| Author | Message | ||
| Michael A. Niles (Man90tr)
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Dan: I heard about the shop in Manassas, but have never seen their work. I would research them more first. I an visit them for you if you like as i am always in Manassas. As far as experience and know of how that is a KNOWN quantity, Grand Touring, is a given. Everyone I have spoken, 4 people at Cavallino and here in The area swear by them. Personally I have only talked to the owner on the phone. If you want I would gladly go up and visit the shop with you as I would like to see it also. And you are correct David is busy with larger projects. Just so you know David Carte was one of the people who recommended Grand Touring to me. BTW, flew over your house around 4 PM today (yesterday given the time).  | ||
| Daniel B Reese MD (Dbr328gtb)
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Thanks David and Chris, I need to get my front hood fixed- the usual bend over the hood strut thing. Who would you recommend for that? I am thinking of using David Carte at Classic and sport (but he seems so busy with bigger F projects). I think he'll do it but understandably I dont think this small job is a big priority for him. Heard nice things about his work. | ||
| David Albright (Dalbright)
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Just noticed the following shop in our (FCA) 2001 directory. Never used them and dont know of anyone who has. Here's the info: Tifs Foreign Car Care Specializing in..... Ferrari BMW Porsche 11 Gibralter Avenue, Annapolis MD 21401 410-268-8288 | ||
| Chris Richardson (Boozy)
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For body work on a Ferrari there is only one place I know of in the area that does Ferrari quality work, actually better than the factory. It is called Autocrafters and it is in Manassas park. 703-335-9646. The owner's name is Robert and he will be glad to show you pictures of my 348 Spider. His work approaches perfection and is less than any of the factory authorized repair centers. | ||
| Mike Sweeney (Mike85mon)
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I just had my first dealings with FOW and found them excellent. I bought a 85 Mondial (from Texas)that need a good bit of work and felt they did a great job at a resonable price. They did a complete checkup on the car and listed everything that needed repair. They then broke it down into things that needed work now and things that could wait. The final price was actually less than the estimate and the car was delivered on time. | ||
| Michael A. Niles (Man90tr)
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Jon, Thanks for the complete response. I concur with your assessment. I came in initially at a time of change it seems. I did notice the change in techs and experienced the "long" wait for the car for simple repairs (that was a couple years ago). Seems like they go the word from others and shapened up. You are correct about the bills. Even with my simple stuff, I had a couple errors, but then again accounting may not be a strong point. One thing I keep hearing is that there is shift to selling and taking car of the new models at the "expense" of taking care of older models. Again, cars that require little work never see this but the biggest complaints I have heard are from 308, Mondial and 328 drivers who need a good bit of stuff done. Their supply chain is also different. I needed a switch and was told 10 - 14 days, I called around and got it in 1. This seems common as they must go through FNA stockpiles while there maybe 5 of the same things right down the street. All in all I agree, very competent. Look forward to seeing running around the track at Summit. I have yet to track my TR as I should go through driving school as such first. Michael | ||
| Jon P. Kofod (95f355c)
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Michael, I am not sue what constitutes everyones definition of "a lot of work" but I think I probably spend more money at FOW service department except the full fledged race guys who compete in the Challenge series (don't ask what they spend, but I am sure it would by a nice sized house here in DC) During race/track season my car spends most of it's time at FOW. I have spent a ton of money running the car over the past few years. I do about 15+ track events/races per year. FOW also carried out all the work to convert my stock 95 F355 to a Challenge car last winter. What most have said on this board is true. If you don't need a whole bunch of service or have an older Ferrari (one that is not super mega rare) they are not bad on cost. But if you have something fairly new (355, 360, 550) or you require race/track prep work they are enourmously expensive. Don't get me wrong, everyone is in business to make money, but 50% to 100% markups on parts are not uncommon at FOW on newer cars. They also don't take too kindly too intalling customer purchased parts like tires, rotors, and pads. If you take you car to the track much it will cost you. I have been a customer of FOW for nearly five years and get along well with all the staff in the service department, but I must say that in recent months FOW has been marking up items much too high. Problem is most customers have no idea that the Pirelli slicks they purchased for track day for $575 a tire cost FOW roughly $300 or that their source also sells scrubs for $200 (oh and they also charge on top of this for balancing and mounting). I have since found the source of their tires and can get them for nearly what they pay for them. I haven't approached them about mounting them yet and wonder if this will be an issue. Another example is rotors which are fairly expensive for Challenge cars (355's run about $700 each and on 360's they run over $900). I found a source that sells them for about $400 in California and have also located a few other alternatives. My most recent problem of cracked headers highlighted more excessive dealer markups. FOW quoted me $3200 for new headers. So I was curious and called Algar and they quoted me $2800. I asked if this was normal to get different quotes from different dealers and the Algar guy told me that most dealers charge close to cost from FNA. He told me that he was in front of his computer and that FNA listed the headers for $2800. This left me a bit upset with FOW. I also got the same quote of $2800 from Shelton. The other problem is that FOW has never ever handed me a bill that was correct. In most cases they overbilled me but in some cases actually underbilled me for some items or forgot to charge me altogether for labor or parts. They are constantly issuing me credits. You have to stay on top of them or there will be mistakes. If all you get is an oil change your bill will likely be in order, but in my case the bill is usually a few pages. In the past year I have come to the conlusion that I will start doing much of the work myself (rotors, pads, oil changes, brake bleeding etc..) and have wheels and tires mounted elsewhere. The big items unfortuntally need to still be done at FOW such as anything engine related. All in all, I have a decent relationship with FOW, their work seems competent, they are very prompt and curteous about pick up and delivery of my car and