| Author |
Message |
Mark Eberhardt (Me_k)
Junior Member
Username: Me_k
Post Number: 183
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 27, 2002 - 4:51 pm: | |
The beauty of custom is that you get to have your car just the way you want. That�s really all there is to it I guess. As long as it makes you happy, it's right. |
Paul Sloan (Sloan83qv)
Member
Username: Sloan83qv
Post Number: 412
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 27, 2002 - 3:46 pm: | |
To all,
My conversion is being done for the fun of it.
I don't want 02 sensors, air flow sensors, TPI sensors, temp sensors and I don't want a computer in my car cause I hate the one on my desk. I want four big webbers!
Paul Sloan |
Matt Morgan (Kermit)
Junior Member
Username: Kermit
Post Number: 76
Registered: 8-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 27, 2002 - 2:43 pm: | |
Phillip, No one is foolish enough to claim it is better than the state of the art EFI, Especially the TEC 3. That's not the point. It's different!
And George, if you notice in Paul Sloan's earlier post: Quick change gears.A bit noisy, like a blower whine. but easy to drop ratios. |
Paul Newman (Newman)
Member
Username: Newman
Post Number: 688
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 27, 2002 - 2:08 pm: | |
Philip, if you use the stock FI manifold, the carbs will outperform it becasue of airflow. The single throttle plate is only 52mm I think and my 308 is running 8 40mm throttles. Does alot for mid and upper power and crisp throttle response. Sucks in the cold startup department and requires tinkering from time to time but well worth the work. Aftermarket FI with 8 injectors and 8 throttle plates would better than the carbs because you get the best of both worlds. |
Philip Airey (Pma1010)
Junior Member
Username: Pma1010
Post Number: 55
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 27, 2002 - 1:35 pm: | |
As people are moving away from stock components, could someone enlighten me as to why a well set up Weber carb'd car is likely to be "better" than a similarly well set up FI car (with user programmable EFI like a TEC2/3)? |
George Daina (Oof_n_goof)
Junior Member
Username: Oof_n_goof
Post Number: 122
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, November 27, 2002 - 9:28 am: | |
Interesting thread....and the mind set of the respondents. I totally agree that bigger is baaad, but at the same time, bad for streetability, after all, that's the intent of the car, to be driven on the street.
I have an 84 QV, that is docile, driving is a pleasure, get's a lot of looks, more looks than the Porche and C5 vette's, hell I get looks from Porche AND the C5 owners. Can I beat them with my 84? No way in hell...but all I have to do is hop in my 68 vette, and there is no Viper in the City of Cleveland that can touch my ride. 1/4" stroke 502 block gives me 533 cubes, solid lifter roller cam, big breathing aluminum heads, 10.5 Compression, 2.125" tube side mount headers. I'm down a little on horsepower though, dyno 583 at the rear wheels, only because I chose to go with the factory Holley Tri Power set up...original configuration was 427 cubes, 435 HP...Aluminum heads, tri power, L-89 designation. Sure, I could have put the cold air chamber hood, still can, have the hood in the garage, Holley 850, or even 780, high rise intake, but, my concern was driving drivability.....kind of a paradox...all out race components and streetability...but the smaller carbs, and tall gears gave me what I wanted...the gearing was achieved by installing a Doug Nash 5 speed....the transmission gears with the 3:55 differential gave me equivelant to 5:13's in gears 1-4 and 3:55's in 5th. Now I have my cake and am able to eat it as well....mileage? Ha...I bought stock in Mobil Exxon and have my personal gas truck following me....though it's not that bad...12.5 mpg cruising at 70.
Anyway, if you are thinking about the 48's, you better also start thinking about gear change...like anything else, there are checks and balances...if you do one thing to one side of the equation, you better do something to the other side to counter balance, if you don't you won't be a happy camper...in your case...large carbs, cam...better put some gears to offset your lost low end torque....
