| Author | Message | ||
| Faisal Khan (Tvrfreak)
Member Username: Tvrfreak Post Number: 365 Registered: 3-2003 |
You sure it's bigger than the Paris and Dubai airshows? Impressive either way! | ||
| Sunny Garofalo (Jaguarxj6)
Member Username: Jaguarxj6 Post Number: 630 Registered: 2-2003 |
The Air Force runs Air Fete run out of RAF Mildenhall, UK once a year. The F117-A and the B2's do land and are on static display, the F117-A's less then 10 meters away from the crowds. After the show, the B2 still does have some light security around it. It all depends on the ground crew and/or SF's (security forces or whatever they're called now) if they will let you pose for pictures w/h an exotic, for the family, etc. Its prostitution, nothing more. If the $$$ wasn't there, they wouldn't continue to throw the show year after year. It pulls in millions and is the single largest fund raising event in the Air Force and is the largest Air Show world wide. | ||
| Mark PDX (Markpdx)
New member Username: Markpdx Post Number: 50 Registered: 4-2003 |
 | ||
| Robert W. Garven Jr. (Robertgarven)
Junior Member Username: Robertgarven Post Number: 189 Registered: 2-2002 |
Yes, The B1 & 2 are old technology now. My friend had an open house at area 51 and let me take my car there to check out some of their new stuff. I didn't get a ride but he said just like the Enzo the carbon fiber on the dash was a poor fit and finish.  just kidding guys! | ||
| L. (Testaroja)
New member Username: Testaroja Post Number: 33 Registered: 5-2003 |
the gt40 is a brit car also | ||
| L. (Testaroja)
New member Username: Testaroja Post Number: 32 Registered: 5-2003 |
the Cobra its more a british icon than american. | ||
| Rick (Srt10)
New member Username: Srt10 Post Number: 17 Registered: 5-2003 |
Mike B. Wrote: "Actually, you're wrong. That is a real pic, and I know the guy who'se car it is." Mike B. is correct, and I have been given permission by the owner to use this photo, since we own identical cars. | ||
| Mark PDX (Markpdx)
New member Username: Markpdx Post Number: 46 Registered: 4-2003 |
Doesn't look like hi res images are available. The pic is from an article in European Car magazine. Here is a link to the article and a few more pics. Stealthless: A three-day road trip in Lamborghini's Murcielago AF.mil has lots of hi res pics available but (not suprisingly) they don't have any of the Lambo. FWIW here is the Holloman AFB site which has some F-117 pics Holloman AFB It isn't too hard to get "interesting" pics of military planes. Somewhere I have pics of my old Toyota parked next to a NASA F-104 Starfighter and also one of the X-29s which have very cool looking forward swept wings. | ||
| Mark PDX (Markpdx)
New member Username: Markpdx Post Number: 45 Registered: 4-2003 |
Sorry Taek, I don't have a hi-res version of that pic right now but have an idea where it might be found. Will email it to you if I find it. It isn't exactly Italian exotica but I do have a high res version of this pic.  | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 1310 Registered: 11-2002 |
Murcielago with flaps open!! Wooohooo!!  Do you have that pic in hi-resolution? Cheers | ||
| Mark PDX (Markpdx)
New member Username: Markpdx Post Number: 44 Registered: 4-2003 |
Another interesting pic...  | ||
| Dino Micalizio (Ingenere)
Junior Member Username: Ingenere Post Number: 59 Registered: 12-2001 |
Lest we forget the Cosworth Vega.....ahhhhh...what a car! | ||
| Me Myself (Kid_enzoz)
Junior Member Username: Kid_enzoz Post Number: 65 Registered: 4-2003 |
I'll take a Callaway C12 thank you.  | ||
| LionsFan54 (Lionsfan54)
New member Username: Lionsfan54 Post Number: 12 Registered: 3-2003 |
Mike, I stand corrected. To me that picture seems amazing. Also, to the best of my knowledge, the B-2 is never on static display at an airshow. Yes, it will do a fly over, but it doesn't land. | ||
| Terry Springer (Tspringer)
Member Username: Tspringer Post Number: 636 Registered: 4-2002 |
