| Author | Message | ||
| Armen Gugasian (Ag512bbi)
Junior Member Username: Ag512bbi Post Number: 64 Registered: 6-2002 |
I hate to bring this subject up, how horrible it is. But today in conversation, I found out that the car was a rent a car from Showcase Rentals in Newport Beach. It Was Met.Blk/Tan. The Driver was 19 or 20. He was showing off with a girlfriend. There was some cars on the freeway, so he decided to go down the emergency lane at 120M.P.H. The freeway had a little kink??? He hit the rail first then everything else. He Died. She is in BAD shape????? I don't know too much more. It's really too bad! Again, sorry for bringing this up. | ||
| Dan (Bobafett)
Intermediate Member Username: Bobafett Post Number: 1065 Registered: 9-2002 |
Taek, I agree that teaching them early is a good thing. Karting, etc. --Dan | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 1614 Registered: 11-2002 |
I disagree about driving at a young age though. I first drove my dad's car around the block when I was 11. I know, not the smartest thing to do, but when you grow up in the Canary Islands, the whole block lines the streets and is cheering for you, so the danger is minimal. Being exposed to cars at such a young age has taught me responsability and the potential danger of a motor vehicle. When one is a teenager, and dad or mom says that cars are dangerous, it goes in one ear and out the other. They're just waiting to hear BMW, or whatever marque floats their boat. When you are 10 and hear the same thing, you take those words to heart. When my peers were doing burnouts and donuts in parking lots I was more interested in how the engine worked. Not so much because you've been there and done that, but because it dawns on you just how stupid the behavior is (given their driving skill). When I have children of my own I'll be teaching them at an early age. Get a special seat, some pedal extensions and you're in business. Cheers | ||
| Dan (Bobafett)
Intermediate Member Username: Bobafett Post Number: 1062 Registered: 9-2002 |
Taek: the 'you're allowed to touch' thing drives me insane as well. Touch this you f**king idiot! --Dan | ||
| Dan (Bobafett)
Intermediate Member Username: Bobafett Post Number: 1061 Registered: 9-2002 |
Martin: I *wholheartedly* agree. My sister is 18 (going for license test today), and has absolutely NO driving skill. I seriously fear for her safety, but I know the california DMV will give her a license like it's candy. A very very close friend of mine from Madrid was explaining to me the Spanish test. He said they train for some 6 months, and the success rate for the first time is in the single figure %. They'll ask all sorts of questions like what color is the car to your right' w/o letting you look. Just making sure you have situational awareness. And yes, the test costs close to $1k. THis means people respect the license. Look at drivers there: everyone was moving over for faster drivers, etc. etc. Same in England. Same in most of Europe. Ken: By bad experience, I mean a lackthereof. Daily driving to work isn't going to teach you how to control your car, unless yo're put into an emergency situation in which case 99.9% of the drivers don't have the presence of mind or knowledge about car control (skill included) to be able to do the right thing. Re thyroid, thanks, but it's not a big deal. Cystic thyroid (multiple small cysts, not growing). Not a big deal, I'm on synthoid for life. Well, when I remember to take the little pill (been abotu a monthor so now ;) ) - I was making reference to it as a joke for Shelbee. --Dan | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 1613 Registered: 11-2002 |
Martin, >>And start putting a REAL driving test together.<< I could not agree more. The driving test in the US is pathetic. When I took it I actually asked the guy "that's it?" His response was. "You seem to know what you are doing just fine." All I did was parallel park and reverse in a straight line for about half a block. This guy didn't even test me driving forwards! Unfortunately I've witnessed the most inept drivers pass the tests (written and driving) and smash into a car within days of getting their license, or worse. Guy in my safety driving class passes the course, goes to the DMV and gets his license. The same day the moron "celebrates" with his friends and being the first to get his license shows off his driving skills to his other buddies. Drives through a blind turn. He misjudges the decreasing radius turn and veers into the adjacent lane. Guy wraps his car around a pole after smashing into a car headed the other way. They all die. Driver, passenger, driver and passengers in the other vehicle. What a waste. I've got tons of other stories of fools backing out of spaces without looking back or parallel parking rookies who dent cars all the time, etc. My pet peeve: "That's what bumpers are for..." Friggin' idiots. Cheers | ||
