| Author | Message | ||
| Joe (Spider)
New member Username: Spider Post Number: 39 Registered: 9-2003 |
hi guys Reading all that stuff, I have drove both and opted for the 6 sp manual, this is due to the driving experience and uk road network. Reading your messages leads me to beleive its personal taste , and the network of road usage in your given Country, Id go for the F1 every time on the track or if i lived in US. Just my opinion guys! Joe | ||
| ty (360mode)
Junior Member Username: 360mode Post Number: 208 Registered: 9-2002 |
ryan, believe me, you're not the only one who does the "lurch"! actually, that's number #2 on my reasons i won't ever buy an F1 again  | ||
| Ryan Sabga (Sherpa23)
Junior Member Username: Sherpa23 Post Number: 182 Registered: 5-2003 |
Tiptronic drives like an automatic that you get to control, while F1 drives like a manual without a clutch. That explanation sounds wierd but if you roll away from a stop in 1st gear in each, you will know exactly what I mean. With the F1, in 1st, on your first couple of times you will miss the clutch because you have no way to moderate between clutch and throttle, causing the car to jerk at a slow roll (I hope that I am not the only one who experienced this), and with a tiptronic, the car will roll like an automatic but you get to choose the gear changes. The other thing is that there is a significant lag in the shifting on the tiptronic and the F1 is a lot more instantaneous. | ||
| Michael Xu (Chooxu)
New member Username: Chooxu Post Number: 12 Registered: 9-2003 |
Hi, I've been reading what you guys have been posting about the F1. I've never driven one. Can someone explain to me the basics of driving an F1 transmission? How is it different from tiptronic? | ||
| Brian Kennedy (Kennedy)
Member Username: Kennedy Post Number: 421 Registered: 3-2002 |
> Nowhere is it written that an automatic has to have a torque converter. > If it shifts automatically, it's an automatic tranny. Period. By that logic, if it can be shifted manual its a manual tranny, period. So, my wife's Tiptronic is a manual. Bzzt. Note that few people call a CVT an "automatic"... they call it a CVT to distinguish it from torque converters. I believe it is pretty widely accepted that "automatic transmission" has come to mean a "torque converter based transmission". Just as "6-speed" in 360-lingo means a stick, even though an F1 is also a 6-speed. The F1 is an add-on to the same transmission as is in the stick... the same gears get shifted... the same clutch gets engaged. The only differences are who is operating the clutch and how you cause the gears to shift (via stick or via paddle). | ||
| John Fiore (Johnbob)
New member Username: Johnbob Post Number: 8 Registered: 6-2003 |
Thanks for the great feedback. Looks like I will soon be the proud owner of an 01 Spider. I opted to go with the 6-speed. I am still "old school" enough to enjoy the idea of shifting manually with the wind in my hair and the musical sound that is unmistakeably Ferrari. I have no doubt that the F1 concept is here to stay and it is a marvel of technology. Thanks again to all that contributed your comments really helped. Best regards, John | ||
| rick ramage (720)
Junior Member Username: 720 Post Number: 82 Registered: 7-2003 |
"Nowhere is it written that an automatic has to have a torque converter. If it shifts automatically, it's an automatic tranny. Period." give me a break dave. are you trying to intentionally confuse people who might believe what you are saying? i've put a over 20,000 miles on three 360 F1's and driving an F1 is nothing like an automatic. why don't you drive one and then give your insights? | ||
| Dave328GTB (Hardtop)
Member Username: Hardtop Post Number: 679 Registered: 1-2002 |
Nowhere is it written that an automatic has to have a torque converter. If it shifts automatically, it's an automatic tranny. Period. A manual by definition requires a lever to move gears and a means to disengage(clutch). Local dealer told me they have to send reports to FNA every month telling how many orders they have for each model. For the purpose of this report sticks and paddles are considered separate models. Dave | ||
| rick ramage (720)
Junior Member Username: 720 Post Number: 79 Registered: 7-2003 |
