| Author |
Message |
Steven J. Solomon (Solly)
Member
Username: Solly
Post Number: 541
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2003 - 11:32 pm: | |
Denis,
Your comments are taken in the spirit which you have stated, and i'd be happy to have a drink with you at the Glen, but I would like to respond to a few of your points. The description of the incident was given to you by 2 people in whom you have faith and trust that they know what they are talking about. Fair enough, but there are 2 sides to every story.
1) I never meant to impugn owners or drivers of any other make or model of automobile. Everyone should drive and race whatever they choose, provided the vehicle and driver are safe. I have owned and raced many different types of cars myself.
2) I absolutely did not mean to cast aspersions on Bob, Matt or Chris. They have done a terrific job at every event I have attended, and have always stressed safety above all else. Neither I nor anyone else I know wants to go home with a car in pieces. However, having said the above, it seems like it has been unofficial policy in the red group to pass without waiting for point bys. I'm sure you have seen it many times. I have personally experienced it on the straights and in the turns as well. But if someone passes me in the turn I am aware he/she is there, and avoid contact. One of the things that is mentioned at every driver's meeting I have ever attended is that if you don't get a pass-by, watch the car's body language, and pass when you believe it is safe to do so. Many cars have sealed windows and can't give a pass by. Unfortunately this leads to a lot of guessing.
3) The reason that John was able to drive right through the turn after the incident was that I was hit so hard I ended up on the RIGHT side of the track, in the grass. This is the opposite side of where I should have ended up if I T-boned the 'vette (we would both have ended up on the left side).
4)My left front fender, quarter panel and part of the door have tire marks all over them from the corvette. If I had T-boned him, my nose and possibly part of the front left bumper would be damaged, but I certainly wouldn't have most of his tire on the side of my car. Damage to his side door was minimal, a few scrapes, and probably a function of rubbing up against the broken front quarter panel for the second or two it took to disengage. I didn't get to see the damage to the front of his car.
5) This one is my fault. I followed this car a few times during the day, and as your friend mentioned, watched him take a strange line through the course for a number of laps. also never got a point by from him on the straights. I should have stayed well away from him. Mea Culpa.
6)Gerry Crilly, an experienced red driver (red 360 CH) was the car behind John and your wife. He gave me a clear point by. John and the 'vette driver did not, but we were still in the straightaway before the braking zone when I passed John. The driver directly behind me was Jose, in the yellow/black 360CH, he also got a point by, which was why he was behind me. If anyone hads a front row seat it was Jose, right in back of me. I have never met him before. He came over to me in the paddock and told me he was planning to follow me right around the turn, and that he too believed the 'vette was off to the left and going deep towards the runoff area. Now I do brake late for Big Bend, and trail brake to the apex, so I don't even begin my braking until about #3 in the brake zone. Jose was surprised to see the 'vette dive for the apex with me already there. I know you have done many more laps at Lime Rock than I have, but I must disagree with your statement that a scenario like that would allow the car at the apex to slip through with plenty of room. If I am trailbraking into the apex, and another car has completed braking, is wide and accelerating toward the apex, he is on the upside of the power/speed curve and I am on the wrong side of it. He can get to me a lot faster than I can get through the turn.
The upshot - Just a matter of different viewing angles from what John and your wife saw versus what Gerry, myself and Jose saw. Was this a stupid thing to do when I was unaware of the other driver's spatial orientation? Yes. have I learned a valuable lesson? Most definitely. Thank God no one got hurt.
I would also offer, as a gentleman, to fully fund the repairs to the Corvette driver's car if there is any unambiguous evidence of my fault. If anyone has any video or still pictures that are even fairly suggestive of my being at fault, please get them to an uninvolved third party (Bob, Matt, Chris?) for review, and I will pick up the tab.
Look forward to meeting you. |
Matt Karson (Squidracing)
Member
Username: Squidracing
Post Number: 525
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2003 - 9:39 pm: | |
After a good amount of thought on the issue, I've decided to keep from giving an opinion at this point. I do have very strong feelings on these issues, but as these topics are so sensitive, I'd prefer to address them one on one. However, I find this thread to be a very constructive one. |
Ben Cannon (Artherd)
Member
Username: Artherd
Post Number: 681
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2003 - 6:37 pm: | |
In one of the groups I've run with, point bys were optional in Red. Passing allowed anywhere. You were supposed to know what the F&$* you were doing. Every group is different though.