Reading this thread, there are some sharp minds here, and it would behoove you to heed their advice....nothing like being there, doing that, and telling you about it. |
Timothy J. Dressel (Tjd)
Junior Member
Username: Tjd
Post Number: 56
Registered: 4-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 26, 2002 - 1:06 pm: | |
Thanks, Paul and Paul. --Tim D |
Matt Morgan (Kermit)
Junior Member
Username: Kermit
Post Number: 75
Registered: 8-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 26, 2002 - 12:35 pm: | |
No offense taken Gentlemen. And no I'm not backing off one bit. Just smiling to myself. I agree with much that has been posted, and like Paul Newman, I believe the carbs will be better than the STOCK FI. |
JRV (Jrvall)
Junior Member
Username: Jrvall
Post Number: 182
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 26, 2002 - 11:58 am: | |
>>>Perhaps I mis-read between the lines but I think JRV was trying to help as well as myself, not to "cut down" an idea.<<<
Absolutely !!!!
|
Paul Newman (Newman)
Member
Username: Newman
Post Number: 677
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, November 26, 2002 - 11:49 am: | |
Do I sense some back-pedalling regarding the 48's Matt? Perhaps I mis-read between the lines but I think JRV was trying to help as well as myself, not to "cut down" an idea. Sorry. |
Matt Morgan (Kermit)
Junior Member
Username: Kermit
Post Number: 74
Registered: 8-2001
| | Posted on Monday, November 25, 2002 - 10:39 pm: | |
Yes Ken, It is an interesting project. As I see it, from a visual standpoint, a brace of 48's on top has got to be a delight to the eye. I understand the bonnet has to be redone to clear the taller induction. Perhaps a plexi cover ala F-40. Stunning wouldn't it be? As to how well it runs..... I am looking forward to it, and I am proud to be a part of the project. I'm sure in the other group you mentiioned, there are a few who seem to always cut an idea down. In their rush to find the appropriate text to prove that by God I'm right, they fail to stop and notice. Pauls car is stunning. He does his own work. this tells me he must have more than a bit of talent and knowledge.Suppose he has a sense of humor. Who would ever know that 42 venturies were inthere?. Stunning looks with the 48's, and streetability. Interesting thought. |
Paul Newman (Newman)
Member
Username: Newman
Post Number: 676
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Monday, November 25, 2002 - 10:36 pm: | |
The nicest cams Ive seen are from WEB. Cost is $1340USD for the set of four and you supply the cores for the job. |
Paul Sloan (Sloan83qv)
Member
Username: Sloan83qv
Post Number: 410
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Monday, November 25, 2002 - 9:09 pm: | |
Timothy,
All the machine work and top end parts are being done by Nick & Kermit at Nicks Forza ferrari (click on add above). Give Nick or Kermit a shout and they can fill you in on the details.
Paul |
Timothy J. Dressel (Tjd)
Junior Member
Username: Tjd
Post Number: 55
Registered: 4-2001
| | Posted on Monday, November 25, 2002 - 7:24 pm: | |
Paul S., could you tell us about the cams? Source, specs, maybe cost, expected streetability? Thanks. --Tim D |
Ken (Allyn)
Member
Username: Allyn
Post Number: 568
Registered: 10-2001
| | Posted on Monday, November 25, 2002 - 12:32 pm: | |
This is a great thread and really points to the value of this site! I have to laugh, however, at the 'grass is always greener' syndrome. In the Lotus Europa group on Yahoo, one of our more mechanically minded members is replacing his Strombergs with FI! He wants more reliability, power, smoother running...and if anyone's ever had a Stromberg carburetted car they know of what I speak! It's a big project for him as well, perhaps a little easier than for an 8 cyl. Ferrari however.
Yet both projects have merit for what the owners want to accomplish which is really interesting!! |
JRV (Jrvall)
Junior Member
Username: Jrvall
Post Number: 170
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, November 24, 2002 - 7:17 pm: | |
>>> Its basic engine math, and that hasnt changed over the years.<<<
Correct, in fact, I'll dig up the matamatical equation used to form the baseline of size from one of my webber books. Not something I use often enough to commit to memory.
|
Paul Newman (Newman)
Member
Username: Newman
Post Number: 674
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, November 24, 2002 - 6:58 pm: | |
I AM RELAXED!!!!!!!!!!! I thought you were getting a little bent out of shape over the input. I think going carbs on a QV is the best thing you can do for it and I would do the same. Not knowing how it will respond, I would use a 40mm as a baseline and go from there, at least you know it would run fairly well. And no, I dont race neons either. |
Paul Sloan (Sloan83qv)
Member
Username: Sloan83qv
Post Number: 409
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, November 24, 2002 - 6:51 pm: | |
Relax Paul,
Don't get me wrong I appreciate the input and it is well taken. Having worked with electromotive I realize that it would have been easy to go to EFI which was my orginal plan but I got this crazed desire to due webbers and here I am.