hi michael, my wife doesn't like convertibles (too windy and too hot here in so. california) so i went the coupe route. why two modenas? i struggled with which color to buy. i wanted red, but then again i love the 360 in yellow. it was driving me nuts trying to make up my mind. i'd talk about it all the time. day and night. red or yellow. red or yellow. red or yellow. red or yellow. red or yellow. finally my wife suggested a solution problem solved! i just traded my yellow 360 to the dealer for a stradale. i'm going ot get a yellow stradale. but now i'm going nuts over what color interior to order. the stradale seems to come with red/black seats, but i think ferrari will make them any color i want. the stradale is such a special car that i hate to order it with a plain interior, so i'm either going to get the red/black seats or i'm thinking of asking them to make black seats with yellow trim. keep in touch. | ||
| Morrie Richfield (Carnut)
Junior Member Username: Carnut Post Number: 77 Registered: 11-2002 |
I just drove my 01 F1 coupe for the last time yesterday, brought it over to my dealer to go back on their floor for sale, as my 04 gear shift spider will be here soon. There are some things I will miss about the F1, though I figure my Maserati coupe F1 should help get me over that. This is just my opinion, and I'm sure I'll get soome feedback on this, but I think the F1 works alot better in the Maserati than it does in the 360. What I will not miss, is the car deciding a gear for me, Thomas hit on the head on that one. I love the feeling of the shift knob in my hand racking through the gears. I realize 80% of the cars being built are F1, though I sometimes wonder if that is just because they cost ten grand more. I would take an F1 obn the track hands down, but other than the track which I do 99% of my driving a gear shift would be my choice. Im not sure I really get the poseur thing, it took some time to learn to drive the F1 right, reaction different in sport and non sport modes, but after a few weeks it all came together. I say whatever works for you, works best as long as you are let with a smile on your face. | ||
| Michael W. (Whimike)
Junior Member Username: Whimike Post Number: 66 Registered: 7-2003 |
Rick, I noted you have 2 360's. I am curious as to what you do with 2 coupe's? Why not 1 spider 1 coupe? | ||
| Dave Janes (Sparetireless)
Junior Member Username: Sparetireless Post Number: 161 Registered: 1-2003 |
I would recommend the F1 if your average drive is 1 hour or less, I would get the 6 speed if its more. The F1 is very, very fun, down shifts sound great and are perfectly matched, the speed of upshifts cannot be matched, the auto mode is great for a phone call or while holding a coffee. The 6 speed might be more fun at some point. | ||
| Willis Huang (Willis360)
Intermediate Member Username: Willis360 Post Number: 1639 Registered: 8-2001 |
Thomas b, you've hit the mark, dead center, with your first post! | ||
| rick ramage (720)
Junior Member Username: 720 Post Number: 78 Registered: 7-2003 |
hi michael, my apologies. i reread your original post and since we had been passionately discussing the F1 gearbox i erronously thought you were referring to "F1 GEARBOXES" when you said "significant number of 360 owners got THEM to be poseurs". now that i understand what you actually said i can't say that i disagree with you. but from my personal experiences most of the people i've met with ferraris seem to have a sincere appreciation of the car and its history. but i'm sure you are right and a lot of people may simply buy them to show off. too bad. they are missing out on a lot of enjoyment. | ||
| Michael W. (Whimike)
Junior Member Username: Whimike Post Number: 65 Registered: 7-2003 |
Rick, You are putting words into my mouth that I never said. My statement was: "I would be willing to bet that a significant number of 360 owners got them to be poseurs and show off and have no desire to learn to drive them correctly." which for some reason you requoted me as saying: "I would be willing to bet that a significant number of 360 owners got them (F1 gearbox) to be poseurs and show off and have no desire to learn to drive them correctly." My original quote is the accurate one, I am saying a good portion of 360 owners got them (the 360) to be poseurs. Not the F1 option to be a poseurs. I don't think I would lose the bet, I think there is a certain camp that buys these cars for the pure enjoyment of driving them and there is a whole other camp that buys them just to show off. | ||
| Thomas Bergstraesser (Thomas_b)
New member Username: Thomas_b Post Number: 1 Registered: 9-2003 |
