| Author |
Message |
Dave Penhale (Dapper)
Member
Username: Dapper
Post Number: 433
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Monday, December 30, 2002 - 2:25 am: | |
Thanks Jeff, I'll be putting all the parts back together today, hoovering the dry white glue residue that falls off when removing the rubber hood seal etc. It's a big relief and you guys made the job of diagnosing and rectifying easy.
Think I'll endevour to get my hands on a workshop manual when I can though, I need one if only for some wiring diagrams |
Jeff B. (Miltonian)
New member
Username: Miltonian
Post Number: 20
Registered: 12-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, December 29, 2002 - 10:21 pm: | |
Dave:
By the way, in answer to one of your earlier questions, it's very, very easy to remove the A/C control panel from the console. Two minute job. Glad that wasn't the problem in your 348!
Jeff B. |
Jeff B. (Miltonian)
New member
Username: Miltonian
Post Number: 18
Registered: 12-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, December 29, 2002 - 5:28 pm: | |
Interesting fix, you may be right about resetting. Seems to me I heard a horror story about having to pay big money to "reinitialize" the electrics after a battery replacement. Helpful person told me that in order to accomplish this, you just have to start the engine and let the car run at idle for 10 minutes, then shut it off and restart. I never had a problem with it, so I'm not sure what that's all about. Glad it's working again, Dave!
Jeff B. |
Dave Penhale (Dapper)
Member
Username: Dapper
Post Number: 431
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, December 29, 2002 - 3:26 pm: | |
BINGO!
Sorted it, the fuse in question was not blown, I unplugged it and replugged it and the panel now works as advertised.
My thoughts are now that thepanel was shut down in dormant mode, it needed to be depowered and repowered to switch it back to life.
Postmortem - Going back to my cause, I let my battery rundown to v'low volts (enough that the doors wouldn't unlock), at no time was it actually nil volts, so I had not taken 'all' power off the A/C panel, just enough to shut it down I guess. Good diag for others in the future, it clearly isn't always a dead fuse, rather a means of ressetting the system (of course now I know this I could do it by the more esaily accesible battery break point if I ever had the need to in the future).
Your views welcomed but in any case thanks for the help guys, I wont be so stupid as to let the battery drain so low in future.
Thankfully all this has cost me is time to remove/replace the hood upper liner...phew |
Dave Penhale (Dapper)
Member
Username: Dapper
Post Number: 430
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, December 29, 2002 - 3:06 pm: | |
Never mind waiting till the morning, now I know its the one I'll get out there and swap the fuse out now, thanks Jeff. |
Jeff B. (Miltonian)
New member
Username: Miltonian
Post Number: 17
Registered: 12-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, December 29, 2002 - 2:15 pm: | |
Dave:
You found it. The relays are the "cooler-heater unit fan control" and the "compressor control". The fuse is "temperature control system". There is a brown wire on each side of the fuse, and I think one side is "hot" to the battery (not switched). My battery is unhooked at the moment for flywheel repair, so I can't test it. Now that I try it, I find that I CAN get my hand in there without pulling the liner, but it's tight. If you have a spare 30A fuse that you know is good, just plug it in and try it! |
Dave Penhale (Dapper)
Member
Username: Dapper
Post Number: 428
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, December 29, 2002 - 1:51 pm: | |
Thanks Jeff, Unfortunately I don't yet have any wiring diagrams at all so I'm flying blind.
I've found another 30A fuse and a pair of green plastic capped (what look like) relays mounted to the passenger side (for you guys) of the air inlet box under the hood...is this the one in question? Again the blade fuse 'looks' ok but it'll have to wait till the morning to check with a meter.
I did have the A/C plant turned on when I charged the battery so if a fuse has blown it could be the cause, I guess that would be a good result, but it aint looking that eloquent a solution so far!
If I end up having to get the A/C plant control panel out for work what sort of a job is removal? |
Jeff B. (Miltonian)
New member
Username: Miltonian
Post Number: 16
Registered: 12-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, December 29, 2002 - 12:55 pm: | |
The component diagram on page I10 of the Workshop Manual (item #21) shows the fuse in question, I had never noticed that before. Wiring diagram L43 for the A/C system also shows the fuse (item #69). If the A/C was turned on when you first started the car after the battery had died, it MIGHT have put a "surge" through the system and blown the fuse. |
Jeff B. (Miltonian)
New member
Username: Miltonian
Post Number: 15
Registered: 12-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, December 29, 2002 - 12:22 pm: | |
Dave:
Just a quick mention: on my 348, the fuse LOOKED like it was OK at first. I pulled it out and checked it with a Multimeter, and it had no continuity, and there was a tiny melted spot on the side. I put in a new fuse and everything was fine. Billybob is right about the layout, the fuse in question is not mounted on the ABS box, but it is right next to it. You're close! Hope this works.
