| Author | Message | ||
| allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Intermediate Member Username: Allanlambo Post Number: 1027 Registered: 6-2002 |
Not really in the same league as a real car though. | ||
| Michael Vaughan (Vanimal)
Junior Member Username: Vanimal Post Number: 76 Registered: 3-2003 |
Alan and smilling 911 owners - read it and weep.. and it costs the fraction of a F/P/L car. Plus its available in the USA now. Quote "Radical's new SR3 Turbo, driven by touring car ace, Phil Bennett, shattered the Nordschleife lap record of 7:32, by a massive 13 seconds." http://www.radicalmotorsport.com/News_Folder/nordschliefe/index.htm www.radicalwest.com | ||
| allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Intermediate Member Username: Allanlambo Post Number: 1004 Registered: 6-2002 |
No more arguements needed. | ||
| bboxer (Bboxer)
Member Username: Bboxer Post Number: 344 Registered: 8-2001 |
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| allan fiedler (Allanlambo)
Member Username: Allanlambo Post Number: 993 Registered: 6-2002 |
Mark Moon, you fail to mention that in the times you posted, all the Ferraris ran the shorter track, while the Lambos, other than the Murcielago ran the LONGER track. Also, the 550 did not run 2 seconds faster than the Sv, but 2 tenths of a second faster on a shorter track, not to mention the Sv used was an early model, 510hp, not 530hp, also shod with smaller brakes, not the larger brakes available on later model Sv's. | ||
| Mitch Alsup (Mitch_alsup)
Intermediate Member Username: Mitch_alsup Post Number: 1085 Registered: 4-2002 |
"Ferrari is and will remain capacity constrained." This is a GOOD business strategy (for high end products)! When demand is up, the factory is fully utilized and the flippers can make a killing. When demand is down, it only gets down to the number of cars Ferrari can make (anyway) so the factory remains fully utilized. | ||
| Andrew Menasce (Amenasce)
Intermediate Member Username: Amenasce Post Number: 1367 Registered: 10-2001 |
Paul i totally agree with you, i suspect that day the F and P cars werent driven to the max while the Lambo was really pushed ! But in anyway, the Gallardo should be at least 2sec per lap quicker given that it has 100 hp more ,more torque , bigger brakes and that its 4 years newer than the Modena. | ||
| Paul Loussia (Bumboola)
Junior Member Username: Bumboola Post Number: 187 Registered: 3-2003 |
Andrew, One caveat to the lap times you posted- those figures were provided by Lamborghini to Autocar, using a "collection" of drivers, including Giorgio Sanna, their ace test pilot. I suspect that if Ferrari conducted the test, using Dario Benuzzi and their "collection," we might have seen very different results. Having said that, I still believe the Gallardo will prove quicker than a 360 and slower than a 360 Stradale at a track. The Gallardo should be much more forgiving than a 360, which can be a real handful to drive at the limit. Maybe someone should organize a test where Sanna drives a Lamborghini, Benuzzi drives a Ferrari, and Rorhl drives a Porsche- now that would be interesting. | ||
| Andrew Menasce (Amenasce)
Intermediate Member Username: Amenasce Post Number: 1365 Registered: 10-2001 |
James , that is too kind ! Im honored to be one of them.I just wish id live closer , week ends would never be boring ! | ||
| James Glickenhaus (Napolis)
Advanced Member Username: Napolis Post Number: 2619 Registered: 10-2002 |
Andrew I certinally consider you and your Dad among them. Best | ||
| Andrew Menasce (Amenasce)
Intermediate Member Username: Amenasce Post Number: 1362 Registered: 10-2001 |
James you have amazing friends  . And that story about Ferrari giving him an umbrella is priceless! Were they preparing the field for the Barchetta ? | ||
| James Glickenhaus (Napolis)
Advanced Member Username: Napolis Post Number: 2618 Registered: 10-2002 |
Mark Anyone who thinks they're going after Ferrari should begin by digging two graves. Ferrari is and will remain capacity constrained. No matter who builds what they'll never have a prob. selling 3600 cars a year. They build the cars they want and people stand in line to buy them. Always have, always will. When my friend compalined that his F50 leaked they gave him an umbrella. (true) Didn't stop him from buying 2 Enzo's. | ||
| Mark (Study)
Member Username: Study Post Number: 834 Registered: 10-2001 |
James, I've never been interrested in lap times. But the idea that 3 new cars (viper,GT,Baby Lambo) are all going after the 360 with more HP. Well it got me thinking that in this new HP war with-in this very small and well defined class, it would be great to see some lap times. ( I know they don't have them out yet,but I was hoping?) Also the fighting with Lambo guy. I just learned a great deal from Mark Moon's post. I never realy knew that a 360, Diablo SV, and NSX-r all had the same lap time. Kind of neat, next time someone says that a Diablo SV blows away a 360 and the NSX-r is Jap Crap. Well I will have something to say to that guy. LOL | ||
| James Glickenhaus (Napolis)
Advanced Member Username: Napolis Post Number: 2617 Registered: 10-2002 |