I bought a '03 360 Modena F1 a couple of week ago. I did read everything I could find about the F1 before I got the car including the workshop manuals. After 2500 miles on my favorite winding roads I like the paddles and computer based shift. My 996 TT manual shift stays unused and I am starting to playing with the idea to part with it. Overall I did find a lot of misinformation about the F1. I also believe one has to learn and adapt to the system, i.e. a few 100 miles of mixed driving is necessary. Some random observations: - the F1 is not a torque converter, i.e. conventional automatic During shift the torque will go away! This is a little surprising at first if you are used to a conventional automatic. Say you start from a traffic light and switch to second; as it happens the torque will vanish in the middle of the crossing. If you now step off the accelerator it will become bumpy. - the computer tries to predict your intention form how strong you step on the accelerator You have to step on the gas to rev the engine up or the computer will perform a slow shift. The trick is even in stop and go traffic to practice this even if you would not do so in other cars. If you step on the gas before a shift things work out fine. - don't drive it as you would an automatic If you try to modulate the accelerator during start or shifts things will get very confused. Furthermore since the computer will slip the clutch it will wear prematurely. - don't drive near stall speed It is amazing to me how low the engine can rev with gears engaged without stalling. What happens actually is that the computer slips the clutch! The clutch is a closed-loop control circuit consisting of the hydraulic actuator and the sensor. The computer controls how far and with what speed the clutch engages. The shop stated that it is designed to withstand low speed slip operation but I try to avoid it and go into neutral as soon as possible. I find the F1 fun in city / highway traffic but would as happily use a 6 speed. All the fun starts in sport mode above 5K rpm. Pushing the car trough the rev range and hanging on to the steering wheel and flipping through the gears is amazing. Shifting down turning into a curve and accelerating by again flipping through the gears ... or overtaking a car by down shifting and passing with two up shifts ... once the pattern is in your mind it is a blast and actual driving appears much more focused on what is going on outside / on the road There are a few design issues I have with the shift strategy as it is implemented: - if you are in neutral and the speed is below I think 3-4mph you have to engage the brake to be able to shift into gear In stop and go traffic this can get you into trouble if you go into neutral early and role to a near stop. If you are below threshold you have to brake to get into gear and the folks being you will thank you. - if you switch into neutral and back into gear the computer will select the appropriate one. I find it to be the sixth gear in most cases and you have to downshift to get to a reasonable one. Odd. - the complete gear shift mechanism is complex at best. The gear box is shared with the 6 speed box (cost?) and the hydraulic mimics the movements of the gated shifter as well as the clutch operation. One shift operation is a well orchestrated movement forward/backward and left/right plus engage clutch - crazy. Why not take a sequential gearbox (mechanical) and simply put one back/forward actuator on top. At least that was what I asked myself when I studied the F1 chapter in the workshop manual. - if you downshifts with no gas, i.e. not pushing the accelerator there is some back patching (firing?) going on in the intake. Most likely to occur on a highway shifting from 6 to 5th gear. As said before always step on the gas before a shift. Personally I like the F1 system after the first 2k+ miles. Moving forward I believe that most of the problems will be fixed, i.e. double clutch like the Audi SMG (sp?) or better more adaptive software. However if someone does not want to adapt to the way the computer does things he/she will not have a happy experience and it will get expensive. | ||
| rick ramage (720)
Junior Member Username: 720 Post Number: 76 Registered: 7-2003 |
"The F1 is an auto, pure and simple." that's the most inaccurate and misleading thing i've ever heard said about the F1 gearbox. have you ever driven a 360 F1 aggressively on a track or on mountain roads? it's fantastic...and nothing like an automatic transmission. | ||
| rick ramage (720)
Junior Member Username: 720 Post Number: 75 Registered: 7-2003 |
"The F1 is an auto, pure and simple." that's the most inaccurate and misleading thing i've ever heard said about the F1 gearbox. have you ever driven a 360 F1? | ||
| Jim Avery (Boxer12)
Member Username: Boxer12 Post Number: 291 Registered: 6-2003 |