| Dr. Ken Lee (Kenster888)
Junior Member Username: Kenster888 Post Number: 154 Registered: 4-2003 |
Martin, read: http://www.nbcsandiego.com/automotive/2332918/detail.html According to the CHP, he was traveling at least 100 mph and not wearing seat belts. I think the CHP would know a little more about accident investigation than you and I. I drive defensively and always with the flow of traffic. Not trying to insult you, but I have not gotten a speeding ticket since 21. Kid: know your limitations and you'll be allright. I hope your friend would listen to you. Dan: A bad experience is worth just as much as a good experience. Sorry about your thyroid problem. Hope you get that fixed. | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5222 Registered: 5-2001 |
Dr. Lee and all the others: First off you do not know how fast he was going Second you do not know why he lost control. For all we know it could have been an oil spill in the road that made im lose the car. Third, being thrown out of the car as stated in the report, who knows if that is true. Even if so, he could have still be buckeled up. If he was not it may have been to his advantage in this particular case although he later died of his injuries the passenger survived though. Fourth, seeing and hearing how some of our fellow F-Chatters drive I wonder if age truely is a factor and please do not insult me and tell me you are driving 55Mph and never ever had a speeding ticket. Put this all in perspective here folks: 16 year olds should not drive period! 18 year olds should be on a probational license till 21. find the right age group (60 and up) and make testing mandatory. And start putting a REAL driving test together. I can not believe they let you board a missle (car) with no knowledge and all you have to show is that you can drive around a block and know where gas and brake is. Oh yeah, you have to show that you can park head-in. In Germany we have 40h of mandatory driving, including night driving, Autobahn and rural roads. The cost to get a license would increase from $10 to $ 2,000 but at leased you have trained drivers. | ||
| James Govan (Admiral_thrawn)
New member Username: Admiral_thrawn Post Number: 12 Registered: 7-2003 |
The death toll in this latest incident has now risen to 10, including a boy and girl who were both under 12 months old. Not to mention the 40 people who were injured. To put it into perspective, most suicide bombers can't even achieve this level of carnage. Apparently, the 86 year old ploughed the very same car right through the middle of a birthday party 12 years ago in 1991. | ||
| Faisal Khan (Tvrfreak)
Member Username: Tvrfreak Post Number: 547 Registered: 3-2003 |
Instead of laws, which may or may not be obeyed, why don't we use more technology? There's devices that can sense drowsiness--hook them up to shut the car down instead of sounding a beeper. Same with BAC detectors. Same with collision detectors. Such devices should not add significantly to the cost of cars, and they certainly cost less than the social costs of tragedies. Since the insurance industry stands to gain, it should help defray some of this cost (we can dream, can't we?). Yesterday's tragedy could perhaps have been avoided if a large barrier had been placed to block non-pedestrian vehicles from veering into pedestrian areas. I wish a couple of large trucks had been parked at each entrance to the market. Testing will catch those things the tests are designed to catch, only if they are manifest at the time of testing. But anyone can have a stroke at the wrong time. And tests don't check for everything. We need to stop the car from becoming an unintended lethal weapon. | ||
| Me Myself (Kid_enzoz)
Junior Member Username: Kid_enzoz Post Number: 101 Registered: 4-2003 |
I know... it's horrible... he killed a baby too.  | ||
| Dan (Bobafett)
Intermediate Member Username: Bobafett Post Number: 1054 Registered: 9-2002 |
If we discriminated by age, anyone over 50 needs a license check, and they need to be rechecked with quite some frequency. And harshly. This kid killed himself. Recently, some old guy plowed into 50. --Dan | ||
| Me Myself (Kid_enzoz)
Junior Member Username: Kid_enzoz Post Number: 100 Registered: 4-2003 |
Good points Docs... Although I still think you can't discriminate people by their age... I agree that Dr. Lee's statement about "peer pressure and hormone levels" are highly relevant. One of my friends is my age group... and drives a Ducati 998... :/ The way he rides... I worry about him. | ||
| Dan (Bobafett)
Intermediate Member Username: Bobafett Post Number: 1051 Registered: 9-2002 |
