| Author |
Message |
bill v. (Doc)
New member
Username: Doc
Post Number: 31
Registered: 9-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 22, 2002 - 6:35 pm: | |
Ron--you know my story--been looking seriously for a 308 since Jan w nothing to show for it to date- two real close ones( but for failed pre-purchase inspections), one owner changed his mind about sellng, etc, etc. And.. I thoroughly agree with the other chatters experiences with Cauley. They've been advertising a black '78 or '79 for months at around $38k!!!! When I called , I got the impression that there was no negotiation on that price--so there it sits. So, my search continues unless that car in Fl comes through--I hope. |
wm hart (Whart)
Member
Username: Whart
Post Number: 305
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 22, 2002 - 4:56 pm: | |
Floyd raises a very good point, assuming that the car's owner has been meticulous and has not himself been fooled around with by an unscrupulous shop. |
Ron Thomas (Ronsupercar)
Junior Member
Username: Ronsupercar
Post Number: 82
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 22, 2002 - 4:03 pm: | |
Do you really feel a search can take upto a year??
From what I've been seeing I can almost see that....
I'll ask that as a new discussion |
Bill Sawyer (Wsawyer)
Junior Member
Username: Wsawyer
Post Number: 204
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 22, 2002 - 6:44 am: | |
The yellow 355 is still there. They also have a 348 Spider for $93k, which is totally ridiculous. They seem to be content servicing cars and selling merchandise because they sure don't price their cars to sell.
Nancy did say that they have sold half of their Maserati allocation for the year (14 of 28 cars). |
Mr. Doody (Doody)
Junior Member
Username: Doody
Post Number: 202
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 22, 2002 - 6:29 am: | |
no clue, bruce.
it was probably february or march last time i talked to them, and the price was way out of whack and they were exceedingly firm on it. 1997 8K miles 355 Spider 6 speed; two previous owners; tracked once; etc. etc. 03/97 build. had NOT had its first engine-out - due at 5 years.
they wanted 139 back in october. if memory serves, they wanted 135 in feb/mar and they were adamant about not moving on the price. i thought it was too high.
all that said, my favorite too-expensive car award goes to miller, who had a yel/blk 1999 355 spider with ~5K miles on it. they apparently took it on trade in august 2000 and listed it at $175K. it's still on the fusa site at 175K, but they were talking more like low 140s a couple months back. i would have seriously considered it except for the fact that somebody (former owner or dealership) ran over a curb with it (probably parallel parking) and it need a new wheel and the rocker panel replaced - totally fixable stuff, but they were unfortuantely well less than forthcoming about it. i have generally only heard good things about miller here, so i was surprised at my, not negative per se, but hardly positive experience with them.
doody. |
Marq J Ruben (Qferrari)
New member
Username: Qferrari
Post Number: 31
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 22, 2002 - 6:21 am: | |
Although I've only purchased one Ferrari to this point, my experience with the dealer (FoW) has been wondrous. To this day (2 years after purchase) they still address the occasional item at no charge if there's even the slightest chance the condition/problem might have existed at my time of purchase. Long after their warranty has expired.
During my search for the car (1-1/2 years), my experience with independents was far less than satisfactory.
I'm so glad I went with an authorized dealer and intend to purchase my future Ferraris through them; without question. As Doody states, you may pay for the privilege, but, IMO, it's well worth it.