Ooops, I mean 2009, ie, ten yrs out the door. | ||
| Jim Avery (Boxer12)
Member Username: Boxer12 Post Number: 290 Registered: 6-2003 |
As car buyers, we have all faced the manual vs auto decision. The F1 is an auto, pure and simple. Its not for everybody. I would take an F40 with a manual over a 360F1, but that is just IMO. Its always a lively debate. Then again, there are repair costs to consider...I would hate to have to buy a new F1 tran for a 1999 in 2001 (the factory will prob not supply them). | ||
| rick ramage (720)
Junior Member Username: 720 Post Number: 74 Registered: 7-2003 |
DES, it's a blast! manual shifting is fine, but the F1 is really fun...especially when you drive it aggressively. | ||
| DES (Sickspeed)
Senior Member Username: Sickspeed Post Number: 6716 Registered: 8-2002 |
There's something so mystical, so unparallel about cruising along the highway, a snarling flat 12 behind your head that GROWLS at you when you downshift and take off into the night... ...however, i'll admit, i do find myself curious as to what driving an F1 transmissioned-car is like and i'd ultimately like to know, no matter what... | ||
| TOM BUCKLEY (Tom_b)
Junior Member Username: Tom_b Post Number: 96 Registered: 6-2003 |
The F1 is faster at changing gears. But I doubt anyone on this Board would see a difference in lap times at a track. Manual shifting gives you more options while driving at speed. You can select a gear and choose whether or not to let out the clutch , for example. Also, I enjoy grabbing my stick . Good for the soul. Tom | ||
| Scott DeGhetto (Scott63)
Junior Member Username: Scott63 Post Number: 164 Registered: 4-2003 |
After speaking to many dealers, I can tell you that buyers don't specify an F-1 or six speed. The factory at the beginning of every year determines how many of each car they will produce and then the production slots are allocated to dealers. If you are on a waiting list you will be called when they have a slot available for the transmission that you want. The wholesale price differential on the six speed and F-1 have evaporated on 1999 cars and are not that much on 2000 cars. | ||
| rick ramage (720)
Junior Member Username: 720 Post Number: 73 Registered: 7-2003 |
"I would be willing to bet that a significant number of 360 owners got them (F1 gearbox) to be poseurs and show off and have no desire to learn to drive them correctly. Therefore, production numbers mean little to me." i'm sure you'd lose that bet michael. come on. you're kidding, right? "poseurs"? i would bet that most people ordering a new ferrari simply want the best car and the best technology available. when you understand that ferrari no longer uses manual gearboxes on their race cars in favor of the F1 gearbox technology then it makes perfect sense that most people would make a considered decision to keep up with the latest technology and order the F1 gearbox. most people want the new technology and the benefits it brings to the table. but not all people. i'd say about 25 percent either don't want to pay the extra $10K for the F1 or simply enjoy mastering the art of manual shifting. if ferrari ever gave up the F1 in favor of manual gearboxes then i'd bone up on my manual shifting skills and do the best i could but i think that manual gearboxes will soon go the way of the dodo bird... why fight it? | ||
| Dave328GTB (Hardtop)
Member Username: Hardtop Post Number: 678 Registered: 1-2002 |
I can't imagine opening the door, slipping into the seat and not finding the shift knob so perfectly placed a few inches from the steering wheel like all Fcars with sticks have. Another note.... The local Fcar store mgr told me when 360's came out, you could not give away a stick but now the premium for an F1 has almost evaporated in the used market. There is a tendency for new car buyers to get every available option which 2nd owners may or may not care about or be willing to pay extra for. Dave | ||
| Gonzo (Igonzo)
New member Username: Igonzo Post Number: 10 Registered: 9-2003 |
Michael in my opinion you are right ! "I still believe that for those people that want the maximum rewarding experience in driving a 360 that the manual gearbox is an important part of that equation" | ||
| Michael W. (Whimike)
Junior Member Username: Whimike Post Number: 64 Registered: 7-2003 |
Ernesto: "Most people who have problems (that Ive seen) are because they drive their F1 car like an automatic transmission, something that will fry the clutch!" How is one supposed to drive the F1? What causes the clutch to fry if driven like an automatic? | ||
| Michael W. (Whimike)