Ken, That typical 40 yr old doesn't have much skill to begin with. And bad experience isn't worth much. Hey, I have a screwy thyroid, perhaps that's why I'm out of the norm, right Shelbee?  --Dan | ||
| Dr. Shelbee (Shelbee)
Member Username: Shelbee Post Number: 426 Registered: 12-2002 |
Ken Lee I guess we both understand how endocrine system works in our body. | ||
| Dr. Ken Lee (Kenster888)
Junior Member Username: Kenster888 Post Number: 152 Registered: 4-2003 |
Martin, age is definitely a factor. A typical 20 year old lacks the driving experience/skill/knowledge of a typical 40 year old. Added the fact that peer pressure and hormone levels are enhanced at young age, a typical 20 year old in a Ferrari will behave more recklessly and unlikely to know his limitations. This guy was going 100mph+ and not wearing seat belts....yea, real mature. But your post on the fire extinguisher is right on. | ||
| Dan (Bobafett)
Intermediate Member Username: Bobafett Post Number: 1040 Registered: 9-2002 |
Tim, Amazing, isn't it? How many people are soooo stupid with respect to something so simple as wearing a belt. It's such an easy trivial thing to do, but will literally mean the difference b/w life and death. --Dan | ||
| Tim N (Timn88)
Advanced Member Username: Timn88 Post Number: 3267 Registered: 6-2001 |
James, wearing seatbelts is the law in the US if you are in the front seat or under 14 years old. Still, i always wear mine even when im in the back seat. Even if it werent a law i would still wear it. Alot of people dont wear belts though. | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5203 Registered: 5-2001 |
I was 21 when I had my first Ferrari, 22 when I drove my 3rd Ferrari at 190Mph on the Autobahn and never would I consider myself as being NOT mature enough to drive such a car. Age is not a factor. Again, same with the Nuerburgring crash, we don't know what happened here. For all we know it could have been an oil spill which caused this and the Ring crash. All I am saying is a fire extinguisher could prevent POSSIBLY . Just see Robins remarks. He will have to live with the thought what if I had had one in my car. This guy may still be alive. Until you give all you got you never know! | ||
| Kevin Butler (Challenge)
Junior Member Username: Challenge Post Number: 181 Registered: 9-2002 |
PSK said "While this might be considered a poofter type of comment, I would 100% support all cars over a certain HP figure having a device that restricts the amount of throttle available for road use. Thus if this car is stopped by the law enforcement on the road without this device the car is impounded, and you either loose it or have to buy it back for some huge fee. This fee should go to financing hospital ER wards maybe." SOCIALISM at its finest. If we're going this route, every fatal accident by every driver caused by lack of attention needs to pay "some huge fee." This goes for kids, women, and elderly drivers. PSK, please explain how your new HP-limiting device (i.e. governor) would have prevented the 86-yr-old man's accident in CA that killed 9 (including a 3-yr-old) and injured 45? Think. | ||
| Dr. Ken Lee (Kenster888)
Junior Member Username: Kenster888 Post Number: 148 Registered: 4-2003 |
Agree with Dr. S. 90%. A 20 year old is not mature enough to drive a F-car. I blame his parents. But not all 20 year olds are 'punks'. Nevertheless, it is tragic. | ||
| Coop (360)
Junior Member Username: 360 Post Number: 123 Registered: 4-2002 |
http://www.ferrarichat.com/discus/messages/21/286046.html?1058454470 | ||
| Rick (Bromers)
New member Username: Bromers Post Number: 3 Registered: 6-2003 |
How about following BMW's lead (in Europe at least) - their new M3 CSL is restricted to only 155mph but to get the limiter unrestricted you have to produce a racing license - ie someone who can really drive a car. There are too many people around with high performance cars that think they can drive them - maybe compulsory driver training for cars over xxx bhp ? (The UK insurance people will give you a discount off your policy if you have attended one of these sessions) R | ||
| Me Myself (Kid_enzoz)
Junior Member Username: Kid_enzoz Post Number: 93 Registered: 4-2003 |
Dr. Shelbee... So if it were you there would have been NO chance of a crash and burn huh? Damn that Fast and Furious movie... lol... apparently we're all street racing hooligans. | ||
| Dan (Bobafett)
Intermediate Member Username: Bobafett Post Number: 1020 Registered: 9-2002 |
Shelbee, I am a 22 yr old punk. --Dan | ||
| G.Peters (Wfo_racer)
Junior Member Username: Wfo_racer Post Number: 157 Registered: 5-2002 |