they allow me keep the car at FOW during the season. They have also on occasion delivered my car to Summit Point when my trailer was being repaired for a very nominal fee. But I am going to look to cut costs next year where I can and use them for the major serivces. They also seem to be having staffing problems as in the past 12 months they have lost a number of very good technicians to other places. I am sure that similar stories can be told by other FerrariChat members who have frequent work done on their cars at other authorized Ferrari dealers so I don't mean to bash FOW as I have made a lot of friends there with several technicians some who are there and some who work elsewhere. And to their credit FOW recently transferred a staff member from their race team to handle the front desk. This person has proved to be very competant and returns calls imediately and takes the time to properly explain things in detail. They have also made huge improvements in the past year on getting cars done on time (not always true in the past). Part of the problem may be the different types of customers that frequent FOW. Several people I know that deal with FOW have two or three Ferrari's or are constantly trading in this new model for that new model. Some have everyday drivers (Ferraris) and then also have a Challenge car and cost is not a big deal to them. I don't fall into this class as I purchased both my Ferrari's used (both were several years old) and held onto each one for a number of years. I imagine many of FOW's customers never check their bill and probably wouldn't notice the difference if it listed a brake pad for $100 or $500. A friend of mine purchased a 360 Challenge car and kept complaining to me about the high cost of running the car at track events. I told him to closely check his bill and he called me a few weeks later and thanked me as FOW had charged him for several items more than once. In my case I may have been guilty of not checking the bill too thoroughly in the past when cost wasn't such a big issue. But with the recent stock market decline, getting married, and the arrival of 20-month old twins, I check every bill with a fine tooth comb. Overall service is good, staff is friendly and competant most of the time, but prices are a bit overinflated!!! Regards, Jon P. Kofod 1995 F355 Challenge #23 | ||
| Michael A. Niles (Man90tr)
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The comments here continue to track what I have heard directly from users of FOW. Those who get not much stuff done, its great. Then the ones who get it hard for lots of work then yikes!!! I would love to hear from someone who has lots of work done and is thrilled with the service and price. I know they must be out there. As for me their price and quality of repair wise they were fine but I fall in the category of not getting a lot done. It was sitting in their waiting room that I started to "hear" a different picture. If your service from them is excellent, then I always advice people not to change. If you haven't started yet, then it doesn't hurt to explore your options. I see too many Ferraris that are in great shape and run well that are not done by a dealer that I know a dealer is not the only option in town. In fact, the members of this site are pretty much a testament to this. | ||
| Daniel B Reese MD (Dbr328gtb)
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FOW is great- they treat you like royalty. You can talk with the mechanic while they work or look around. Their pick up service is quick and safe and only $50 on season and $0 off season. They are definitely more expensive but that's ok with me because my car doesnt require that much work so its not a huge difference and it should enhance the value of your car that it was serviced at a dealer. And I know I am getting the work done right. I have heard that they do like loyalty and prefer that you stay exclusively with them. I have nothing but good things to say about them. | ||
| Michael A. Niles (Man90tr)
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All comments are pretty accurate. FOW is good at what they do but by far are not the cheapest -- it depends how much you drive your car and what you need done. Their pick-up service is great if you need it. Grand Touring is a more complete shop in that they fix the cars but can also do full incredible restorations. Here's the difference. I had a small fuse problem. I called FOW and they said bring it in. I called Grand Touring the guy said I think I know what it is told me what to do and presto -- fixed in my own garage in 4 minutes. It might have been that easy at FOW but it would have cost me something. Different philosophies but gets you to the same place. On a big job Grand Touring and couple other places can be just as good and cheaper. | ||
| David Albright (Dalbright)
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As Martin stated, I've been pretty pleased with FOW. The technicians are very good and extremely friendly. They will even pickup your car for free until the spring time.....even for just an oil change. One other shop that I've heard of in the area has been Gran Touring in Laurel MD. I've never used them but have talked to some of the people there and it seems good. They do everything from minor oil changes to full restorations. Several FCA members in the DC area have recommended them. I will probably give them a try in the near future. Good luck. If anyone else has a name, dont keep it a secret! :-) | ||
| Jay Thompson (Jayt)
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I have found Ferrari of Washington is less expensive and vastly more accurate than any other source. As example I had problems passig the smog test with my 1988 Testarossa, closer shops could not get it set, but FOW set the entire fuel system up and balanced ALL 12 intakes for $275. It runs better than ever and I also picked up 2mpg. | ||
| Martin (Miami348ts)
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Although I do not recommend to use a Ferrari Dealer for these repairs (too expensive), Ferraro of Washington appears to be a great source. David Albright uses them regular and appears to be very happy with them. Keep looking for a non-Ferrari repair shop. Make sure they have done that one several cars before. It may pay to have the car shipped to some place 100 miles away. You will be without car for 30 days plus, so who cares where the car is. AAA Plus will cover you 100 Miles. BTW, did you see an increase in business since you drive the Ferrari? I am just wondering, a friend of mine had great results since he bought and drives a Lambo daily. Also an attorney. | ||
| Greg Owens (Owens84qv)
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If you want to go the dealer route, you could always try Ferrari of Washington in Sterling over by Dulles International Airport... | ||
| Howie F. (Brokerofexotics)
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I found a great link yesterday for this sort of thing. http://www.ferrariclub.com/rolodex/ Hope this helps! Howard | ||
| Kurt (Mightyone)
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Could you please recommend a repair shop in the Washington DC/Baltimore area. It's time for a engine out major. Thanks in advance! |