Junior Member Username: Whimike Post Number: 63 Registered: 7-2003 |
"i am firmly on the side of the F1 gearbox. i'm not sure of the exact numbers but i think it is something like 75+ percent of new 360's are ordered with the F1 gearbox. that would seem to indicate that most 360 ferrari owners want the newer technology." I would be willing to bet that a significant number of 360 owners got them to be poseurs and show off and have no desire to learn to drive them correctly. Therefore, production numbers mean little to me. "If you do "search" and go back to 1999 when the 360 came out, you'll discover that there were a lot of complaints about the 6spd. Percentage wise, there are probably more complaints from the 6spd owners than the F1 owners." You are referring to a problem in the pre-2001 models with the clutch on the 360M models, this was resolved. There was never an issue with the actual gearbox that i am aware of. In regars to the Enzo and Challenge cars only coming with F1, of course... These cars are designed for the track, and thus ultimate speed is the #1 priority. If we are all professional race car drivers where we care about every 1/10th of a second on lap times, then sure F1 is the way to go. (Yes, I know very few Enzo's would ever make it on a track, but the Enzo is Ferrari's street race car and therefore the F1 is a given.) I still believe that for those people that want the maximum rewarding experience in driving a 360 that the manual gearbox is an important part of that equation, at least to me it is. I am sure I can get used to the F1, if that were my only choice, I would just long for the manual. | ||
| rick ramage (720)
Junior Member Username: 720 Post Number: 72 Registered: 7-2003 |
"I don't want F1, don't need F1, and as long as we are on the subject, I find the ABS system on the F355 not as much help on the track as others indicate it should be (except in the wet) but it is a safey margin on the road that is well worth the imposition. The European F355s had a switch to disable ABS." TIC sounds like some old timer who doesn't like any of the new gall darn things that us young whipper snappers like nowadays. LOL. relax. nobody is forcing anybody to drive one of those dang fangled contraptions with F1s, lousy traction control and ABS. back in my day when men were men we had to walk to school uphill in the snow...both ways | ||
| Ernesto (T88power)
Intermediate Member Username: T88power Post Number: 1750 Registered: 2-2001 |
I have had my 360F1 for 3+ years, zero tranny related issues. I like it much better than the manual, but its all a matter of taste. The F1 allows me to share the 360 by letting other people drive it that otherwise I wouldnt trust with a traditional manual. Also, the much faster shifting is a big performance boost. If you go to track events, it will be much more enjoyable and will be able to concentrate much more. The only advice I give is that a quick test drive is not indicative of F1 tranny behavior. You really have to spend some time with the car to take in the full experience, basically needing to "learn" to drive all over again. Most people who have problems (that Ive seen) are because they drive their F1 car like an automatic transmission, something that will fry the clutch! For me, I havent looked back, and my next Fcar will definitely have an F1 tranny. Ernesto | ||
| Mitch Alsup (Mitch_alsup)
Intermediate Member Username: Mitch_alsup Post Number: 1118 Registered: 4-2002 |
"i'm not sure of the exact numbers but i think it is something like 75+ percent of new 360's are ordered with the F1 gearbox. that would seem to indicate that most 360 ferrari owners want the newer technology. also, ferrari does not even offer manual gearboxes on either of their two most aggressive models (the enzo and the stradale). this speaks volumes about what ferrari thinks about manual vs. F1 gearboxes. it also lends some weight to the talk about ferrari eventually dropping manual gearboxes entirely??" Just because the first time buyers want F1 gear boxes, the second and third owners may not. This may cause a glut of F1s (5 years down the road) and cause the F1s to sell for less than the M6s. Second and third time buyers are much more price sensitive to maintenance than firs time buyers. As for the Enzo, anyone who can spend $700K+ for a car can $1000+ for an oil change can afford the F1 transmission. One could even take the position that F1 transmissions were invented to increase the profit margins of the factory service bays...... I don't want F1, don't need F1, and as long as we are on the subject, I find the ABS system on the F355 not as much help on the track as others indicate it should be (except in the wet) but it is a safey margin on the road that is well worth the imposition. The European F355s had a switch to disable ABS. | ||