What the hell does age have to do with it ? So if he would have been 40 you would have been ok with it. You have to "deserve "a Ferrari ? It's just a car ,metal and rubber. If you have the resources, you buy one plain and simple . Last time I checked my 360 took me to dinner just like any other car in my garage. Ok, I admit it is a bit faster and louder than the CL500. Sadly in this case unless a mechanical issue surfaced lack of training caused this. How many Ferrari owners have proper high speed training or attended and DONE WELL at a racing school ? And for those that say they don't push their cars hard ,why buy a sportscar ? How many people here have ever done the same thing and floor boarded their cars and gotten away with it. And once again if you have never pinned your car ,why own a sportscar. But if are going to drive a sportscar the way you should, how many people here have a full cage in their cars ? | ||
| gary green (Minuke)
New member Username: Minuke Post Number: 34 Registered: 7-2003 |
DR.SHELBEE, What kind of doctor are you? | ||
| Dr. Shelbee (Shelbee)
Member Username: Shelbee Post Number: 424 Registered: 12-2002 |
I don't think 20 year old punk is matured enough to drive F-car. I don't feel sorry for him at all. He deserved it and he paid his price. It was his parents' fault why handed the key to their moron kid?? No grief from me, you can call me "mean" | ||
| PSk (Psk)
Member Username: Psk Post Number: 734 Registered: 11-2002 |
All good points Mark, and you are right the owners, or drivers of these cars need to demonstrate responsibility. (BTW: I was not intending it to limit the cars speed so much as limit how much uncontrolled power the driver has access to, say give him only 1/2 throttle or something. This would slow the cars acceleration a little making it more into line with normal cars ... after all a Honda Accord can probably top 120 mph nowadays. The idea was to reduce the chance of the driver loosing control.) Unfortunately there are always going to be a few that stuff it up for the rest. The motorcycle crowd has this exact problem. It was just a thought ... Pete | ||
| Mark (Markpdx)
Junior Member Username: Markpdx Post Number: 74 Registered: 4-2003 |
Pete For a power limiter to work it would have to be set ridiculously low. Even a very low power economy car like a Geo Metro will easily go 90 mph on level road. I would bet that even if a Ferrari 360 were limited to 100 horsepower it would still make it well over 100mph without difficulty. I suppose it would be possible to put a speed limiter on Ferraris like those found on other cars. My F-350 Powerstroke pickup cuts off at 95mph which is way faster than any speed limit in the US. A number of other cars have speed limiters but I think Ford pickups are set the lowest. Let's say Ferrari starts putting speed limiters on that stops at 85mph, slower than a Ford Diesel. It would sure cut down on those high speed blasts down the freeway but it would hardly be the end word in safety. From all reports the guy who ran down and killed 8 people with his Buick today in Santa Monica wasn't even doing 65mph. Start putting arbitrary limits on Ferraris and the only thing you will manage to do is kill their business. As for speed/power limiters demonstrating the responsibilty of exotic owners I very much disagree. If you have to limit the car then how is the driver at all responsible for the low speeds? A responsible and mature person is one who can restrain themself even when faced with a temptation. Mark | ||
| Jim Schad (Jim_schad)
Intermediate Member Username: Jim_schad Post Number: 1606 Registered: 7-2002 |
I think the problem with the Nurburgring pics is that for one we "knew" the occupants and they died "in" the car. These pics are of a strangers' burned out car alone. I know it is symantics, but that is the diff for me. | ||
| PSk (Psk)
Member Username: Psk Post Number: 731 Registered: 11-2002 |
Yes James I have thought that for a long time. A unfortunately great add for seat belts. Markpdx, I understand your point, but this device is to show other skeptical road users that we performance car owners are responsible and mature, etc. Not really to just restrict the power ... it is all about demonstrating responsibility. Pete | ||
| James Govan (Admiral_thrawn)
New member Username: Admiral_thrawn Post Number: 8 Registered: 7-2003 |