The B2 is not as closely guarded as you may think. Some tour groups have been given access and the AF has flown one to various airshows. I believe the big EAA meet at Oshkosh had one. They dont let you climb all over, its roped off, but you can shoot photos. To my understanding the stealth technology in the F117 is level I.... and obsolete. The B2 is second generation but still not on a par with the stuff they have now. Remember... the AF still runs a skunk works and they fly stuff they dont advertise. The Cobra is an English car, at least just as much as an Sunbeam Tiger. | ||
| Mike B (Srt_mike)
Member Username: Srt_mike Post Number: 265 Registered: 12-2002 |
>>>>>I'm calling "photoshop" on that B-2 pic. The security around those planes is out of this world. With an estimated price over $500 million EACH I don't think you can roll one out to take a picture with your Viper.<<<< Actually, you're wrong. That is a real pic, and I know the guy who'se car it is. There was a show put on by some AF guys where this pic was taken. The B2 is a closely guarded plane, but it's not like they don't see the light of day. | ||
| Mark PDX (Markpdx)
New member Username: Markpdx Post Number: 40 Registered: 4-2003 |
I think the AF has made some improvements to make the plane less "fragile" to the elements, but they will find ways to screw up the planes anyway. IIRC last november the AF "dropped" a B-2. While in for maintenance at Whiteman AFB some airman got the bright idea to pull safety/locking pins from the landing gear of the B-2. He then pushed some part of the landing gear to an "unsafe" position which then collapsed. The AF has been pretty tight lipped about what damage the B-2 suffered but there were at least five people injured. | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Advanced Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 4983 Registered: 5-2001 |
What do you mean?? personal, hangar... you mean I can not park that baby in my garage and do basic maintenance work myself? The occassional oil change? put her on a lift and unscrew the plug? It would definetely get my neighbors attention when I crank her up in the morning to go to the office at 7am | ||
| LionsFan54 (Lionsfan54)
New member Username: Lionsfan54 Post Number: 11 Registered: 3-2003 |
Yup, those are some fragile, yet amazing, birds. There are even rumblings that exposure to rain can have a negative affect on its low obervable properities. I promise I'm not trying to split hairs, my only point was that true cost for a multiyear gov't project (much of it still "black" and top secret) as complicated as making a 170 foot wide plane essentially disappear from radar is almost impossible. According to this site (http://www.af.mil/news/factsheets/B_2_Spirit.html) the unit cost is closer to $1 billion (although I think that number is suspect as well) | ||
| rich (Dino2400)
Member Username: Dino2400 Post Number: 296 Registered: 10-2001 |
I can think of a certain "American Car" that certainly does NOT suck. (think Glickenhaus). I remember attending the vintage races at Laguna Seca when the viper was the "safety" car. The old cars would go screaming through turns three through five, at amazing volume and really looking the part. Then the viper came around for a lap before picking up the next race. It made basically no sound, totaly stuck to the road and clearly travelling faster than the race cars had been. The thought: "my how things have changed!" (but give me the old cars anyway!) | ||
| Mitch Alsup (Mitch_alsup)
Member Username: Mitch_alsup Post Number: 814 Registered: 4-2002 |
With the development cost, and the number of purchased B2s, the delivery cost of each B2 is over 2 Billion. Maintanence, service, hangere, personel, training, and use is extra. Simply take the contract price the government paid and divide by the number of aircraft delivered. "they stay in their hangars with the doors close 95% of the time" This has to do with the fact that the epoxy resin used to hold the carbon fiber together degrades in sunlight! | ||
| randy g (Ragilber)
New member Username: Ragilber Post Number: 37 Registered: 5-2003 |
yes, i agree. vipers would be ok if there were no ferrari's. | ||
| LionsFan54 (Lionsfan54)