While i will drive my car on the street the work is being done for the track, You may not agree with this but I figure that all the hot rod neons and hondas that want to race me every time I take the car out should just be ignored, hell I drive a Ferrari I win before the light turns green.
Again the advise is well taken
Paul S |
Paul Newman (Newman)
Member
Username: Newman
Post Number: 673
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, November 24, 2002 - 6:34 pm: | |
I used a mustang as an example of a modern car that can kick the crap out of a 308QV. I care if my car is quick and fast. Everyone has differnt needs. Mine is to have a car that is respectable on the street that I feel measures up to what Im used to driving day to day. A ferrari has to be quick in my opinion, quicker than a neon. Obviously my needs are different than your's. Originally, I saw what looked to be a major mistake in your combo, not to mention others having similar thoughts as mine. My intention was to help prevent a crappy result after all your labor and money. My first response when I see what I think is a mistake, is to provide my opinion. Cant hurt to help. Thats what this site is about anyway. Maybe you dont want or need input. After all the books Ive read and all the engines Ive built, I think Ive learned enough to at least identify obvious mistakes. The fact still remains that an enigne of that displacement does not want the amount of air volume you are providing. Its basic engine math, and that hasnt changed over the years. Thats all I was trying to say Paul. Its the most common mistake to over-carburate an engine in search of HP. |
JRV (Jrvall)
Junior Member
Username: Jrvall
Post Number: 166
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, November 24, 2002 - 2:06 pm: | |
>>There is nothing like a Ferrari running Webbers!
(sound and power) <<
Can't argue that except to say....Ferrari Grand Prix Cars running Fuel Injection make the street cars sound tame in comparison. imo of course..;-)
|
Paul Sloan (Sloan83qv)
Member
Username: Sloan83qv
Post Number: 408
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, November 24, 2002 - 1:30 pm: | |
I have no interest in debateing street racing, I drive my car fast on public roads but not in urban area's, I do not race from light to light. I cannot understand how anyone with an older Ferrari would give a crap about their off the line light to light times or would care about beating a Mustang in the same circumstance.
If I want to race a Mustang it will be at Moroso, Sebring or somewhere similar not between traffic lights. |
Paul Newman (Newman)
Member
Username: Newman
Post Number: 672
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, November 24, 2002 - 1:06 pm: | |
I understand but it would be nice to know you can beat one if the situation came up. It seems to present itself on the regular basis with me. I havent given up driving my car fast on a public road, after all, I didnt buy a ferrari to putt around in. I just choose my places carefully when the situation arises. |
Paul Sloan (Sloan83qv)
Member
Username: Sloan83qv
Post Number: 407
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, November 24, 2002 - 12:35 pm: | |
The car is mine, a long time ago I gave up street racing as I have no interest in injuring someone or spending any time in jail. I got nothing to prove to the guy driving a Mustang or a Honda in a 1/4 mile run.
I however do like to track my car and thus the modifications.
There is nothing like a Ferrari running Webbers!
(sound and power)
Paul Sloan
|
Paul Newman (Newman)
Member
Username: Newman
Post Number: 671
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, November 24, 2002 - 12:20 pm: | |
I guess if it were mine matt, I would want an increase in off the line grunt, which is where a street car is used the most. If the plans are to track the car then fine, no one has said what the plans are for the car. After all that money is spent, I wouldnt want to loose to a mustang gt in a light to light race. You said yourself that some sacrifice will be made in the lower ranges with those oversize carbs. |
Matt Morgan (Kermit)
Junior Member
Username: Kermit
Post Number: 73
Registered: 8-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, November 24, 2002 - 11:22 am: | |
Ah, state of the atr individual injection.... Much different deal entirely. Yes, some of the systems are wonderfull. I wonder what the cost comparison/performance gained looks like. Either way, I am sure that diferent runners would be needed, sothat cost is about even. What about the concept of Hey, why not try something new? It takes large ones to lay out large $$$ to go for it. In that respect, anyone trying new stuff ought to be commmended. On a side note, while I do not divulge clients info, I will say that I am working on the project, and to give you a bit of insight... The intake ports resemble 348's more than they do 308's. Once again, I am positive about the outcome. |
JRV (Jrvall)
Junior Member
Username: Jrvall
Post Number: 153
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, November 23, 2002 - 6:16 pm: | |
Sorry I didn't make myself clear. Not the 'stock' system, (which isn't EFI), a new "Individual" Throttle Body EFI set-up. Like the type sold by (uhhhh??? can't think of their name at the moment lol) which are open ports and have no internal restrictions like carbs.