|
Floyd Lawson (Floyd8686)
New member
Username: Floyd8686
Post Number: 11
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 22, 2002 - 6:00 am: | |
How about a kind of fourth option -
Find a local Ferrari Club (Ferrari club of America has chapters everywhere). Talk and get to know the members. One of them may have the car you'll be interested in. You'll know the car's history, and the type of attention the car received from it's current owner. These members will also be able to give you the skinny on local and national dealer's service and reputation. This forum may have a few members from your area, but your local club will have a lot more members with real world experience with the dealers/brokers in your area. The club members may even know the history of the cars sitting on your local dealer's showroom. That information is priceless when buying pre-owned. |
bruce wellington (Bws88tr)
Member
Username: Bws88tr
Post Number: 263
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 22, 2002 - 5:56 am: | |
DOODY
HAS THE PRICE BEEN LOWERED SINCE YOUR LAST INQUIRY?? |
Mr. Doody (Doody)
Junior Member
Username: Doody
Post Number: 201
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 22, 2002 - 5:44 am: | |
andrew makes a good point. the pre-owned cars that the authorized dealers take in do seem to be of only the highest quality (generally speaking). they charge for that privilege, but that's not irrational. the prices might be irrational, but charging for the privilege is not ;-)
i tried to buy a car from cauley. they were nice enough but wholly wacky about price. maybe they were underwater on it and unwilling to be realistic, but they wanted some relatively stupid number for a car that wasn't vaguely worth it - and they wouldn't discuss price at all. [UPDATE - in fact the damn car is STILL not sold, nearly 8 months after i inquired; it's been on the lot now for about a year].
doody. |
Andrew (Mrrou)
Member
Username: Mrrou
Post Number: 328
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 22, 2002 - 2:53 am: | |
ron buy from an authorized dealer. An authorized dealer wont buy any cars that are not up to par or cars that have ever been tampered with by a non certified ferrari mechanic..but on the service recards, if you see that the oil was changed by the owner rather then an authorized dealer, i wouldnt be bothered by it..but anything else..make sure everything else on your potential Fcar was done at a authorized dealer
Andrew |
Bill Sawyer (Wsawyer)
Junior Member
Username: Wsawyer
Post Number: 203
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 9:09 pm: | |
John:
Was Cauley competitively priced? They have a nice '78 308 GTS on the floor with 26,000 miles, but they are asking $38.5k for it. Sounds pretty steep to me. BTW, I agree with the comments you made on another thread about Nancy at Cauley. I went in there with my nine year old son last week and she treated him like a visiting potentate. He was walking on a cloud when he left. |
wm hart (Whart)
Member
Username: Whart
Post Number: 303
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 8:42 pm: | |
I have not relied on the authorized dealer to find the cars, but i've run every purchase so far thru the dealer, who handles the PPI, deals with getting the car roadworthy, and then must stand behind it. Its worth the cost of the dealer markup to me for that piece of mind. I've had some serious discussions with a couple of independents that left me feeling very shakey about them, and their cars. On the other hand, i know one independent whom i trust implicitly; one of my cars came from him, and i would buy from him again. |
John Bicsak (Funshipone)
Junior Member
Username: Funshipone
Post Number: 71
Registered: 1-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 8:32 pm: | |
I purchased my 1984 308 GTS QV last July from Jack Cauley Ferrari in Detroit, Michigan 22,000 miles I am second owner. The dealer did every thing they said they would do as far as repairs if any were needed. They performed 30,000 mile service, and about a month after I had car it was hard to start when hot replaced some parts no charge, and the car runs excellent.I had a wonderful experence and I still stop in to see manager and Mechanics. |
Richelson (Richelson)
Member
Username: Richelson
Post Number: 714
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 3:25 pm: | |
Make sure the #'s are consistent not necessarily low as his gauge may read different than others. The #'s shouldn't deviate from each other much. |
bruce wellington (Bws88tr)
Member
Username: Bws88tr
Post Number: 254
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 3:21 pm: | |
ron
again as mr doody says..make sure the car is right for you, take your time, and believe nobody until the ppi is done , whether is a private individual, or a authorized or non-authorized dealer. The first and foremost test you want to run is the compression test. If the #S are low and not up to par, walk away, because either the engine is going, or you will constantly have a motor problem as you keep putting in $$$$
MY 2 CENTS...