New member Username: Lionsfan54 Post Number: 10 Registered: 3-2003 |
Mitch, I said "estimated" for a reason. The total cost of a piece of hardware like that is almost impossible to pin down. If someone like CNN wants to sensationalize the price they will factor in costs like base staff, maintenance over the course of the year etc. In other words, there is no MSRP on something like that. No window sticker to point to. Bottom line, it's an amazingly restricted piece of hardware to even look at (they stay in their hangars with the doors close 95% of the time), nevermind parking a car in front of for a personal picture. | ||
| Ken (Allyn)
Intermediate Member Username: Allyn Post Number: 1027 Registered: 10-2001 |
I wonder what a belt change on a B2 costs... | ||
| Mitch Alsup (Mitch_alsup)
Member Username: Mitch_alsup Post Number: 810 Registered: 4-2002 |
"With an estimated price over $500 million EACH" The B2 cost much closer to $2 Billion than $500 Million! | ||
| BJ (Bjkim)
Junior Member Username: Bjkim Post Number: 119 Registered: 10-2002 |
I think, vipers are the best if there is no Ferrari. I personally take viper over corvette or Cobra. | ||
| Rob Lay (Rob328gts)
Board Administrator Username: Rob328gts Post Number: 5413 Registered: 12-2000 |
OT | ||
| Ken (Allyn)
Intermediate Member Username: Allyn Post Number: 1026 Registered: 10-2001 |
American cars are big on plastic luxury and short on quality of design and engineering. No car better represents that than the 1972 Ford LTD. | ||
| DJParks (Djparks)
Member Username: Djparks Post Number: 358 Registered: 2-2003 |
Just to set the record straight. The F-117 Fighter, the B-2 Bomber and the B-1 Bomber are NOT invisible to radar but because of the contours and facets coupled with a signal absorbing coating on the surface of each aircraft, the return signal sent by the radar is reduced to that comparable with the size of a bird (in the case of the F-117) at closer range. At longer range the aircraft don't show at all because of the weaker return signal. The B-1 is old technology and returns the largest signal. DJ | ||
| melo yelo (Meloyelo)
Junior Member Username: Meloyelo Post Number: 81 Registered: 5-2002 |
If you are talking AMERICAN - then all of you have overlooked the TRUE American car - made by who else - AMC. The PACER wins hands down. What a view from the cockpit of this classic. All that glass giving that panoramic view. Ahhhhh - I can still remember the time my friend backed his Pacer into a Delorean. What a dream! Oh - and those other cars you mention are not bad either. MY | ||
| DES (Sickspeed)
Advanced Member Username: Sickspeed Post Number: 4851 Registered: 8-2002 |
american cars suck. | ||
| randy g (Ragilber)
New member Username: Ragilber Post Number: 34 Registered: 5-2003 |
i have also owned a Viper and i must say its night and day between the Viper and my Testarossa. There simply is no comparison. After owning the Testarossa, the Viper seems, well, kinda like lame. sorry, i hope and dont intend to offend anyone just my personal experience. | ||
| Jeff Howe (Ferrari_uk)
Member Username: Ferrari_uk Post Number: 370 Registered: 12-2002 |
Don't Pintos go with a bang ?! | ||
| LionsFan54 (Lionsfan54)
New member Username: Lionsfan54 Post Number: 9 Registered: 3-2003 |
I'm calling "photoshop" on that B-2 pic. The security around those planes is out of this world. With an estimated price over $500 million EACH I don't think you can roll one out to take a picture with your Viper. | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Advanced Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 4977 Registered: 5-2001 |
An American Icon: The Pinto! (my vote) | ||
| Paul Bianco (Paulie_b)
Member Username: Paulie_b Post Number: 408 Registered: 1-2003 |
I'll go with the Corvette. I owned 4 before going to Ferrari's. | ||
| Andrew-Phillip Goalen (Andrewg)
Junior Member Username: Andrewg Post Number: 100 Registered: 9-2002 |
Yep the AC Cobra is an american Icon, made in England! with the design based on the Ferrari 166mm | ||
| thomas daniels (Castex)