I've also had a Porsche give me a point by *IN* turn 7. (was running in amature, first time at the track, I always run in either amature or one above to get a feel. Sometimes I don't get out of there the first day, so what.) Anyway, in amature, passing is allowed on straights ONLY! He pointed me by *IN* turn 7, a 2nd gear sharp right hander, and STOPED HIS CAR WHILE STILL ON THE LINE! I had to go way off line and way slow to get around him.
Moral of this story: There are idoits everywhere. I guess.
Best!
Ben. |
Mfennell70 (Mfennell70)
Junior Member
Username: Mfennell70
Post Number: 154
Registered: 7-2001
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2003 - 4:38 pm: | |
Funny thing: when I was still actually racing, we'd give each other point-by's constantly during non-race situations. Open track day, warm-ups, etc. |
Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Senior Member
Username: Miami348ts
Post Number: 5555
Registered: 5-2001
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2003 - 4:17 pm: | |
I have to say I do not have a whole lot of track experience and not much in the fast run groupos, whatever you call them, red, sport or whatever.
Pointbys are important for the safety of the drivers and the equipment. Pointbys are also the cause of much frustration on the track. The lack of pointbys as well as pointbys given in wrong locations or the dreadful pointbys while the driver floors the throttle and you can not get by.
I have had experience with some clubs that feature all kinds of cars on the track and you can find all kinds of drivers and violations of rules.
It is frustrating yet necessary.
Since one should assume that the red run group has good experienced drivers pointbys should be optional. |
James Glickenhaus (Napolis)
Intermediate Member
Username: Napolis
Post Number: 2251
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2003 - 10:21 am: | |
Jon
On Sat it was Tom Driving Bennie's car. I helped push him out of the WWOC tent. He was stuck behind Vince for a bit, warmed up, passed him, drove a few laps, and pulled in. These cars require a lot of set up to drive safetly at speed. That's part of the problem. Another is that the 333sp isn't really suited for Lime Rock.
Best |
Jon P. Kofod (95f355c)
Member
Username: 95f355c
Post Number: 855
Registered: 8-2001
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2003 - 10:10 am: | |
I can't recall if there were two 333SP's running that day or not. I never saw Benny out running. Although I don't know Benny personally I have run with him many times and has never presented any problems for me (never been stuck behind him)
I would have a hard time believing it was Tom P. driving the car that first session on Saturday. Tom left me in the dust in his 355 C, in a 333SP he would have likely lapped me.
Might have been someone else driving the first session in Tom's car or a different car entirely.
I also might be confused about it being the same gentleman at Summit Point.
That guy never did more than 3 laps at Summit. He had just bought the 333SP and on the very first lap of the very first session he spun in turn 2 on cold tires.
The Ferrari of Washington cleared the track for him just before lunch for some laps. It started to drizzle a bit and 2 laps in he crashed in turn 5 and ripped up the undertray and went home.
Dennis might be right that he was warming up his tires but if that is the case don't hold people up, and do the couteous thing when you see them approaching and give a very early point by to let people know you are not on the pace.
In this case I don't think he was warming up his tires. He was passing slower cars and nailing it on the straight aways. We must have passed at least 6 or 7 cars.
Doesn't really matter if he was warming up, had car trouble, was not the owner of the car and taking it easy or whatever. I have a video clip of the session and the three laps in behind him that will be on my website shortly. Not to show my speed relative to the 333SP but to listen to that awesome sound.
My rule of thumb is that if the car on you bumper wasn't there 2 seconds ago GOD DIDN'T PUT IT THERE!
I have non problems whatsoever giving point bys to faster cars and faster drivers.
My $.02? Even if no point-bys were required, no collision should be happening at the apex. None. If two cars hit (aside from a rear-end accident from brake failure or misjudgment) at the apex, that means that someone was trying to make a pass in the corner, which SHOULD NOT BE HAPPENING.
Absolutely correct! No room for debate on this. Fighting at the apex at a track event is asking for trouble.
Again all this gets down to what is the rule? Is is relaxed and flexible or is it a no exception rule about where to pass and when.
Bottom line is that you HAVE to know who you are running with before execucting all but the safest passes which are usually done on a straight, with a point by, and hopefully a courtesy lift by the car being passed.