Quite franky, I find it very hard to believe that the politicians in the USA are stupid enough not to have made wearing seatbelts mandatory. They certainly are here in Australia, and no doubt it has saved thousands of lives. Here's one interesting example: If the occupants of the S-class Mercedes-Benz in Paris, 1997, who were speeding through a tunnel at 190kmph (120mph), had been wearing seat-belts, all four of them would be alive today. In fact, the only person who was actually wearing one was Diana's bodyguard, sitting in the front seat. He is living proof that a seat-belt made all the difference. After the crash, the passenger compartment held it's structural integrity (thanks to the crumple zones and safety cell technology), and the space where Diana and Dodi were seated (back seat) was hardly distorted at all, yet they both suffered massive injuries in the crash and subsequently died. Why? Because each of them slammed into the seats in front of them with the same force as falling from a 10 story building, thus causing massive tissue trauma, broken bones (especially the ribs), with death not long after the crash caused by internal bleeding. | ||
| Chris Scott (Jcscott)
New member Username: Jcscott Post Number: 16 Registered: 12-2002 |
My car has a halon system in the engine bay. The extinguisher is located in the luggage compartment and it activates on the left of drivers seat. You pull a pin and hit the button. My father had it installed (he bought in 1980 and I purchased from him a year ago)after his best friend wrapped a GT4 around a tree at 100 mph+. I remember as a kid looking at the blackened car and seeing one speck of green paint left. 2 months ago, I had my fuel vent canister bracket break and leak fuel on the manifold while traveling around 100 with my wife in the car. They sure are handy when you need it. Put a portable halon unit behind a seat for good measure. It can save your car and more importantly, you life. | ||
| dave handa (Davehanda)
Intermediate Member Username: Davehanda Post Number: 1287 Registered: 5-2001 |
Wm Hart, please follow the previously mentioned link to www.ferrariclub.com and read the FAQ on fire extingishers, all you questions will be answered. Dave | ||
| wm hart (Whart)
Intermediate Member Username: Whart Post Number: 1467 Registered: 12-2001 |
OK, so what extinguisher should i buy? (I'm not looking for the el-cheapo thing) and where is the best place to mount it? | ||
| Ben Cannon (Artherd)
Member Username: Artherd Post Number: 569 Registered: 6-2002 |
What a tradgety. Pics are in a little poor taste perhaps. Maybe someone here will see them and decide to keep it on the track though. This is just a horrible loss. My heart goes out to their famalies. Patrick- everyone wears a belt in any vehicle I drive. If you want to go beltless, that's fine, but you're walking... PSK- I support a device that goes on each road car that makes the driver not be a raving STUPID IDOIT. We need to take responsability for our actions. I don't care if it's a BMW Issetta, McLaren F1, or a .44magnum. NONE of these things kills people. People kill people. I am a firm beliver in extinquishers, and have been called upon to use mine once. I don't know if it nessicarily saved anyone, but it put the car fire out. Wasn't my car, I was just a passer-by. You never know, but at least you're taking at step to insure a fighting chance! I agree in mandating a charged extinquisher, and including in driver training, how to use it on a vehicle. One small point, though Halon is heavier than air, and does displace oxygen in a confined environment, it is NOT a powder, but a gas. And in an auto, if there's enough opening to spray it, there's enough opening to vent it back out before you have a problem. It's really quite safe outdoors (indoors, well, get the F&**^ out when there's a fire!!!!!!!!!!) | ||
| Patman36 (Patrickr)
Junior Member Username: Patrickr Post Number: 168 Registered: 4-2002 |
I had a friend get in my car with me for a ride... I couldn't believe that he didn't put on his seatbelt. He's my friend but I told him everyone wears a seatbelt in my car. Patrick | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 1562 Registered: 11-2002 |
Tim, Unfortunately I think you are right. At 175mph there is little that can save you in a road car. Nevertheless, stranger things have happened. I've seen pictures of wrecks in which people survived and the car looks about as bad if not worse than these pictures. Horrible thing to lose someone to a car crash. Cheers | ||
| Tim N (Timn88)
Advanced Member Username: Timn88 Post Number: 3261 Registered: 6-2001 |
for those who say that they should have been wearing a seatbelt, i dont think it would have dont much good in a 175mph crash. Neither would a fire extinguisher. These kids were probably ended on immediately. This kind of stuff happens all the time, kids getting killed in car accidents. there isnt one summer that goes by where i dont hear about a kid or a group of kids that are my age or even younger (im 19) from nearby towns (or even kids i knew from my town)that are killed in a car accident.. edit- ok, i dont think this car was going 175 because one kid was only injured. No way anyones surviving a crash in a F355 spider at those speeds. | ||
| Mark (Markpdx)
Junior Member Username: Markpdx Post Number: 72 Registered: 4-2003 |