| J.D. Smythe (Jeff)
Member Username: Jeff Post Number: 276 Registered: 2-2001 |
"this is like discussing religion. i fully respect the views and opinions of the manual gearbox group. they are very passionate about ferraris which is why i like ferrarichat so much." _______________________________________________ Rick I fully agree with your statement. My problem with the 6spd was this. Every sports car that I owned, from the 60's&70's muscle cars to the 90's corvettes and porsches, all the cars were a standard shift. Then I bought the 360 6spd. It was the worst shifting car i ever drove. It drove me nuts and was not pleasant to drive. When the car was cold, I would have to do the 1-3 shift to avoid 2nd gear. You would think that Ferrari would have cured this issue after 50+ years of making standard shifts. My father's 59 Ford with a column shift shifted better. Then the car bagan to have clutch/shifting problems and I couldn't wait to get rid of the car. I do miss the sound of "click click". All Ferrari has to do is put the "click click" sound effect in the F1 and they would have a winner | ||
| Morrie Richfield (Carnut)
Junior Member Username: Carnut Post Number: 74 Registered: 11-2002 |
Everybody has an opinion on this one, so I'll add mine. My 01 360F1 is now sitting on Algar Ferrari s showroom, as my 04 spider 6 speed will be here in Nov, or early Dec. I enjoyed the F1 (bought an 03 Maserati Coupe in F1), but you me there is nothing like shifting gears, I just feel more in control of the car and more one with the car. I'd spend some time in each tranny and see what you really like. | ||
| rick ramage (720)
Junior Member Username: 720 Post Number: 71 Registered: 7-2003 |
this is like discussing religion. i fully respect the views and opinions of the manual gearbox group. they are very passionate about ferraris which is why i like ferrarichat so much. most new 360's are ordered with the F1 gearbox. some people believe that most ferrari owners want the experience of a manual gearbox. i don't believe this is true. there certainly are those who feel strongly about mastering the art of driving, and how shifting gears manually is necessary to accomplish this goal. but where you draw the line? what about traction control and anti-lock brakes? if you master manual shifting but rely on "driver aids" such as traction control and anti-lock brakes then some might say you really haven't mastered the art of driving the car. so why not use all the best technology (including F1 gearboxes) ferrari has to offer? plus it's a lot of fun. sure, manual shifting is also fun, but F1 is even more fun (in a different way) and it's the newest technology. i am firmly on the side of the F1 gearbox. i'm not sure of the exact numbers but i think it is something like 75+ percent of new 360's are ordered with the F1 gearbox. that would seem to indicate that most 360 ferrari owners want the newer technology. also, ferrari does not even offer manual gearboxes on either of their two most aggressive models (the enzo and the stradale). this speaks volumes about what ferrari thinks about manual vs. F1 gearboxes. it also lends some weight to the talk about ferrari eventually dropping manual gearboxes entirely?? | ||
| J.D. Smythe (Jeff)
Member Username: Jeff Post Number: 273 Registered: 2-2001 |
John I've had the privilege to own 2 360s. One was a 6spd and the other an F1. The 6spd was a major disappointment. It had numerous shifting problems and was in the shop for repair for about 5 weeks. I will never buy a 6spd Ferrari again. The F1 has been a total joy to own and drive and has had zero problems. If the 360 Spider is your first Ferrari, then the storied history of the "gated shifter" and "click click" would have no influence on your decision. One of your concerns is the reliability issues of the F1. Take a look at the hard numbers. The F1 probably accounts for 75-80% of the 360 sales. If there were reliability issues with the F1 then you would be reading/hearing of complaints from a lot of F1 owners not just a handful. If you do "search" and go back to 1999 when the 360 came out, you'll discover that there were a lot of complaints about the 6spd. Percentage wise, there are probably more complaints from the 6spd owners than the F1 owners. Once again this is just my opinion from an owner who has owned both. | ||
| ty (360mode)
