for the help. Modman, given that I can't drive to your shop, what can be done? Granted, it's your business, and you know your stuff. It sounds like you're very successful with it and know your stuff well. That said, do you think there's a tint shop in the entire state of New Mexico that would do a decent job? I say this somewhat sarcastically--surely I could go into some of these places and come out pretty satisfied... Or not? If not 3m, then want brand products do you use? What are some other alternative brands that are acceptable in your eyes that might be more commonplace? If the lifetime warranty is for knuckleheads, should I specifically avoid it? Seriosuly, it's clear I need to read the fine print on the various warrantys that I encounter for what's covered. Here's my problem, modman. I've learned from you that not all installers are the same and finding a good one can be tough. I'm asking for criteria to compare the shops with--materials, warranty, etc. I'm looking for some high-level, "best practices" that a good shop does that I can identify. If installers aren't formally "certified," then what do they mean when they say that they are? How do I ensure I don't get a trainee and get somebody more experienced? Usually, I find that the shops will put their more experienced installer on the rarer jobs... But even with all this, right now, I still don't have a lot to go on as far as choosing a shop. Any practical advice? Because otherwise, right now the picture of the shop that uses 3m, seems well-managed, and has a portfolio of pictures of other "exotics" and their tint jobs is currently in the lead. BTW, I don't plan on tinting the back window. How can I make a meaningful decision here? I appreciate your help. | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Advanced Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 4914 Registered: 5-2001 |
Modman is in the biz, better take his route then! Makes sense what he said. I can only tell you I tinted my office windows and they came out great although I have two left hand. My friend did it on my BMW and that came out great, although not easy with the back window. He also did my wife's MB and good. Well, maybe he does use the better product. | ||
| Modified348ts (Modman)
Member Username: Modman Post Number: 651 Registered: 11-2001 |
You guys are talking my language but you have it all wrong here fellas, most of you have the wrong answers here, where to start.. Well there is a legal film you can put on the drivers and passenger front windows which is legal in ALL 50 states and only one company makes it which is UV shield, an 88% film which is the best UV film the industry has to offer. And no just because you can tint some basic 5 windows don't make you qualified to be a tinter or a know how. 3M - Junk, I've tested films of all known makes in every category- distortion, adhesion, UV breakdown, clarity, defects per square ft., discoloration, fading, scratch resistance, and shrinkage. There is no known certification in tinting, unlike doing electrical work. Lifetime warranty don't mean SH** , a knucklehead falls for that remark. Lifetime does not mean a free redo, the manufacturer pays only up to a certain price which usually is much less than an average job and you pay for the removal which is more labor than putting the film on. Why come back for warranty for a shi* job in the firstplace? Yes tinting requires good prepwork and proper solutions for cleaning and mounting, a lot of dopeheads use dishwashing soap mixed with water for mounting, real dumb if you ask me, ever see dishwash soap dry? that's is now between the glass and film which equals to bubbling which can also occur from improper heat forming. If you are looking for a good tint shop they should be confident enough for you to bring any sample from any competitor and have them test show you a comparison against theirs, we do and we prove you in all reasons why we prefer to use the products we use and we have a view from the showroom where the customers can see our methods and car used to perform the job. I never suggest going to a shop who charges cheap, think about it... Our prices are determined by the expense of the products we use and the pay which goes to the highly trained installer, not a new trainee or a think he knows how to tint person. How many years a tint shop has been in business does not necessary mean they have experience, it could be a bad habit never broken if you know what I mean. A tint shop can buy a cheap roll for under $60. or you can buy one for $400. as an example for 20" wide film. And all back windows should be seamlessly tinted without seams no matter how curvy it is. We are still testing currently new products as we speak and I have to say that most films out there are real bad in the common areas of clarity and fading or changing colors. Warranty does not cover purple tint by the way, only fading to clear, bet you didn't know that! well now you know.. I have clienteles from all over drive as far as 350 miles to have their windows tinted knowing it would be perfect and the car leaving in the condition they came in with care to the vehicle. Is your car worth the gamble to some unknown person working on your car? I've experienced plenty of that in the past so now I know much better from this. Hope this helps answer, correct, and clarify some of your answers and questions. | ||