Pete Yes, lets ban high HP cars, guns, tobacco, words that might offend. That way we can all be safe. There might be a problem with a few knowledgeable people who would mod their cars, make their own guns & cigarettes and use scary words. As you already said the cars should be impounded. Probably won't be enough though, anyone with the knowledge to do illegal things should be "re-educated" to make society safe. Damn if the Khmer Rouge wasn't right after all. Probably should ban '92 Buicks as they are particularly deadly. On the other hand it would be hilarious to watch Allen Fiedler's head explode at such a law | ||
| Johnny (Up2nogd)
Junior Member Username: Up2nogd Post Number: 160 Registered: 8-2002 |
Joe, Joe, Joe!! Prepare yourself young man! Sick him Dave!! LOL | ||
| Joe McEwing (Mr_excitement)
New member Username: Mr_excitement Post Number: 4 Registered: 7-2003 |
My toyota supra will blow your fancy ferrari's right out of the water. Ferrari sucks!!!! | ||
| Dr. Erik Nielsen (Judge4re)
Junior Member Username: Judge4re Post Number: 65 Registered: 4-2003 |
And don't forget that he's one of 25,000 drivers that die every year. How come nobody gets upset about that fact? | ||
| Dave (Maranelloman)
Intermediate Member Username: Maranelloman Post Number: 2279 Registered: 1-2002 |
Right on, Gerald!! You are spot-on. What's good for the right hand is good for the left, too. | ||
| Gerald L. Roush (Ferrmktltr)
Junior Member Username: Ferrmktltr Post Number: 165 Registered: 5-2003 |
Excuse me for interjecting a bit of solemnity to this topic, but where is the outrage that was exhibited on Ferrari Chat when someone dared to post a link to pictures of the Ferrari crash at the Nurburgring which killed two Ferrari chat members? Is the fact that these two people were (apparently) not members of the Ferrari Chat community make the posting of these photos "acceptable"? | ||
| PSk (Psk)
Member Username: Psk Post Number: 728 Registered: 11-2002 |
Hmmmm, I wonder how long it is going to be before some transport minister decides to attempt to ban the sale of cars like Ferrari? Unfortunately everytime one of us gives our cars a burst and demonstrates a lack of respect to other road users we are drawing this sort of response closer. While this might be considered a poofter type of comment, I would 100% support all cars over a certain HP figure having a device that restricts the amount of throttle available for road use. Thus if this car is stopped by the law enforcement on the road without this device the car is impounded, and you either loose it or have to buy it back for some huge fee. This fee should go to financing hospital ER wards maybe. Once in the confines on a race track, or other private property, this device can be removed and we can play in safety. In the end it is a huge responsibility on all owners of these sort of cars in controlling wisely that power ... unfortunately this person was not mature enough to make the right decisions. The public will eventually get up in arms if this keeps happening, or we keep flying by them. Thus this device would demonstrate that we are prepared to show that we are responsible, and we buy these cars for fun, and track performance. I remember when I used to race cars. My first race car was also my go to work car, and thus I used to drive it to scrutineering. I got my wrist slapped by the officials once because with numbers on, I gave the car a big blast driving away from scrutineering. They rightly said that I was demonstrating the WRONG sort of driving responsibilities, and this is what 99% of other road users already think of all motor sport fans, ie. we are dangerous hoons. Thus I was told to save it for the track ... or if caught again, I would loose my racing license. Pete | ||
| rob guess (Beast)
Junior Member Username: Beast Post Number: 82 Registered: 5-2003 |
Here is something to think about. The USCG requires that all power boats to have an approved fire extinguisher on board when the vehicle is being operated. The US-DOT requires them on all comercial vehicles. How come the govt. does not require them to be in each vehicle on the road? It only makes logical sense. The cost would be hardly anything compaired the value of saving one persons life or minimising the damage to ones vehicle. As for a 20 year old driving a Ferrari. I know of another accident where the kid driving his dads Ferrari drunk hit a power pole and destroyed the car fortunatly he did not get hurt. 6 months later the kid died when he slammed his quad into a tree riding in the dark. A tragic loss indeed since i knew both the father and his late son when i worked for his company. | ||
| todd montandon (Sllade)
Junior Member Username: Sllade Post Number: 113 Registered: 7-2003 |
