| Author |
Message |
Herbert Edward Gault (Irfgt)
| | Posted on Friday, November 02, 2001 - 7:10 pm: | |
This is true for any car in reality. Short trips and a lot of heat cycles are your cars worst enemy. Having said that though, this is why we also purchase disposable transportation to use and save the Ferrari for fun trips which is about the only practical use for the things anyway. |
James (Jim_Red308)
| | Posted on Friday, November 02, 2001 - 6:55 pm: | |
Stu: I don't claim to be a ferrari expert especially when it comes to the mechanics - but the original owner I bought my euro 308 gtsi from did mention to me that it is very important that the oil temperature gets up before getting on it. I have also been told by another ferrari friend source that these cars really need to be driven-not good on them to go to the neighborhood seven eleven for a Big gulp & right back. Save it for the weekend pal & I think that's good advice! Avanti!!!!!!!!! |
Tim N (Timn88)
| | Posted on Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 5:40 pm: | |
Yeah, they never break. mine has 116,000 on it and it has another 116,000 in it. The only thing is i cant abuse it because i dont want to break the axles or anything in the tranny. I'll admit i have smoked the tires in a way you would never think a 145hp honda ever could and i really know how much it can take. I just stay away from that stuff with the wheel turned or in reverse. and i have been known to yank the e-brake in parking lots. But im responsible about this stuff for the most part. |
Tim N (Timn88)
| | Posted on Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 5:40 pm: | |
Yeah, they never break. mine has 116,000 on it and it has another 116,000 in it. The only thing is i cant abuse it because i dont want to break the axles or anything in the tranny. I'll admit i have smoked the tires in a way you would never think a 145hp honda ever could and i really know how much it can take. I just stay away from that stuff with the wheel turned or in reverse. and i have been known to yank the e-brake in parking lots. But im responsible about this stuff for the most part. |
Herbert Edward Gault (Irfgt)
| | Posted on Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 5:35 pm: | |
Tim, I work on a great number of cars that just putter around town and the only problems that I encounter is 02 sensors that fail more often and they need the oil changed more often but other than that a Honda will run indefinately. |
Martin (Miami348ts)
| | Posted on Tuesday, October 30, 2001 - 8:14 am: | |
I though the last wet sump was the carburated 308 engine. After that they were all dry, right? Even the carb 308 Euros were dry already. |
'75 308 GT4 (Peter)
| | Posted on Monday, October 29, 2001 - 10:39 pm: | |
Tim, we've discussed the Accusump pre-oiler before in other Tech postings here. In the Ferrari's instance, its useful (in 3qt size) on start-up only, but is still starved under heavy cornering. the FCA-NW region has a good write-up on dry-sumping vs. Accusump in their Tech section. I remember Nick sells an Accusump kit that is two 3qt's working side by each.
Any Accusump on any engine is still better than none in my opinion.
I may remind you as well, that the majority of 308's (and other street Ferraris) are wet-sump engines. |
Tim N (Timn88)
| | Posted on Monday, October 29, 2001 - 8:52 pm: | |
you think its hard driving you cars that short listen to this. Every moringing my mom drives my dad to the train station, which is 5 mins rnd trip. she comes home, i take the car to school an hour later, which is a 3-10 min drive depening on how stupid the crossing guard is. Then, afer school i drive literally 1 min to football pract. (our field isnt at the school) then after practice i drive 4 mins home. How bad is this for my car?! btw, its the 94 honda, i hope it kicks soon, im ready for a new car. |
Tim N (Timn88)
| | Posted on Monday, October 29, 2001 - 7:24 pm: | |
Yeah, it should be really esay to add a pre oiler to it since its dry sump. It would cut down so much on engine wear, since most of it occurs at start up. I remeber seeing them in summit racing, you can shoot oill into the engine before starting it to cut down on wear. it will also save your engine. If oil pressure drops it has 3 qts. to put into the system, good for going around a long turn, or for sustained heavy breaking. |
James P. Smith (Tigermilk)
| | Posted on Monday, October 29, 2001 - 2:49 pm: | |
Stu, I second the vote for riding to work. If I could I would. But I can't imagine riding my road bike on the same streets as the Houston commuters with them whizzing by at 60+.
I have actually put more miles on my road bike of 2 months than I have on my 308 I picked up in May. I'm up to around 1300 miles on the bike compared to about 1200 on the car. And I've lost 4 inches on the gut through various forms of biking this year. Feels great. Of course, driving the 308 is a bigger blast. And fortunately my commute is 22 miles, mostly on the highway at 80-90 mph, cops willing.