Mark I think you're missing a very important point. Lap times IMHO are not a good reason to buy/own a car. If you're looking for lap times for 200K you can buy a 2001 Arrows F1 car that will do the trick. A 10K shifter Kart will satisfy as well. If you're young and have the right stuff I'd reccomened night carrier landings in the rain. Cars of which there are many great ones are about making yourself happy. I've driven the PCH in a Contash and a bug eye sprite and I enjoyed both trips. Neither was "better". A Murcie is quite different than a TR, or a 308, or a 360, or a 250GTO, or a P4. That's the point find one YOU want and can afford and drive it. That's what it's about. | ||
| Mark (Study)
Member Username: Study Post Number: 832 Registered: 10-2001 |
Willis, I like the 360. On the Vette-360 thread I'm not sure what Ferrari is doing with the company business strategy? So I was trying to look at how they define the mission statement. Just some creative thinking. Didn't mean to bash the 360. Just trying to get people to think. I get sick of cheerleaders instead of thinkers. Now on this thread, I thought... People get mad and pissed, and some are only interested in one brand or the other but little is usually based on the facts. I like all these cars. So I thought It would be nice to bring all the facts together. I don't think the 400hp 360 will do as bad as some think aginst all the new 500 hp cars...out to get it. I don't like guys that say "that car is ugly" or "slow" or "dumb". So after a guy says the lambo is ugly and the 360 is dull.. I post some photos just to make that person think twice. As I've said before. Some guys are just "Great Fans" of Ferrari...and like any die-hard sports fan, ferrari in their eyes can do nothing wrong. I love ferrari cars but I'm not a Sports fan. I'm a debate guy, or scientist type. I want to lay out the facts and see what is going on. I thought it would be nice to see all the facts in one place. I realize this might be stupid. Since all tracks and drivers are different. But at least I could get some idea of times that these new cars can do. Lastly.. if you are a Ferrari Hard-core Fan, that's great also. Not everyone has to think like me. Every one has their own way of having fun at F-chat. My goal is to ask real questions but try not to upset people. | ||
| Mark Moon (Enzomoon)
Member Username: Enzomoon Post Number: 292 Registered: 4-2002 |
The following are lap times taken from a website dedicated to the Ring. It shows some revealing numbers, including the fact the the 550 Maranello lapped 2 seconds faster than a Diablo SV(sorry Allan!)and that a 575 was only one second slower than a Diablo GT. So much for Ferraris that don't perform... The site i www.nurburgring.de Lotus Esprit Sport 8.13 993 Turbo 8.12 SL 55 AMG 8.12 Viper GTS 8.10 Diablo SV 8.09 360 8.09 nsx-r 8.09 550 8.07 575 8.05 Diablo GT 8.04 911 GT3 8.03 996 Turbo 7.56 Murcielago 7.50 911 GT2 7.46 It is clear that the Murci is in another league from the Diablo so Lambo is clearly getting with the program. The maranello' times are still very, very impressive given its GT intentions. And of course Porsche show thst it still builds some of the fastet cars anywhere for track use. Regards, Mark | ||
| Willis Huang (Willis360)
Intermediate Member Username: Willis360 Post Number: 1619 Registered: 8-2001 |
Mark, Over at the 360-Vette thread, you kinda ripped into the 360 and it's owners. I'm not sure why we deserved it. Now you've started this thread. Where are you going with this? | ||
| Mark (Study)
Member Username: Study Post Number: 831 Registered: 10-2001 |
"galLardo is said to be faster by 4 sec than a 360 Modena" "Supposedly Challenge Stradale is 3s faster per lap" So the Gallardo is same speed as Challenge Stradale? (just trying to get a basic idea) | ||
| Dan (Bobafett)
Intermediate Member Username: Bobafett Post Number: 1385 Registered: 9-2002 |
Supposedly Challenge Stradale is 3s faster per lap around Fiorano than stock 360 F1. --Dan | ||
| Mark (Study)
Member Username: Study Post Number: 830 Registered: 10-2001 |
What's the new Viper track times look like? | ||
| Mark (Study)
Member Username: Study Post Number: 829 Registered: 10-2001 |
Who was talking about the Ford GT track times in CA test? I saw that on a post recently. How fast is the fastest 360 street car now? What did Lambo test against in AutoCar? | ||
| Andrew Menasce (Amenasce)
Intermediate Member Username: Amenasce Post Number: 1360 Registered: 10-2001 |
What i wrote is true , well its what Lambo said to Autocar when they tested the Gallardo. They took the Gallardo , 360 and 99 6TT to Imola and drove them for a day. | ||
| Mark (Study)
Member Username: Study Post Number: 828 Registered: 10-2001 |
Ernesto, I was wondering if the brain-power at f-chat could nail together all the bits and pieces of test info and make our own half-ass couch racing result sheet. Sort-of scoop the National Mags. Its going to take them another 12 months to get all these cars on a track together. I want to know now! LOL | ||
| Ernesto (T88power)
Intermediate Member Username: T88power Post Number: 1727 Registered: 2-2001 |
as far as i know, there have not been any tests that compare all of these cars around a track at the same time Ernesto | ||
| Andrew Menasce (Amenasce)
Intermediate Member Username: Amenasce Post Number: 1359 Registered: 10-2001 |
Stradale All i know is that around Imola the galLardo is said to be faster by 4 sec than a 360 Modena and by 3 sec than a 996 TT. | ||
| Mark (Study)
Member Username: Study Post Number: 827 Registered: 10-2001 |
I've seen bits and pieces of lap times posted here and there. But is there any way to get good comparisons on these four cars for 2004 models? (lets use straddle for 360)  |