GOOD LUCK--- BRUCE |
Dave328GTB (Hardtop)
Junior Member
Username: Hardtop
Post Number: 151
Registered: 1-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 2:50 pm: | |
Ron,
I have bought 6 F cars and the breakdown is like this: 1 authorized dealer, 2 independents and 3 individuals. Authorized dealers seem to get the most, but I don't see any added advantage. With independents, I like to see someone who has been in business (with same name) a long time and has a lot of experience with F cars. With individuals, I like to size up the owner as well as the car, but anyone can be fooled. In all cases, dealers or individuals, an independent inspecion is money very well spent. When it comes time to sell, where you bought it won't matter at all, but records are, of course, important. Also, run a carfax on any potential purchase. Also, it is almost always better to buy a car with fresh, up to date service and with everything working than to buy one with deferred maintenance even if you get what looks like a big discount. Pre 1990 cars that need nothing are hard to come by, but well worth paying top dollar for in the long run. This, I learned the hard way. Hope this helps.
Dave |
Ron Thomas (Ronsupercar)
Junior Member
Username: Ronsupercar
Post Number: 75
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 2:24 pm: | |
In a perfect world, we pay money for the car and it runs with no problem. we sell it and break even.
Looking for a 308 20yrs old I know I won't find a perfect car.. I just want to be sure that the money that goes out won't bit me in the end..If it comes time to sell and move to a more recent model, I hate for a buyer to refuse to pay whatever the asking price may be just because I purchased it from a unauthorized dealer or something like that. |
Nunja Bitness (Jaxfl)
Junior Member
Username: Jaxfl
Post Number: 55
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 12:55 pm: | |
I've spoken with several auto brokers from both authorized and independent dealerships regarding Ferrari 360 coupes lately. Its amazing how you can instantly get a bad vibe from somebody because of their cheesy sales persona and the words they choose to use. On the other hand some of them have come across in a very professional and informed manner. It takes one conversation to realize what kind of person you'll be dealing with. |
Craig Dewey (Craigfl)
Member
Username: Craigfl
Post Number: 380
Registered: 1-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 12:29 pm: | |
I think Doody hit the nail on the head too. It doesn't matter where the car comes from, just take your time and make sure the car is right.
It took me about six months to find mine. After about 4 months of looking I did find one but had it checked and it wasn't as good as the owner claimed, so I passed on it.
The key is to find a place to have it checked out that you are comfortable with. |
ross koller (Ross)
Junior Member
Username: Ross
Post Number: 90
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 12:01 pm: | |
it all depends on what you are looking for as the others have said. but here is my experience:
bought the 348ts from an individual. all the paperwork was right and matched the service records. everything was fine for a few months and then it all started to fall apart. had it for a year and had about $15k worth of necessary work done. sold it on to an individual.....
bought the 512tr from a dealer who is a friend of a friend. got a great price and guaranteed service record (with them). the car is bulletproof and i will never sell it if i can help it. just luck? maybe.
in the process of buying a 456gt from the same dealer. same process - good price, all service records etc. we'll see what happens.
in general i would say that you will pay a slight premium from a dealer but you also should get some greater peace of mind, and if all goes wrong, you will have recourse against someone. whereas from an individual it is always caveat emptor. credible dealers have a reputation to uphold, and bad news travels far and wide and they know it, so don't distrust them too much. |
BobD (Bobd)
Member
Username: Bobd
Post Number: 425
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 11:54 am: | |
Ron, look at those 3 options and anywhere else you can... newspaper, net, ferrariads.com, ferrariclassified.com, cars.com, cacars.com, local mechanics, car shows.... everywhere. You're looking for the right car, who cares where it comes from? When you find the right car, you'll know it. Just get it inspected, have fun and good luck! And one other thing, be patient! |
Richelson (Richelson)
Member
Username: Richelson
Post Number: 712
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 11:10 am: | |
Ron Doody has a point. What exactly are you looking for? As I said in an earlier post. There is no magic car that will not break down especially in a 20 year old 308. Buying from a dealer IMO is a waste of lots of money. Any car you purchase could have a number of problems months after your purchase. Find what you are looking for and do the best you can to purchase a nice car. PP Inspections aren't flawless either. |
Mr. Doody (Doody)
Junior Member
Username: Doody
Post Number: 200
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 10:14 am: | |
ron - i'm not entirely sure you're asking the right question. i don't know what what you're looking for, but the problem here is that you're looking for an item that is, by definition, rare - whatever f-car it is.