Also it wasn't mentioned that the cam timing will likely need to be changed...off the top of my head I'd say more overlap, retard the intake and retard the exhaust, the lift is the same on non-racing Ferrari engines.
Sounds like a great mod, but you won't beat an Indivual Throttle Body EFI setup.
Sold by TMW...remembered..lol. |
Matt Morgan (Kermit)
Junior Member
Username: Kermit
Post Number: 72
Registered: 8-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, November 23, 2002 - 5:16 pm: | |
Jrvall, I would disagree on that point. The stock EFI's air flow plate restricts air. This causes the intake to see vacuum, just as carbs do. Personally, I am not impressed with the stock EFI flows. I have flowbenched the stock runners with and without plenium. Not impressive at all. As to the 48's, for high RPM, they will put it out(with some trade off on low end, and the bog issue). Swap venturies if necessary. I am personally looking forward to seeing how it runs, as I have been involved in the project, and know more than is posted here. Dialed in, it will be an animal. It's all a tradeoff. |
JRV (Jrvall)
Junior Member
Username: Jrvall
Post Number: 152
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, November 23, 2002 - 1:53 pm: | |
Agree with the smaller throttle (venturi)size. Bigger isn't always better (unless you're talking wallets lol).
The gains from EFI come from flow, (no port restrictions that carbs have) and ease of tunability, along with the flexability EFI affords. With a real time feedback system all flat spots can be eliminated, bottom end torque increased and high rpm fuel requirments achieved with the limitations of compromise one would have to make with carbs.
On a small bore motor like a 308 44mm's is the max I would try to run, with 42's probably a slightly better choice for bottom end, mid range. |
Paul Newman (Newman)
Member
Username: Newman
Post Number: 668
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, November 23, 2002 - 12:39 pm: | |
I agree the FI would eliminate many headaches with a key stroke from your laptop. Getting the carbs right will take time becasue of the size and modifications Paul is doing. A throttle plate per cylinder would be wonderful with the FI but I guess the plenum/single t-body FI would give the most torque. Myself, I still like the carbs for the sound and eye appeal especially a bunch of webers. I would lean that way only out of preference knowing it isnt the absolute "best" and most efficient way to do it. I would however, chose a smaller venturi, closer to stock, maybe 42's at the most and jet accordingly on a dyno. That way all that work wont be a big dissapointment in the torque department. You have to remember its a small engine that needs all the help it can get in the torque department. I rasied my compression to 10.8:1, ported my heads and saw a gain in torque but not $5000 worth (including other engine rebuilding parts). Cams will help and larger carbs would hurt. In the end, how much can you really pull out of a 178CID engine without a supercharger and maintain reliability and driveability? |
JRV (Jrvall)
Junior Member
Username: Jrvall
Post Number: 150
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, November 23, 2002 - 11:51 am: | |
>>>This is the first time I have heard Webber IDF Carbs called "primative".<<<
It is primative. Even as far back as the 50's (maybe earlier) FI was used when max torque and horsepower was the goal. Carbs, while good at what they do, cannot compare to FI. If you look back to F-1 and other forms of pure racing FI replaced carbs long ago, have a look at old induction systems...think Hilborn if you like American Iron, now flip forward to F40's or 355's and you'll see we've come back to the past, only difference is with the speed of modern electronics now working in real time, almost infinate tuning variations are possible. On any modern update Throttle Body FI with compatible sensors and MS is the way to go, hands down.