Regards,
Jon P. Kofod
|
James Glickenhaus (Napolis)
Intermediate Member
Username: Napolis
Post Number: 2250
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2003 - 9:28 am: | |
Dennis
FYI the person driving the 333sp on sat at Lime Rock wasn't Benny it was Tom Popadopulis. |
Dennis (Bighead)
Junior Member
Username: Bighead
Post Number: 187
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2003 - 9:05 am: | |
Jon:
For what it's worth, the Corvette v. 360Ch incident occurred during the beginning of the second or third lap of the session, so if Solly was indeed held up by a recalcitrant Corvette, it wasn't for multiple hot laps. As you know, Lime Rock isn't a great place to warm up tires (especially when it was cloudy), so most of us use at least one lap, if not two, to heat up slicks. I always give people benefit of the doubt for 3-4 laps before getting irked at the lack of a point-by. In any event, I don't think the Corvette was blocking Solly for lap after lap during this session.
As for the 333SP at LRP three weeks ago... :-) There were two 333s there. One was driven by Vince Dileo, an incredibly nice guy who used to race years and years ago. He also used to drive an F40 at the track, but sold it and bought the 333 in 2001. Brand new. I met him at Mont Tremblant at the Ferrari Festival in 2001, when I took him for some familiarization laps (he had raced at the track but hadn't been since the reconstruction). I've since been on the track with him at LCMT, LRP, and WGI (possibly SP, not sure). He doesn't push the car that hard (tries to avoid the big engine rebuild). Most noteworthy though, Vince takes a LOT of time to heat the tires - multiple (5-6) laps. I've caught and passed him, astonished at that... then he turns it up and he's gone.
The other 333SP driver at Lime Rock three weeks ago was Benny Caiola (whom I presume you know, Jon?). I won't comment on his driving skills, but do note that he's been driving his 333SP (or at least one of them?) for years. I do have, though, in-car video footage of him spinning out twice in one session... and then footage of me catching him down and passing him on the front straight. I presume that he was taking it easy after the spins, or else he broke something.
Anyway, that's just FYI. Back to the incident in question... whether or not the point-by rule was made absolutely clear or not, it was certainly not being observed by everyone in Red on Saturday.
My $.02? Even if no point-bys were required, no collision should be happening at the apex. None. If two cars hit (aside from a rear-end accident from brake failure or misjudgment) at the apex, that means that someone was trying to make a pass in the corner, which SHOULD NOT BE HAPPENING.
vty,
--Dennis
|
James Glickenhaus (Napolis)
Intermediate Member
Username: Napolis
Post Number: 2249
Registered: 10-2002
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2003 - 9:05 am: | |
This is why I don't plan to drive my P4 at FCA events... |
Jon P. Kofod (95f355c)
Member
Username: 95f355c
Post Number: 849
Registered: 8-2001
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2003 - 1:03 am: | |
My take on the situation.
First off if the rules were written in stone and completely black and white then Dennis is 100% correct. No question about it...no point by, no pass, anywhere on the track.
I am assuming that the event in question was run by Empire State Region. I'll let Matt chime in about the rules since he and Bob Coates run the show, but from my own experience of running with the Empire State Region 6 or 7 times (all at Watkins Glen) the Red group rules are not always black and white.
If for some reason it was clearly stated that no point by, no pass and this is the normal policy at Lime Rock then please disregard any of this.
In Solly's defense, at the Glen we run pretty hard in Red group. The few times I have run there the general concensus in Red group is that a point by is generally recommended but not required at all sections of the track. Sometimes for example it is explicitly required as Matt sometimes institutes between turn 1 and 2.
In Red group it is assumed that most people have tons of track time or significant race experience. In this group situational awareness should be a given, no if and of but's about it.
If you are going to relax the rules a bit in this group simply being fast doesn't cut it. Matt is very strict about who runs in Red and does what I believe is a good job. The first time I went to the Glen is signed up for Red group but Matt put me in Blue. I was a bit disappointed but first session out it was the right decision. Red group at the Glen is a bit different than Red group with other FCA regions I run with.
Ok, now on to Solly. If we assume that the rules are a bit relaxed at Lime Rock in Red as they are sometimes at the Glen then the following should be noted.
1) If you see cars taking weird lines that tells you right away the individual is not familiar with the track and is most likely preoccupied with figuring out the line and thus his situational awareness is not at 100%.