i think the answer to your question is simply: (a) decide what you want and then (b) take your time and find the car you want.
it took me six months to find my car. i talked to private parties, non-authorized dealers, and authorized dealers. i had five serious contenders at various points in time: 1 from an individual; 2 from non-authorized dealers; and 2 from authorized dealers.
unless your BPC are very broad (mine were extremely tight), it's unlikely that there are 100 of whatever you're looking for. for me, there were probably no more than 20 of what i was looking for in the states.
if you want "any 328" you have the luxury of focusing as you've suggested. if you want "a late model 328 GTS black/tan with full service records and recent service done" you've narrowed your pool wildly.
good luck in the search!
doody. |
Stanley DiGuiseppi (Standig)
New member
Username: Standig
Post Number: 6
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 9:53 am: | |
Ron: I also just went thru the same exercise. I knew I wanted a 348. I found a 348ts speciale at the dealer who wanted 75k and it was just serviced. What I did not like was that it had 27k miles on. I am sure it was a good car. I searched ferrari web sites including ebay. I found a car listed by Naples Motor Sports in Naples Florida on ebay. I was impressed with the description of the car backed up with pictures. If it was as it said, it sounded like what I wanted. It only had 9k miles on it. I did a Car Fax check and it was clean and the history made sense. It appears the engine has never been out which I prefered. I bought for 62k and figured I would have the work done by someone and then know what was done and have control over it. NMS said they would ship to me in connecticut and if it was not as described I could send back and only pay shipping. I did not send back! The car is a 90 but it is spectacular.
Marks opinion is good too. I think it has to do with what you feel comfortable with.
First know what you want. Then search. You'll find what you want. Good hunting! |
Terry Springer (Tspringer)
Junior Member
Username: Tspringer
Post Number: 73
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 9:44 am: | |
I just bought off ebay. The seller agreed to a complete pre-purchase inspection before I bid. The inspection showed a few things and after auction close we negotiated the price down based on the things it needed. It helped that the car did have a full service history with piles of receipts. The seller also sent me extensive photos and a 30 minute video of the car.
I believe ebay is great way to buy a car, but only if the seller is willing to cooperate. I would never buy of ebay without the seller assisting as was done in my case. |
Jack (Gilles27)
Member
Username: Gilles27
Post Number: 315
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 9:38 am: | |
Ron, I just went through this. After looking for a 328 for a while, I bought one through a dealer. I didn't have enough confidence to buy one from ebay, and basically restricted my search to dealers after a while. Once I knew exactly what I wanted (color, history, etc) I price-searched. It was interesting to see the range of costs, but ultimately found one I thought was fair. Factor in whether or not you will have to ship the car. Mine came from about 800 miles away, so we worked a shipping deal into the price, as well as a thorough detailing. Good luck, and have fun. |
Mark Freeman (Mrpc12)
New member
Username: Mrpc12
Post Number: 48
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 9:37 am: | |
Ron:
If I had to do it over again I would go with number 1. I went with number 2 and was not entirely thrilled with the experience. |
Ron Thomas (Ronsupercar)
Junior Member
Username: Ronsupercar
Post Number: 72
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 21, 2002 - 9:30 am: | |
If you were looking for your first Ferrari, what forum would you use:
1) A dealer- even though you know they got it for less and they have a mark up.
2) Buy it from an unauthorized Ferrari dealer that may carry a few different exotic cars and the service history is ify.
3) Take my time and find one from a private owner and keep paying for pre-inspections that show major service history were not always completely done and make me feel funny about purchasing the car.
What do you do? What do you do?
(Kianu Reeves "Speed") |