So anyone know where I can get a bike rack for a 308! |
Martin (Miami348ts)
| | Posted on Monday, October 29, 2001 - 2:14 pm: | |
Hey Stu,
I received an e-mail from you today. That virus that was going around a few months ago.
Might want to run a virus scan on your drives. |
stu cordova (Balataboy)
| | Posted on Monday, October 29, 2001 - 10:17 am: | |
Some interesting thoughts....helpful as well! I think I'll leave the driving for the weekends - at least through the winter.
So, William - you've seen a picture of me, have you? How did you know I need to get into shape? Great suggestion - to ride. The only bike I have is my Harley and I love riding it, but I know it's not providing much exercise - oh well.
Martin - I am a member of the NW club and true, they do have some great outings! A great way to get her opened up - which my car so dearly loves! |
Michael (Mtabije)
| | Posted on Monday, October 29, 2001 - 3:54 am: | |
If start up is a problem because the cylinders are not yet oiled up, can you retro fit a pre oiler for your Ferrari? I think I remember seeing kits for old muscle cars....hmm? |
Ben Lobenstein 90 TR (Benjet)
| | Posted on Sunday, October 28, 2001 - 6:34 pm: | |
Add me to this boat.
Worst thing is what happened to me this week. I have been a bit busy and not in town much the last few weeks. Didn't really think about it, but it had been almost 3 weeks since I have driven (or started up) the TR, YIKES! Time to MAKE TIME to get the poor horse out to stretch. Fire her up (after the batt has drained to nothing)...and something ain't right here....something is awry - things just aren't right. Let her warm up a VERY long time. But she isn't sounding right at all, no misfire but well not the song I'm used to. I decide to maybe give her an Italian tune up and go for a short spin. This is where things get ugly.....No power, stalls several times, I was heading out only a few miles and she's well warmed but not her self no matter what. Get over to my small Italian mastermind (friend of mine with a shop open weekends), he points out that one side of my exhuast is hot the other cold (I have completely independent exhausts).
Problem discovered, I am now driving a very expensive straight six. Check for power coming into coils, check is good. Grab indcutive timing light, have spark everywhere...hmmm ok now we have quickly narrowed it down to FUEL! Open the (already problematic) fuse and relay center, pull relays and jump power out to pumps - get one pump to run but not the other...put relays back in and start car...the dead bank just switched sides!
Grab 2 non Ferrari/Bosch relays from his shelves drop them both in and fire up, TR responds firing on all 12 and I know I should be driving her more.
This is her way of telling me that.
-Ben |
Tony Brooker (Tony355f1)
| | Posted on Sunday, October 28, 2001 - 6:33 pm: | |
I live in Hong Kong and I find that the engine gets hot damn quick cos of the climate. Unfortunately, the 355 F1 does not have an oil temp gauge, just the bar, so I have to rely on a combination of water temp and sound/feeling from the engine. My drive to work is about 13 miles and for the first mile I keep the revs below 4k. After that, every man for himself. I've driven like this for 7k miles and never had a problem with the engine. |
Martin (Miami348ts)
| | Posted on Sunday, October 28, 2001 - 6:33 am: | |
I live literally 5 blocks from my office. I take the car every morning. This way, when I have to run out of the office to one of the properties I car drive in the F and get some mileage on the car. I have not experienced any distress. When we had the engine out last month there was no exessive wear on any of the parts. Usual stuff only. Gotta be careful while it is still cold but that is it. I'd drive it. Have fun and enjoy your ride to work. Maybe skip the lunch and have a break in your car blasting around town. |
'75 308 GT4 (Peter)
| | Posted on Sunday, October 28, 2001 - 1:40 am: | |
I'm a living example of this. I'm restricted with my insurance not to drive it to work, but it doesn't matter anyways because I live 5 minutes away, no exagerration. Since putting the car back on the road in late September, I've been driving it on the weekends only. Today I took it out, visited an automobilia store in Vancouver, then drove it up the Cypress Ski hill road (drove in a little bit of snow!!! Wish I had my camera). I put over 100 miles on it today and twice reached 100 mph (not in the snow!).
It takes a little longer to warm up after not driving it for a week and idles kinda sh--y. But after warm-up, I take it easy and then its fine. |
Michael A. Niles (Man90tr)
| | Posted on Saturday, October 27, 2001 - 10:49 pm: | |
I do short drives in town only after highway driving. I, like Willis, drive 80 - 100 miles per trip. I drove 128 yesterday and 146 today. But I also went to kids soccer game and a school parent dinner. These short trips (less than 8 miles each) is no problem after a 130 mile high speed/high rpm trip. I would never do the short stuff alone.