They even make EFI Throttle Bodies in the same configurations as many webers they replace. |
Brian W Dimetres (Acnberlin)
New member
Username: Acnberlin
Post Number: 45
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, November 23, 2002 - 11:44 am: | |
Is it difficult to syncronise and tune/set up the Webers? I was told that to do it properly, the carbs need to be tuned with the engine on a dyno. Any truth to that? |
Mark Eberhardt (Me_k)
Junior Member
Username: Me_k
Post Number: 174
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, November 23, 2002 - 11:33 am: | |
Paul N, that's what basically what I was trying to say too. To make it drive properly, 40-42 is about it, that's why Ferrari used them. To make peak HP on a very high reving engine, 48 - 52 should be about right. Take the 42s and loose 20-40 hp on top, take the 48 and loose hp down low. The way way to get both is EFI with a 52mm throttle body.
I agree with Paul S though, the stock mechanical FI system is terrible, I'd take webbers over that for performance any day. |
Paul Newman (Newman)
Member
Username: Newman
Post Number: 667
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, November 23, 2002 - 11:15 am: | |
I have my weber book here, I was wrong about the 289 comment, more like big block ford. This application Im looking at is a bigblock ford, displacement not mentioned, it has 4 48IDA webers on it. I stand by my statement that your carbs are WAY TOO big for a 178CID engine. |
Paul Newman (Newman)
Member
Username: Newman
Post Number: 666
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, November 23, 2002 - 11:11 am: | |
Paul, the carb size causes the bog because the velocity in the port is to slow. Its always better to be under carburetted than over carburetted. You will lose throttle response with the large inlet opennings, not because of the fuel supply. I guess I should have said it will fall flat on its face rather than bog when you floor it. |
Paul Sloan (Sloan83qv)
Member
Username: Sloan83qv
Post Number: 406
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, November 23, 2002 - 7:55 am: | |
Hopefully by the end of December we will know the outcome of this 6 month adventure in Ferrari engine modification, I for one can't wait to drive it out of the shop.
I will keep all updated as I start in 10 days to put it all back together.
Just remember in 1980 when the 308 went from carbs to FI the car lost 40 HP. (not comparing to todays EFI). |
Hans E. Hansen (4re_gt4)
Member
Username: 4re_gt4
Post Number: 568
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, November 23, 2002 - 12:53 am: | |
Paul: Carbs definitely aren't perfect, but I FIRMLY believe that they fit perfectly with the idiosyncratic (sp?) Ferrari personality. Unpredictable low/mid range? Geez, Enzo never had it so good. Ferraris live just for that full throttle/high rpm blast. If you want perfect driveability, get a Toyota. Big compression, big cam, big ports, big exhaust, go with the big carbs. It'll drive like crap, but you will have SO MUCH FUN!!!!! It sounds so vintage Ferrari. (I'm envious. I want a ride.) |
Mark Eberhardt (Me_k)
Junior Member
Username: Me_k
Post Number: 172
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Friday, November 22, 2002 - 11:39 pm: | |
Paul, Carbs are a very cost effective way to make power at the track, but there are a lot of good reasons you haven�t been able to buy a car with a carb on it for 20 years. You're right, if your carbs are jetted properly, sized properly, your cams are not too big, and your exhaust is dyno matched to everything, you�re car will run fine. Until the temperature, air pressure or humidity change, then it will no longer be jetted properly. If it�s a racecar I guess that doesn�t really matter, you just keep track of the jetting under different conditions and jet for the day. That�s kind of a pain on a street car though. Also, the bigger the cams jet, the bigger the ports and exhaust and carbs need to be to match them and allow the engine to develop maximum hp. But as everything gets bigger, the vacuum available at lower rpm becomes unpredictable and the mixture unstable. That is the reason the street cars traditionally don�t get big cams, they won�t run right unless you put on a smaller carb, then it doesn�t make HP any more. Fuel injection changed all that. It is now possible to put on a throttle body large enough to feed a very high performance engine and still control the mixture at lower rpms. Also, the engine becomes much less sensitive to other tuning factors, so it is pretty easy to get the mixture correct across the full rpm range. EFI also understands that when the weather changes, so should the mixture, it�s a set it and set-up. So you can make a carb make hp or you can make it streetable, you can�t really have both.