2) You have to know who you are running with. You cannot assume that the car in front knows you are there unless you know the person and even then it's a judgement call
3) I would never make a pass at a track event under braking or in a turn (even if permitted) against a driver I do not know. Too much risk...this ain't racing.
4) In Solly's defense if a point by was required at ALL times and Solly was stuck behind this car for several laps, then clearly that car/driver has no business in Red group. Not checking your mirrors ever few seconds in a fast group is a recipe for disaster.
5) Also a driver who contunally doesn't give you a point by for any lenght of time is most likely not paying attention and this is the last person you want to tangle with on anything other than a straightaway.
Perfect example was a few weeks ago at the Challenge/Historic event at Lime Rock. I was running the 355 in the track sessions and got stuck behind a slow 333SP. Not sure if he was warming it up as some suggested, but I was behind him for three laps. In some sections I would literally be inches off his bumper. No point by and I was getting awefully frustrated.
The driver was someone who had been out to Summit Point a few months earlier in his 333SP and it was clear from that event he had little or no experience in a 600 hp prototype.
At one point Jay Lopez in his 360 C was on my bumper and clearly faster at Lime Rock than I was. I pointed him by and let him have a crack at the 333SP.
Jay made the pass coming onto no name straight and startled the 333SP into lifting and passed by. The door to me looked wide open, big enough to drive a rig through so I followed Jay. Next thing I knew he clsoed the door moving over swiftly almost to the point I thought it was deliberate (which in hindsight it wasn't).
I had to get two wheels in the grass and barely kept the car gathered up before the uphill righthander.
In hindsight I should not have assumed that because Jay got through the 333SP driver would see me as well, since I don't think he saw Jay.
Bottom line is that you need to know who you are running with, have complete confidence in their situational awareness and lastly understand that you are responsible for making the pass.
I can also vouch for the driver whom Dennis speaks of. I have run with John T. at Summit Point and the Glen and he has years of experience doing track days.
Again I am not taking sides just relaying my experience from the limited events I have run with Matt's group. My experience is that the bar is pretty high for people to be included in the Red run group and that the rules relaxed a bit under the understanding that superior judgement must be used and you have to know who you are running with.
If the Vette held Solly up for repeated laps than he has no business in red group. However that being said it is never a good idea to make a pass under braking or in turns under any circumstances or rules unless YOU KNOW THAT PERSON and have run with that driver before.
Just my 2 cents worth.
Hope to see Solly and Dennis at the Glen.
Regards,
Jon P. Kofod
1995 F355 Challenge #23
FLATOUT RACING
http://neverlift.homestead.com/flatout.html
|
Ben Cannon (Artherd)
Member
Username: Artherd
Post Number: 680
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2003 - 12:15 am: | |
All I have to say is:
There is a reason for track passing rules and regulations.
They exist to protect you and the safety of your passangers and fellow drivers.
They are not flexable.
Vaild points have been made by both of you.
I am just glad no one was hurt!
Best!
Ben. |
Dave (Maranelloman)
Intermediate Member
Username: Maranelloman
Post Number: 2455
Registered: 1-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, August 03, 2003 - 9:41 pm: | |
Wow!
The plot thickens.
For now, I retract... |
Dennis (Bighead)
Junior Member
Username: Bighead
Post Number: 184
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, August 03, 2003 - 9:36 pm: | |
I was an instructor at this Lime Rock event (driving my 355B and my friend's F40 LM). I've been attending this August FCA event for about 5-6 years in a row. Between driving and instructing at Lime Rock with various clubs over the years, I have (conservatively) over two thousands laps under my belt at that track.
Steven:
You and I have never met. I don't know who you are, I suspect you don't know who I am. I've never heard anyone say anything negative about you. I have no bone to pick with you. I'm making this clear because I have some comments to make in response to your post, and I want you (and anyone else reading this) to understand that none of this is personal - I'm just reporting what I've been told and providing my outlook on the incident.
________
When your incident with the Corvette happened, I was in the paddock and didn't see anything. Two people I know very, very well, however, did see EVERYTHING.
But before I get to that.... I don't know the Corvette driver. No idea who he is. He was, as I found out later, an instructor. Maybe he should not have been running in the Red group. But he certainly has enough experience to be an instructor.