New member Username: Castex Post Number: 11 Registered: 6-2003 |
No, no, no, no. European metal is the only variety worth considering... The only tank I like is the corvette C5R which raced aux Mans in yellow. What a sound! All night long!! Oh, and the GT40 of course. The old one. That roadrunner thing's a real hoot, too. Meep, meep! All right, I've changed my mind | ||
| Yoshi Ace (Tiger_ace)
Junior Member Username: Tiger_ace Post Number: 85 Registered: 5-2003 |
Corvette, absolutely. Traded in 98 for 328. Although new 2004 model doesn't appeal to me now. I hope Chevy will change looks of the car. Mustang, especially Cobra & GT. My 69 Mustang Conv. always get compliment at gas station. Trans Am. Everyone can say it is American car by just looking at it. Classic. I really like Formula model. Viper. I almost bought one instead of 328. I may own it someday. | ||
| Dave Penhale (Dapper)
Member Username: Dapper Post Number: 722 Registered: 4-2002 |
vancooper, Except it showed up on the UK radars on a visit a couple of years ago! | ||
| Jeff Howe (Ferrari_uk)
Member Username: Ferrari_uk Post Number: 368 Registered: 12-2002 |
If we're talking American iron, I go for the big block Hemi' in a Dodge 'Cuda or similar any day ! | ||
| Ralph Koslin (Ralfabco)
Member Username: Ralfabco Post Number: 309 Registered: 3-2002 |
WRONG. No front plate ? Where is your inspection sticker / bar code ? | ||
| Mark PDX (Markpdx)
New member Username: Markpdx Post Number: 39 Registered: 4-2003 |
"Officer, there is just no way you clocked me doing mach 1.4"  Vancooper - Compared to fighter aircraft the B-2 is relatively slow. But considering it is a heavy bomber it is certainly no slouch. The "high speed" looking B-1 is essentially a subsonic aircraft as well. Although it was originally designed as a supersonic bomber the addition of stealth features, primarily serpentine intake ducts, have limited it's top speed. The F-117 Stealth "Fighter" pictured above is also a subsonic aircraft. | ||
| Guillaume (Vancooper)
Junior Member Username: Vancooper Post Number: 78 Registered: 10-2002 |
Isn't that the B2 stealth bomber? if so I heard on a show that it doesn't need to fly very fast since it's totally invisible to radars! A flying wing basically! | ||
| Drstranglove (Drstranglove)
Member Username: Drstranglove Post Number: 598 Registered: 4-2003 |
Nice plane!!!! DrS | ||
| Robert W. Garven Jr. (Robertgarven)
Junior Member Username: Robertgarven Post Number: 188 Registered: 2-2002 |
Your right, Ferrari's are nice but I would rather take the stealth bomber! :-) | ||
| PSk (Psk)
Member Username: Psk Post Number: 587 Registered: 11-2002 |
Hmmm, I think to me the American iron has to be an early Camaro (say '67) or a fastback GT Mustang. Cobra's have never done it for me, even though I have raced against and watched them scream passed ... I guess those that grew up with the Ferrari versus Cobra battle have a different opinion, but unfortunately being a NZ'er I did not witness this  . Now the Cobra Coupe is awesome ... but again not typical of American iron. Pete | ||
| Mitch Alsup (Mitch_alsup)
Member Username: Mitch_alsup Post Number: 806 Registered: 4-2002 |
I like american Iron, just put mine in a GT40. | ||
| Tyson Hall (Trhall)
Junior Member Username: Trhall Post Number: 96 Registered: 6-2003 |
Nice car Rick. | ||
| Rick (Srt10)
New member Username: Srt10 Post Number: 16 Registered: 5-2003 |
Tony, You found my weak spot. Almost built a 40th anny with a 510 CID last year. Maybe next time. | ||
| Ernesto (T88power)
Intermediate Member Username: T88power Post Number: 1567 Registered: 2-2001 |
I'll take the Vette. Ernesto | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 1283 Registered: 11-2002 |
Very nice. Cheers | ||
| Tony Roberts (Tony_roberts)
New member Username: Tony_roberts Post Number: 32 Registered: 6-2003 |
To me the American Icon is the Cobra, not the Viper! | ||
| Rick (Srt10)
New member Username: Srt10 Post Number: 15 Registered: 5-2003 |
there's nothing like good, old fashioned, American iron on occasion. [image]http://pathcommunications.com/stealth.jpeg[/image] |