I vote for making your 308 a weekend car. Bret's idea of short high speed runs is fine but there is one big draw back to those. High heat with little air cooling exchange of the radiator. At least on the track you are moving continually and get the cooling effect of some air flow around the car. The difference in my TR is amazing. On the highway I can do bursts with no problem from 70 to 110 at high rpms and on the temps stay at 190/190. But get off the highway and do a couple bursts from 50 to 80 then stop at a light and then do it again and the temps skyrockets to 220. At least my entire engine is really warm already, I can't see how this is healthy if your engine starts cold, does those high rpm runs, then is shut off right away. Just my 2 cents. |
Willis Huang (Willis360)
| | Posted on Saturday, October 27, 2001 - 10:23 pm: | |
It takes about 10 miles to get the oil to warm up in a 360. Short distance driving is tolerable. However, the car does let you know that it's unhappy after a few short trips. I normally put in 80 to 100+ miles per trip. My 360's driven 4 to 5 times per week.
Stu, you might want to leave your car for weekend driving. The car would be more enjoyable that way. |
BretM (Bretm)
| | Posted on Saturday, October 27, 2001 - 8:17 pm: | |
What William is talking about is very true. Most people don't realize that when the water temperature is at normal operating temps the engine is no where near being warmed up. The cylinders and block heat up at different rates which is the reason that great amounts of wear can occur before being given time for both of them to truly warm up. I usually use oil temperature as a good indicator because that takes longer. When the oil is about at 160 I feel good with starting to have some fun. |
martin J weiner,M.D. (Mw360)
| | Posted on Saturday, October 27, 2001 - 5:25 pm: | |
Stu,
Are you a member of the NWFCA? There are quite a few tours with the Wash grp and the portland contingent plus track days at PIR and SIR where you can warm that baby up. |
William H (Countachxx)
| | Posted on Saturday, October 27, 2001 - 4:45 pm: | |
sounds to me like its better to save it for the weekends. The most damage is done to the engine on startup cus the cylinders r not well oiled yet. Why dont u ride a bike to work, get yourself in shape & leave the 308 for weekends? |
BretM (Bretm)
| | Posted on Saturday, October 27, 2001 - 4:03 pm: | |
Not letting a car fully warm up will in the long run cause significant problems. I would try and let the car warm up in the garage for a little while before you go just to get everything a little hotter. Theoretically a car should be driven easily soon after start up so as to prevent condensation from sitting in it, but I think with the EPA/DOT things on the 308 it creates enough pressure to make short work of any condensation when just sitting and idling. I think with a little warm up in the morning you will be at operating temps by the time you get to work. As long as on the weekend you're driving it around to let it stretch its legs it should be pretty much fine. I used to always take the long way to school when I took the 308, it was fun, but I can see how that would be different for you.
Another idea I just thought of is to race around your street for awhile before going to work, run time trials around the neighborhood, the neighbors will love it... |
Frederick Thomas (Fred)
| | Posted on Saturday, October 27, 2001 - 2:56 pm: | |
Stu,
I am in the same situation. My work is very close and the car does not even get close to warmed up on the short drive so I leave it at home. If on the other hand I know that during the day I need to run an errand or go to another location then I will take it. Either way if I don't take it to work it gets driven when I get home weather permitting. |
stu cordova (Balataboy)
| | Posted on Saturday, October 27, 2001 - 2:30 pm: | |
I've been reading the posts on another thread about how low mileage cars/garage queens have more problems and are worth less than higher mileage/daily driven cars. So, here's my dilemma; I live only 4 miles from work and when I drive my 308, it isn't even warmed up yet by the time I arrive at the office. The water temp guage is slightly up and the oil temp guage hasn't moved at all. The car is still so cold that as I pull into the office I still can't get it into second gear without some force.
So, for those of you who are big believers in driving daily, is it better for me to drive everyday or to just leave the driving to short (all I have time for) weekend hops? Am I actually hurting the car by driving it such a short distance and not allowing it to get to operating temps? I know what you're thinking - but the traffic is so heavy at that time of the morning that going the "long" route would mean sitting in 5 mile an hour bumper to bumper traffic and that can't be good for it either - can it?
I would love to hear from you guys as to what you would do - daily drive or not? |
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