| Author |
Message |
Robert Jude Klein (Rjklein4470)
New member
Username: Rjklein4470
Post Number: 26
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Monday, March 18, 2002 - 8:55 pm: | |
I too was a bit dissapointed with the paint quality on my 360, which inspired me to get the wax out. After two sundays and four coats of wax I must say it is very nice. All the swirl marks are gone, and it feels like glass. |
Adam Goldman '86 TR (Icnsltmfg)
Member
Username: Icnsltmfg
Post Number: 273
Registered: 8-2001
| | Posted on Monday, March 18, 2002 - 6:43 pm: | |
Having spent several years managing assembly plant paint shops for Ford Motor Company, the key to a good paint job is not just in the top appearance coat. The Phosphate prep coat that permits all subsequent coats to adhere to the metal is the most important. The second most important is the e-coat ( or electrostatic) bath that ensures that every nook and cranny have been properly rust inhibited. Most companies will then apply a primer coat before a base coat and finally a clear coat, or in the case of solid colors, just the solid color coat after the primer. Each coat is just a mills thick, and only one "coat" of each process is made.
Most of these layers are applied using electricity to attract the paint to the body to increase efficiency and coverage, whether it be in the e-coat bath, or from the nozzle of a paint gun. Where many of the smaller companies run into problems, is having one paint shop / spray booth painting many models of vehicles. The engineers no have to get the robots, and fixed spray nozzles to an average distance that will not spray too much paint or too little. If you have the 360, 550, and 456 all being painted on the same line, some areas may get more or less paint on the 360 vs the 550.
In addition we should determine what is considered good paint vs bad paint. Are we talking appearance or adhesion? appearance is broken into too categories, a true paint defect or an opinion defect. A true paint defect could be a sag ( paint that is applied too thick and runs ), thin ( where the base coat or solid coat is applied too thin and shows the primer coat ), dry ( where the clear coat is applied too thin and has no shine ), a crater ( where oil or another contaminant causes the paint to look like a little crater similar to oil and water ), dirt ( where small particles of foreign matter is trapped under the paint), or too many mills of paint ( where the vehicle was painted too many times to try and repair the above defects and has exceeded the max thickness and the body is scrapped or sanded to bare metal to avoid future cracking in the paint).
An appearance defect is more subjective. They may include mottling ( which is where the paint looks as though it has zebra stripes in it, which is typically caused by the metallic particles in the paint do not "lay" in the same direction), poor color match ( where a repair on one panel is made and the color is from a different batch or applied in a different enough manor where the color just is far off ), or the most common is orange peel ( where the paint resembles the peel of an orange ) Some mfgs actually have a certain amount of orange peel in the paint purposely kind of like a trade mark.
The adhesion problems are typically caused by layers being applied at wrong temperatures ( espec the phosphate coat ) and will result in paint literally peeing off the car down to the layer that failed. You can see many 80's Chrysler products that have huge paint sections that have peeled down to the e-coat layer. There is also soft paint, where the paint has not cured correctly due to oven temperatures or a bad mix of paint / solvent. While not an adhesion problem, fade is where the chemical make up of the pigment in the paint has failed due to sun exposure.
While you can get a good paint job from an auto paint specialist or body shop, they are not able to apply a phosphate coating or an e-coat which will limit the rust inhibiting. They also must use different paints from the original as the cure temperature is far too high in the factory paints and would melt anything other than steel on the car.
I have seen many older original paint jobs on Ferrari's and would consider them quite good, and would consider the late model Ferrari's to be quite good also. My TR from 86 has a very good original paint job even after 16 years. I have also seen some body shops where the paint was flawless looking, but may not last or protect for many years.
Adam |
William Huber (Solipsist)
Junior Member
Username: Solipsist
Post Number: 216
Registered: 9-2001
| | Posted on Monday, March 18, 2002 - 5:37 pm: | |
From working on a 1992 512tr rocker panel, the paint & underspray is the cheapest is qaulity that I've seen. I'll post photos later. |
Mr. Doody (Doody)
Junior Member
Username: Doody
Post Number: 100
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Monday, March 18, 2002 - 1:58 pm: | |
IMO, people overblow the original paint thing.
the problem is that the first thing people assume when they see a paint job is that the car was in an accident. if you document before-and-after and get documentation to that fact from the repair shop then the only difference is that you've got a newer paint job; no scratches, marks, whatever; and undoubtedly a BETTER paint job than the factory would have produced.
the man who said "aerodynamics is for people who can't build engines" surely wasn't stressing over paint quality, right? maranello's the last place i'd bring a car to be painted :-) :-)
if you keep proper documentation, and have the work done ultra-professionally, i know i wouldn't go crazy over devaluation of the car if i were a buyer.
even many (most?) of the ultra-valuable f-cars have been totally refinished inside and out. How many of the $nM 250 GTO California's are 100% original?
my two pennies.
and nick there's no warranty issue. ferrari does not paint their cars well. they don't take the pains that other marquees take (Frank's BMW and Porsche examples are good ones). most ferrari's have mediocre paint jobs. apparently, paint jobs are for people who can't build engines ;-) ;-)
i've heard told that FNA jokes about the few F40s that had to be wholly repainted in the US due to various problems, and that they joke you can tell 'em from a mile away 'cuz the paint jobs look absolutely stellar!
doody. |
Frank Parker (Parkerfe)
Member
Username: Parkerfe
Post Number: 705
Registered: 9-2001
| | Posted on Monday, March 18, 2002 - 1:43 pm: | |
It's a double edged sword. For the most part Ferrari paint jobs are not up to par with other high line brands such as BMW, Porsche etc... However, if you have your car repainted, even under warranty, it devalues the car as it is no longer "original" which is so important in the Ferrari market. So what do you do ? |
Nicholas Wood (Nick_wood)
New member
Username: Nick_wood
Post Number: 11
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Monday, March 18, 2002 - 1:13 pm: | |
I hear a lot of bad things on the quality of the factory paint job.
Is there a warranty issue here?
|
|