I don't know how exactly Matt, Chris and Bob classify drivers and skill levels, but I do know that they are very, very reluctant to hand out red/advanced wristbands - it's certainly not something that is given without a substantial driving history (I know several people in BLUE that haven't moved up to Red, despite DECADES of driving experience). I don't want to put words in their mouths, so I'll let Matt respond with his opinion if he so chooses, but I doubt that there are many unexperienced drivers in Red. And I DO know that Matt is careful about choosing instructors, preferring those qualified by Trackmasters.
Not to say that there aren't any idiots in Red or in the instructor group. Alas, there always are, no matter the club. There are idiots running up and down the run groups, from novice to instructor. But that's the nature of the game. There are rules in place designed to control the stupid things that go on... but not everyone obeys them.
Among the most important -- passing zones and point-bys. Point-bys were required for your run group. Conversely, I do know that there were plenty of passes done in Red without a point-by being given. In EITHER event (with or without a point-by), it is the responsibility of the passing driver to complete the pass safely.
You complained in your post about Corvette drivers not giving point-bys; if he wasn't giving a point-by, why did you try to make a pass?
Furthermore, the Red group is required to observe PASSING ZONE rules (reviewed at the driver's meeting each morning). That means that passes may be made only in specified passing zones (front, no-name and back straights). And a pass must be COMPLETED ***BEFORE*** the BRAKING zone (the passing car must be back on line, or at least have enough room to be back on line if the driver chooses to). A braking zone is generally considered to be the area where braking occurs before the turn-in point. Certainly, no passing should be attempted after a car has turned into a corner.
But back to what the witnesses saw.
First, my good friend John was driving the black 355 Challenge that was tailing the Corvette when you passed both of them, and had a front-row seat when you and the Corvette hit. John has been driving at the track since the 80's.
Neither he nor the Corvette gave you a point-by. According to John, he saw, in his mirrors, your 360 Challenge flying down the front straight with a lot of speed. But then you disappeared from his mirrors, as you were in his blind spot. He then watched you hit the Corvette. In his words, you "t-boned" the Corvette RIGHT AT THE (first) APEX cone. The Corvette may have driven away, but it did suffer significant damage to the right door, fender, wheel, suspension, and possibly the transmission too (no damage to the front wheel or front fender). According to John, you were going so fast and hit the Corvette so hard that both of you slid into the turn, leaving enough room for him to get by ON THE RIGHT, still on the track!
The second witness? It was my wife.
My wife has about 4 years of track experience, sharing the 355 and also driving her Porsche 996. She is probably good enough to be an instructor, and has never spun or even gotten a wheel off. Alan Vernon, who lives around the corner from you, can vouch for her skill.
My wife, Jamie, was the passenger in John's 355CH. After the incident occured, John told me about it, but I didn't even know that she was with him. I spoke with her separately, and her account mirrors his - you came down the front straight and did not complete the pass before the braking zone. According to Jamie, both the Corvette and John had turned in, on the correct line for Big Bend, when she saw your car go by on the inside, then struck the Corvette in the door. The collision happened at the first apex of Big Bend.
Now, eyewitness accounts aside, speaking candidly, your own statement tends to show whose "fault" or "responsibility" it is. Here's why.
First, for those who don't know anything about Lime Rock, Big Bend is the famous turn at the end of the front straight. It is one of the best trail-braking corners in the Northeast. The fast line? According to the Skip Barber Racing School, which is *based* at Lime Rock - the turn-in point is somewhere between the "1" and "2" braking markers; one starts braking before the turn-in, but one can continue braking, after turning-in, all the way to the first apex.
The first apex is so close to the beginning of Big Bend, if one takes a late line into the turn, it's actually quite tough to hit the apex at the cone. Taking a late line usually allows MORE than enough room at the apex for a car taking the correct line to pass-by on the INSIDE, at the apex cone.
So, if the Corvette was, as you wrote, "way out to the left, off line", it would be unlikely that he could even GET TO the apex for the collision to occur at the cone.
Also, you said that the Corvette was "behind you by a few feet." If he was behind you, how did your front quarter hit his right side passenger door? If you were in front, wouldn't he have hit you in the side with *his* front quarter?