As far a webber being primitive, they are very good, probably the best, as far as throttle plate type carbs go. The basic design has been around for about 80 years though, it works, but controlling the mixture when moving from one jet to the next is very difficult. A slide type carb alters the size of the working jet and the size to the venturi to match the rpm range. Motorcycles, the only production vehicles that still use carbs, use this type exclusively and have for 20 years, unless you don�t count Harley, then it�s more like 50 years.
|
Paul Sloan (Sloan83qv)
Member
Username: Sloan83qv
Post Number: 405
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Friday, November 22, 2002 - 10:40 pm: | |
As the car also has an electromotive direct coil to plug ignition system I am not to worried about
low end bog if webbers are set up correctly (jetted). The reason I decided not go with EFI was that I looking for more power without dealing with 6 additional sensors and building 8 independent throttle bodies. I beleive that once once the car is set up properly it should produce somewhere between 375 and 390 hp. The car has a modified Borla no emissions and quick change straight cut gear transfer case, 265/35x 18 rear,225/35x18 fronts, lowered 1.75" with 300lbs springs at all 4 corners.
This is the first time I have heard Webber IDF Carbs called "primative". |
Mark Eberhardt (Me_k)
Junior Member
Username: Me_k
Post Number: 170
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Friday, November 22, 2002 - 9:07 pm: | |
I think you should consider EFI instead of carbs. If it's a street car it will run much better in the mid range where you drive 99% of the time. For street of track you will make more HP. If you insist on carbs, I would recommend something less primitive than a weber. A flat slide carb will fill in the mid range and give nearly the driveability of EFI, but still will not make the peak power. |
Paul Newman (Newman)
Member
Username: Newman
Post Number: 665
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Friday, November 22, 2002 - 6:00 pm: | |
Paul, just wondered why you went to 48 mm throats? I think 40's or 42's would be better so you dont have a major bog off the line. I guess if you calculated that the valve size and port dimensions can flow what a 48mm throttle can provide, I guess you can ignore my question. It just seems large considering the volume of 1 cylinder with an inlet that large for each. I would have to look in my weber book where there is a section for matching carbs to engine displacement. It almost sounds like something large enough for a 289-302 cobra application. |
Paul Newman (Newman)
Member
Username: Newman
Post Number: 664
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Friday, November 22, 2002 - 5:53 pm: | |
A carb manifold will not fit a QV head. The head flange is parallel to the ground or level if you will. The carb head flange is on a 45 or so degree angle. The intakes for the carbs have a bend in them to allow the carbs to sit level once installed. I think a carbed QV would kick a*s compared to it's original FI system. |
Philip Airey (Pma1010)
Junior Member
Username: Pma1010
Post Number: 51
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Friday, November 22, 2002 - 4:56 pm: | |
Will the manifold from a pre-80 308 not fit the QV head? |
Paul Sloan (Sloan83qv)
Member
Username: Sloan83qv
Post Number: 404
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Friday, November 22, 2002 - 3:07 pm: | |
I am just finishing my conversion to 4 webber 48mm
IDF's on my 83 QV also 4 high duration 410 lift cams, ported polished,flowed heads and 11:1 pistons as well as super lightweight flywheel and double plate clutch.
Had two machineist build the manifolds one to do basic work and one to make them flow. |
Hans E. Hansen (4re_gt4)
Member
Username: 4re_gt4
Post Number: 552
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Friday, November 22, 2002 - 2:37 pm: | |
I've always wondered if the carbs would breathe better than the early FI.
BTW, Superformance sells bigger 42DCNF and 44DCNF carbs. The QV engine may benefit from a little extra flow.
Manifold shouldn't be too tough for a decent machinist to fabricate, as it's fairly simple. However, as with any custom piece, it won't be cheap. |
Steve Magnusson (91tr)
Intermediate Member
Username: 91tr
Post Number: 1193
Registered: 1-2001
| | Posted on Friday, November 22, 2002 - 2:21 pm: | |
The 2-barrell downdraft 308 Webers are 40DCNF. Interesting project you've got going -- enjoy... |
Brian W Dimetres (Acnberlin)
New member
Username: Acnberlin
Post Number: 40
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Friday, November 22, 2002 - 2:13 pm: | |
Does anyone know if the pre-1980 308 Weber (40-DCOE?)carburetors and the respective intake manifold will bolt onto a 308QV engine?
If it would work, could anyone suggest a 'hotter' cam profile to compliment the conversion?
The engine will be built primarily for street use, and emissions are not a concern. |