Junior Member Username: 360mode Post Number: 194 Registered: 9-2002 |
it was covered under warranty but i don't recall the specific technical cause... sorry. i believe it was a somewhat common problem so your local dealer probably can explain, much better than i ever could. ask about the new warranty that is coming or is out. as i understand, it's much more comprehensive than the old powertrain warranty and i would think it would cover the F1. | ||
| Darryl - TR&328 (Tr328)
Junior Member Username: Tr328 Post Number: 114 Registered: 6-2003 |
My next Ferrari will be a 360 Spider with manual shifting! I don't care for the F1. I have tracked my car and manual is fast enough for me. Just my opinion. | ||
| John Fiore (Johnbob)
New member Username: Johnbob Post Number: 7 Registered: 6-2003 |
Ty, Can you elaborate on "the failure" how was it resolved. If it was on warrentee fix do you have an idea of what the cost would be if the car was out of warrentee? I have been looking at the 01's due to price and probably will not have factory coverage. Thanks, John | ||
| ty (360mode)
Junior Member Username: 360mode Post Number: 190 Registered: 9-2002 |
my '01 had the "failure" twice in about 4k miles - it goes into N and won't come out. but i thought people had said this problem had, for the most part, been worked out. the manual shifter on the 360 is like butter, imo. i had a 6 spd 355 and there is no comparison in terms of "smoothness". and you can actually get it into first and second gear while it's cold | ||
| ELI (Titanium360)
Member Username: Titanium360 Post Number: 637 Registered: 4-2002 |
John, i have had two F1's and one 6 speed during the past two year and i love the F1. my 03 spider trans. is much much smoother than the previous years and would not go back to a 6 speed. | ||
| Paul Bianco (Paulie_b)
Member Username: Paulie_b Post Number: 875 Registered: 1-2003 |
To each his/her own.....I love the F1. | ||
| John Fiore (Johnbob)
New member Username: Johnbob Post Number: 6 Registered: 6-2003 |
Great feedback guys. Would someone with a six speed that has driven a Testarossa compare the shifting characteristics? I have an 86 TR that I love but frankly the shifter is a little tempermental. You really have to be on the money to "nail" a shift. (not to imply that I am complaining I love the car and will probly never sell it). Also just as important F1 reliability, I would assume that since it has been in production for quite a while and since it is Ferrari that it is bullet proof, but would like to hear about actual experience good or bad. Thanks for the great feedback. | ||
| Michael W. (Whimike)
Junior Member Username: Whimike Post Number: 61 Registered: 7-2003 |
I agree with the manual transmission club. I believe the manual is 100 times more fun than the F1. There is the ultimate satisfaction in performing a flawless heel-toe downshift during braking into a corner with the manual. The F1 automates this process to the point where you smile at the result, but your entire involvement in that successful procedure was the pulling of a lever. The manual makes you a better "involved" driver, it teaches you how to master the car, that heel-toe will sometimes go wrong and sometimes go right, and that practice to perfection is a learning experience not to be missed. There was a comment talking about how F1 is used on all the race cars and that should be case in point as to which is better. I think that is not a rational answer for your question. The F1 is used in racing because it allows the quickest possible shift for the edge in overall lap speed, in racing the overall drivers experience is traded for overall speed. So, consequently, if you are concerned with outright speed then the F1 is a no brainer. However, if you are like most Ferrari owners and want the "experience" I believe the manual gives you that better than the F1. Just one mans opinion. | ||
| stephen winter (355f)
New member Username: 355f Post Number: 37 Registered: 6-2003 |
I have had a manual 355 and F1 variants and driven a 360 manual for some time. Without doubt both have different characters but lets face it the manual box is hardly the paragon of efficiency is it? there are many better manual boxes out there! so either option is not perfect | ||
| Izel K. (Ferrarist)
Member Username: Ferrarist Post Number: 297 Registered: 3-2001 |
There's something very satisfying about nailing a perfect downshift in the twisties with a gated shifter... ... Oh and the click it makes!! | ||
| 911 Fan (911fan)
Junior Member Username: 911fan Post Number: 51 Registered: 5-2003 |