i live in san diego i have not heard anything about this crash whatsoever.Todd | ||
| dave handa (Davehanda)
Intermediate Member Username: Davehanda Post Number: 1283 Registered: 5-2001 |
Andrew, go to the local FCA website at www.ferrariclub.com and check the FAQ's on fire extingishers. | ||
| Andrew H (Stokpro)
Junior Member Username: Stokpro Post Number: 58 Registered: 6-2003 |
Martin, Excellent idea on carrying a fire extinguisher. What's the best way to mount it? | ||
| dave handa (Davehanda)
Intermediate Member Username: Davehanda Post Number: 1279 Registered: 5-2001 |
I have two Halon units in my F-car, but you can get a big 40BC fire extinguisher at Costco for $20. I have two of those in my Honda. | ||
| Robin Overcash (Robin)
Junior Member Username: Robin Post Number: 136 Registered: 1-2003 |
Oddly enough, I encountered this problem last night... Long story, but basically I arrived 4th or 5th on the scene of an accident about 1/4 mile outside of DC. One car was upside down on top of the other... driver on the bottom was obviously dead, driver on top was alive but his car burst into flames after a few minutes. We couldn't get him out because the car was too smashed up to get the door open. By this time, 20-30 cars had backed up on the road (it was about 1:30am) so I ran around frantically trying to find a fire extinguisher... finally got one, but it was empty and just fizzled when put to use. Someone eventually got the guy out but he died a few minutes later right when the fire trucks arrived and put the flames out. I think if we had some working fire extinguishers, we could have put the fire out and spent more time getting the guy out.. as it was, the back of the car was on fire and we were too scared to do much for fear of the gas tank blowing up. Think I'll be buying an extinguisher soon....... -R | ||
| Jim Schad (Jim_schad)
Intermediate Member Username: Jim_schad Post Number: 1602 Registered: 7-2002 |
the article said the driver staggered away from the car while his clothes were on fire and passerbys put him out. he died at the hospital. Now did he die from blunt trauma or burns? would a fire extinguisher have helped him if he was put out immediately? | ||
| Hubert Otlik (Hugh)
Intermediate Member Username: Hugh Post Number: 1071 Registered: 1-2002 |
Martin: I agree with you, and I agree with Bill. One the one hand, if you have an engine fire, oil fire, etc. the extinguisher will help with those instances. In an impact it all depends on the "type" of fire, and the speed with which it spreads; only a Halon system will help you in the case of a quick fire (if you've got spark, and you've got a punctured fuel line taht's leaking vapros, you've got only a prayer), but even after the fire is suppressed, you've got to get out b/c the Halon powder will sufficate you. Lastly, and this is the problem I have, most extinguishers, in street cars, are imporperly mounted, and can compound problems when/if the extinguisher becomes a projectile. The sad fact of this incident is that: an inexperienced driver went over the edge, and paid dearly. I don't think anything could have saved them, b/c the article stated that both occupants were "ejected" so, they were already dead before the crash: no seatbelts. I commend you for putting in extinguishers in all cars you sell, but it wouldn't have saved these two. | ||
| Ron Thomas (Ronsupercar)
Member Username: Ronsupercar Post Number: 967 Registered: 5-2002 |
Wow! A 20 year old kid dead.. That is a true shame... Best wishes to his family. | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5198 Registered: 5-2001 |
Bill that is exactly the case! Likely you will not be able to help yourself but if it would be mandatory that every car carries one it would mean that whenever there is a fire someone will be able to jump in and help the next! It may not save the person but it sure gives them a chance. Just like your fire suit will not save you from burning to death but it gives you extra seconds to survive, a helmet does not save you in a crash but it gives you a chance ob being concious after impact. I hate to bring this up as a reference since we do not know if or if not but it could have: Jens and Amar. No helmet, no fire extinguisher required on the track, no fire suits , shoes and gloves. They would not have been able to help themselves but the next person could have if they had one on board. It gives a chance and for $30 you should give that chance to someone you may one day encounter. If you can affort a nice car you should afford the extinguisher for the price of one gas stop! | ||
| Lee Hamner (Tennlee)
Junior Member Username: Tennlee Post Number: 102 Registered: 2-2002 |
I guess my fire extinguisher wouldn't help me in a high speed crash, but I have one just because the engine and fuel are nearly on top of each other in my 308. | ||