I will interject someone else's opinion in this matter - a fellow instructor with whom I was chatting as we heard about the incident and found out that one of the cars involved was the blue Corvette did mention that he had been stuck behind the 'vette earlier, and the 'vette driver was driving peculiar lines and refusing to give point-bys. If this is true (and I don't doubt that it is), I can certainly understand your frustration - we all have been stuck behind slower cars with obstinate drivers that fail to point us by. But, and this is a big but, if you make a pass, you're responsible for doing it safely; if you choose to make a pass without a point-by, the burden of doing it safely is that much greater.
Bottom line (let me know if you disagree with any one or more of the following):
1. It is the responsibility of the passing driver to make a pass safely.
2. Point-bys are required. No point-by was given in this situation. Without a point-by, you should not have passed John in his 355, much less the Corvette. And definitely not both cars simultaneously.
3. According to passing rules, a pass must be completed (the passing car is back on line) before the braking zone. You did not complete the pass before the braking zone, and was not back on line (on the left side of the track) before the braking zone.
4. By definition, if a collision occurs with a passing car while either car is "diving for the apex", then the pass HAS NOT BEEN COMPLETED.
____________
Steven, I've read your posts on Fchat, and have agreed with virtually all of your opinions. I'm grateful for the information you've provided. Again, I write this not because of anything personal, but rather because you and I disagree as to who has the responsibility in a situation like the one you found yourself in yesterday.
I have written the above because of your public post of your viewpoint of the incident. Furthermore, I do think that (a) it is unfair to imply that the organizers of the event (Bob, Matt and Chris) may have slipped up and allowed an unqualified driver to run in the group with you -- though I'm sure you don't mean that, the implication is clear; and (b) it is unfair to label the drivers of a particular brand or model of vehicle as being jerks. How would we all feel if the Corvette driver went around claiming that all Ferrari drivers were egotistical idiots who can't drive simply because one particular Ferrari struck him?
I hope that what I've written allows us to have a dialogue on this, and has not offended you. If we get a chance, I'd love to buy you a drink at Watkins Glen and have a chance to chat. Really, I have no stake in this - I just would like to understand how you've arrived at the conclusions you have.
If you would like to discuss this with me, with John, or with my wife, please email me and I'll give you all the phone numbers.
vty,
--Dennis |
Dave (Maranelloman)
Intermediate Member
Username: Maranelloman
Post Number: 2454
Registered: 1-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, August 03, 2003 - 9:10 pm: | |
Solly, I am sorry. I have the same problem with some Viper drivers who also seem pathologically allergic to giving point by's...maybe they think doing so makes their tiny penises shrink further?
Did the organizers at least kick him out for unsafe driving??? I would have DEMANDED that!!! |
Steven J. Solomon (Solly)
Member
Username: Solly
Post Number: 539
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, August 03, 2003 - 4:38 pm: | |
I am now officially pissed off at Corvette drivers participating in Red run groups at FCA events. Yesterday I watched a few Vette drivers in the red group taking lines I have never seen before and confusing the hell out of everyone behind them. I also saw very few point-bys, whereas almost every F-car driver I know gives point bys when necessary. Maybe the Corvette Club doesn't require them?
I have been overtaken numerous times in the braking zone, and always allowed the faster car to turn in first. IT'S BECAUSE I HAVE SPATIAL AWARENESS!!. I look before I turn.
Well yesterday I was on the front straight at Lime Rock, got point bys from 2 F-car drivers, and overtook a Corvette just as we hit the braking zone. I was on-line for Big Bend and he was way out to the left, off line and behind me by a few feet. Next thing I know he hangs a sharp right to get to the apex, forgetting a basic law of physics that states that 2 bodies cannot occupy an identical space at an identical time.
His front tire hit my front quarter panel and that was it. He drove away, I waited for the flatbed.
I know most of us f-car drivers attend the same events over and over, and if we all don't know each other's capabilities, at least Bob, Matt or Chris have a good idea of who should be in which group. But it is because we all spend so much time with each other. Who is evaluating the capabilities of non F-car drivers (vette's, Porsche, etc?) I also saw a beautiful Porsche GT3 being driven like the driver had no idea what he was doing.
So, are we relying on non f-cars owners to just tell us where they think they should be, or is someone measuring their ability?
I know s--t happens on the track all the time, and we are all big boys, and repairs are a fact of life, but i'd like to know we are all on the same page.
I know I'm venting and no one got hurt, but it could have been much worse if it happened in a higher speed turn. IMHO if you don't know where every car is around you at every instant then you belong in a white/green group. That's why we have mirrors. |
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