There's something very satisfying about nailing a perfect downshift in the twisties with a gated shifter... | ||
| Ryan Sabga (Sherpa23)
Junior Member Username: Sherpa23 Post Number: 171 Registered: 5-2003 |
John, LOL!!! | ||
| john (Johnwto)
Junior Member Username: Johnwto Post Number: 118 Registered: 6-2002 |
i had a '98 355F1 and will never buy an F1 tranny again. i just can't stand driving a car like this w/o a standard tranny. there have been many threads on the mertis of the F1 vs. a traditional manual, but it really comes down to personal preference. i have a 6 speed now and absolutely LOVE IT! it's impossible not to smile... "looking down at that gated shifter"!! man, i sound just like ty! | ||
| ty (360mode)
Junior Member Username: 360mode Post Number: 189 Registered: 9-2002 |
i had an '01 F1 and will never buy an F1 tranny again. i just can't stand driving a car like this w/o a standard tranny. there have been many threads on the mertis of the F1 vs. a traditional manual, but it really comes down to personal preference. i have a 6 speed now and absolutely LOVE IT! it's impossible not to smile... "looking down at that gated shifter"!! with that said, i agree that the F1 is some incredible technology. the downshifts are simply amazing. but for me, it's technology i just don't want | ||
| Ryan Sabga (Sherpa23)
Junior Member Username: Sherpa23 Post Number: 170 Registered: 5-2003 |
Everything that Rick said is absolutely right, however, here is the counterpoint: Driving a manual Ferrari underscores a pleasure not easily found in other cars. The level of interaction with such a grand machine afforded by a manual transmission creates an incredible bond with the car. There is nothing quite as satisfying as pushing hard on the brakes while blipping the throttle, slipping the lever perfectly in its place in the gate, and releasing the clutch without so much as a shudder from the car. To me, that level of interaction is a major part of the pleasure of owning a Ferrari. And I haven't even talked of the shifter itself. Ferrari has been able to make its gated manual shifter and icon in its own right. For some of us it is very hard to buy Ferrari without one of the very characteristics that sparked the passion in our hearts so many years before. I won't argue the technnology or speed but as I am concerned, the manual shifter connects to the heritage of the past while allowing us to enjoy the technology of the present and it does so in such a way that can only be described as pure Ferrari. | ||
| rick ramage (720)
Junior Member Username: 720 Post Number: 70 Registered: 7-2003 |
i've owned three 360 F1 modenas. i put 9000 miles on my first one and the F1 gearbox was flawless. in fact, i never had any problems with any part of the car. i have nearly 6000 miles on my other two 360's and have not had any problems. i've driven 360's with a 6-speed manual on the track. it was great...BUT the F1 is even better IMHO. ferrari doesn't put manual gearboxes in their formula one cars, right? the F1 gearbox can shift faster than you can manually, and it's a good feeling to have both hands on the wheel when driving aggressively. most 360's are ordered with F1 gearboxes so people seem to be leaning towards the newer technology. i've even heard some talk that ferrari may eventually stop offering manual gearboxes because it is old technology. i know a lot of people love manual shifting, but as far as i'm concerned driving the F1 fast and hard is 100 times more fun than the manual gearbox driving a 360 F1 "casually" is like kissing through a screen door. drive it very hard through the upshifts (you don't ever have to lift off the throttle at all). it's great! then get on the brakes hard and downshift aggressively (bap, bap) and listen as the F1 blips the throttle. it's impossible not to smile | ||
| John Fiore (Johnbob)
New member Username: Johnbob Post Number: 5 Registered: 6-2003 |
I am getting close to purchasing a 360 Spider. I had my mind set on a 6-speed manual but before I purchase would like to hear feedback regarding the F1. I have driven an F1 in a 360 but only for a short and casual drive. It was "different" as I had thought it was a manually shifted "automatic". I was surprised to find out that it is actually a electrohydraulic manual. I would like to know the reliability issues with the F1 and also which is faster. When I say faster I would like to clearify that I do not intend to track the car but would like to know if either the manual or F1 is noticably quicker than the other. Thanks | ||
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