| Fred (I Luv 4REs) (Iluv4res)
Member Username: Iluv4res Post Number: 434 Registered: 8-2002 |
Mike, See how long the shop has been in business. Also, see if they give you a lifetime warranty. Although difficult to remove, tint isn't permanent and can be done-over if it bubbles/fades/tears,etc in the future. A reputable shop w/ a warranty should eliminate your fears. Also, since few F-cars are tinted, they may feel obligated to do a great job by taking their time. | ||
| Mike Procopio (Pupz308)
Member Username: Pupz308 Post Number: 404 Registered: 10-2002 |
Actually, it's for three reasons. 1. Heat--New Mexico is one of the sunnyest places in the U.S.! 2. Looks--the tint on the side windows is a very nice effect IMO, and should be particularly interesting against the metallic brown of my car. 3. Privacy. I'll talk about my car to anybody, photos, rides, etc. Sometimes at night, I get freakshow types (they come out at night, though) pulling up along side to me at stoplights to talk trash or some other BS I'd rather not have take away from the experience, you know? Not being an ass, but sometimes it does happen. Sometimes, I'd just assume have the windows up and not have eye contact ;). Martin, thanks for the insight. I've got a couple of places that are beginning to feel alright by my "gut". I'll probably do this next week and will report back here. (Still not 100% sure, though.) I definitely want to stay with the car while they do it, so we'll see how that works out. | ||
| Paul Bianco (Paulie_b)
Member Username: Paulie_b Post Number: 368 Registered: 1-2003 |
interesting....don't ususally see Ferrari windows tinted. I guess most owners want everyone to see who's driving! | ||
| stephen r chong (Ethans_dad)
Member Username: Ethans_dad Post Number: 335 Registered: 3-2002 |
Mike, Be sure they are careful around the read deck glass. Those curved corners will require some thought. Otherwise, as Martin said, very straight forward. Here in CA, the drivers front and passenger doors are not permitted to have any form of non factory treatment. Please post some pics when it's done. I'd love to see the results! | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Advanced Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 4886 Registered: 5-2001 |
Mike from my limited educaion on this subject: 1. There may be a state law prohibiting you from tinting your sid windows dark. Check that out first. The tint place should know. In FLA you can not tint the side windows of the drivers front and passenger front more than 25%, front window only 10% which is usually worked in by the manufacturer. Most car tints are 60-80% and are only alloed on rear windows and back window if you have a passneger side mirror. 2. A friend of mine has a tint place and since there are so many and so many doing it for peanutz he has to do it for peanutz as well and that means he has to find alternative means of making additional income eg instaling car alarms. What I am trying to tell you is that it is not brain surgery and anybody that has done 5 windows can do your side windows on a Ferrari, which are straight glass without a problem. You shoudl be able to do it yourself if you want to tackle this. Use the guy that has the most cars in his lot and ask if he can squeez you in and you can be there with the car. Give him an extra $5 or $10 if you feel you need to make sure No sweat my friend. Its all good and easy! | ||
| Jim Schad (Jim_schad)
Intermediate Member Username: Jim_schad Post Number: 1441 Registered: 7-2002 |
I know in the archives (5 months ago?)Modman who does tinting in Cali was telling the pros and cons to various types of tint. | ||
| Mike Procopio (Pupz308)
Member Username: Pupz308 Post Number: 401 Registered: 10-2002 |
Hey guys, I've decided to tint the side windows on the 308, and am looking for a reputable shop to do it. Martin (Miami348ts -- Cavalino Motors), you seem to be very knowledgeable about this--and if anything, have opened up my eye that some shops know what they're talking about and doing, and some shops are just "OK" (or worse). My question is how to pick a shop? I've got a fat phonebook with the yellow pages open to window tinting. I see a bunch of places, all with that "you've tried the rest, now try the best" feel going on. One or two stand out (e.g. www.tinttrimfactory.com/, which uses 3m products apparently). I've had a friend use a smaller place and he said it was fine, so there's one reference. I don't want this to be an arbitrary choice, and I'm not worried about a price variance of 10% to 15% for getting a reputable place... A lot of these places are auto sterio/alarm shops combined with tinting... A lot of these places are home glass tinting AND auto glass tinting... My feeling is that I'm looking for a place that specializes in tinting and that doesn't do car audio? How should I choose? What things can I ask--e.g. certified installers? Brand of tint used (3m)? Application method? Thanks for your help, guys... --Mike |