| wm hart (Whart)
Intermediate Member Username: Whart Post Number: 1463 Registered: 12-2001 |
Guys, not to be a dickhead, but how the hell will a fire extinguisher do any good if you crunch at high speed, are rendered unconscious or worse, and the car is twisted, shattered, and then engulfed in flames? I agree about being cautious, but i don't see this making much difference here, unless you are suggesting that in some cases, a passerby might be able to access the Xtinguisher and be a good samaritan. | ||
| Me Myself (Kid_enzoz)
Junior Member Username: Kid_enzoz Post Number: 87 Registered: 4-2003 |
That's horrible. | ||
| dave handa (Davehanda)
Intermediate Member Username: Davehanda Post Number: 1276 Registered: 5-2001 |
Martin, You will be proud to know that I carry two fire extinguishers in each of my cars, have two in my garage and two in my house. You cannot have too many fire extinguishers, flashlights or smoke alarms around... :-) They are cheap and handy to have around. I have never used a fire extinguisher, but like other "safety equipment" such as a gun (that's another thread entirely), when you REALLY NEED IT, there is no substitute right at that moment! | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 5193 Registered: 5-2001 |
I repeat my call to you all to carry a fire extinguisher in ALL of your cars. You may be able to help someone else and prevent a family to suffer such grief. It is a minimal investment that we should all have in our cars. $30 will potentially save somones life! A small token to pay for such a reward! At Cavallino ALL cars will be delivered with Fire Extinguishers since June. | ||
| George LaFleur (308geo)
New member Username: 308geo Post Number: 24 Registered: 12-2002 |
Sorry about the mis-info of it being an Enzo. It also appears that the car was red even though the news article said it was black. No matter what model (or car make) it was, it is a shame that this happened. | ||
| Jim Schad (Jim_schad)
Intermediate Member Username: Jim_schad Post Number: 1599 Registered: 7-2002 |
I wonder if it was the 20yr olds car? When I was 20 I certainly had no biz driving a ferrari. I would feel terrible if that were my son in MY car that he borrowed for the night. No seatbelts, 100mph, top down, nightime and young. Recipe for disaster. | ||
| gary green (Minuke)
New member Username: Minuke Post Number: 30 Registered: 7-2003 |
It's a terrible loss and I feel sorry for the family's. Why was the driver and passenger not wearing seat belts. Please buckle up when you drive. | ||
| Byron (Bmyth)
Member Username: Bmyth Post Number: 932 Registered: 10-2002 |
The picture in the link suggests a 355 spider (judging by the wheels) If it was an Enzo, could this person be related to Zahid Tractor? Just a guess... Tragic, indeed. | ||
| Jim Schad (Jim_schad)
Intermediate Member Username: Jim_schad Post Number: 1598 Registered: 7-2002 |
Looks like a 355 to me. The wheels and door panel.  | ||
| Gary Reed (Gary_reed)
Junior Member Username: Gary_reed Post Number: 130 Registered: 2-2002 |
It doesn't appear to be an Enzo. Possibly a 355 spider? Photo: http://www.nbcsandiego.com/automotive/2332918/detail.html | ||
| Tillman Strahan (Tillman)
Member Username: Tillman Post Number: 790 Registered: 11-2001 |
There's a pic of the car here: http://www.nbcsandiego.com/automotive/2332918/detail.html but there's not much left to identify. Doesn't look like an Enzo though. I feel sorry for the passenger.  | ||
| Taek-Ho Kwon (Stickanddice)
Intermediate Member Username: Stickanddice Post Number: 1555 Registered: 11-2002 |
Aw crud. That's horrible. Sounds like they weren't wearing their seatbelts if they were thrown from the car. What a shame, he was only 20 with a full life ahead of him. Glad to hear he didn't harm other motorists though. | ||
| ELI (Titanium360)
Member Username: Titanium360 Post Number: 479 Registered: 4-2002 |
Very tragic. Where does it say it was an Enzo? | ||
| Byron (Bmyth)
Member Username: Bmyth Post Number: 931 Registered: 10-2002 |
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/uniontrib/wed/metro/news_1mi16fatal.html | ||
| Amir H. (355spiderman)
Junior Member Username: 355spiderman Post Number: 128 Registered: 5-2002 |
Very tragic loss of life and a Enzo... | ||
| Byron (Bmyth)
Member Username: Bmyth Post Number: 930 Registered: 10-2002 |
That is horrible news, Rob! I didn't hear about this... I'll ask around. | ||
| Rob Lay (Rob328gts)
Board Administrator Username: Rob328gts Post Number: 5607 Registered: 12-2000 |
George reported in the Texas section that an Enzo burst into flames in San Diego after crashing going 175 mph. Anyone in the area validate? http://www.thesandiegochannel.com/morning/2333354/detail.html |