Jeff B. |
Dave Penhale (Dapper)
Member
Username: Dapper
Post Number: 427
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, December 29, 2002 - 7:33 am: | |
thanks Billy bob, I'll check those when I get back home. |
billy bob (Fatbillybob)
Junior Member
Username: Fatbillybob
Post Number: 118
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, December 29, 2002 - 7:30 am: | |
dave,
those are for the abs system. look another 6 inches on the body of the a/c unit with the big intake hole on it. green relay with a 30a fuse attached to it. just pull the fuse and look at it. |
Dave Penhale (Dapper)
Member
Username: Dapper
Post Number: 426
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, December 29, 2002 - 7:06 am: | |
Sorry, I mean under the hood BTW |
Dave Penhale (Dapper)
Member
Username: Dapper
Post Number: 425
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, December 29, 2002 - 7:05 am: | |
Got the panel off. Under it on the left side of the car (as viewed if sat in it) there is another bank of relays and alongside them are 2 x 30A blade fuses and one 3A blade fuse. Just had time to check the 2 x 30A ones and they 'appear' to be ok, I will get in with a meter when I have more time, haven't checked the 3A one yet, will do later.
Will probably need the relevant wiring diagram to trace the problem. If it turns out to be the actual unit and it were simply a case of soldering joints that would be pretty do-able as I've done many intricate solder jobs in the past, an essential skill on my old 928. |
billy bob (Fatbillybob)
Junior Member
Username: Fatbillybob
Post Number: 115
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, December 29, 2002 - 6:08 am: | |
Good Get Jeff B. I forgot about this one. Mine is a inline fuse holder listed as 30A. And attached to a Green relay on the main A/C unit on the passenger side under the bonnet. |
Jens Haller (Jh280774)
Junior Member
Username: Jh280774
Post Number: 150
Registered: 9-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, December 29, 2002 - 6:02 am: | |
Dave,
Had something similar with the internal light of the 348 that didn�t work anymore. Was a very cheap fuse in the hidden panel. Easy to open and fix. Hope nothing worse wrong with your AC unit. Had problems with them as well and I can only advice you not to exchange the whole unit (Expensive!) which every Ferrari dealer wants you to. Instead I gave it to a skilled electrician which is a friend of mine. He soldered over all connections inside of the unit.That lasted about one and a half hours with all checks and costed me several beers at the local pub. A good deal IMO since the unit works perfect again.
Con saluti cordialissimi,
Jens Haller |
Dave Penhale (Dapper)
Member
Username: Dapper
Post Number: 424
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, December 29, 2002 - 3:09 am: | |
thanks again Jeff, I'll check this first, although I'd be amazed a 30 A could blow from anything I've done, sounds like the best easy shot I have to try though. |
Jeff B. (Miltonian)
New member
Username: Miltonian
Post Number: 14
Registered: 12-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, December 28, 2002 - 5:22 pm: | |
Dave:
Access is difficult to the area of the "hidden" fuses unless you remove the trunk liner (just remove the screws). On my LHD 348, the fuses are at the right rear corner of the trunk, next to the ABS control box. I don't see any mention in the Owner's Handbook. It's a 30A green blade-type fuse in an in-line holder. I can barely see it by pulling up the trunk seal and lifting the corner of the liner, but I can't get my hand in there without liner removal. The symptoms you describe are EXACTLY the same as I experienced when I bought the car. The seller's mechanic told me I needed a new compressor (!), but it was just the fuse, it has worked fine for three years now. Your problem may be different, but this is worth a check. Sorry I don't know the exact layout on a RHD 348.
Jeff B. |
Dave Penhale (Dapper)
Member
Username: Dapper
Post Number: 423
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, December 28, 2002 - 4:21 pm: | |
Thanks Guys, I'll try to locate that 'hidden' fuse that Jeff mentions. There doesn't appear to be any failure of the instrument lights at all, just all of the air con panel functions i.e. no led's work, no air con fan speeds, no temp displays, no clock or air direction option buttons.
I've had a look at the fuses/relays in the panel under the hood, none seem to relate to the power to the whole panel. Also, reading the owners manual none of the fuses/relays in the passenger footwell (left hand side for my Euro...I'm in UK).
Jeff, I guess in my Euro, UK car such a hidden fuse would be the opposite side?
Gotta sort this as it renders the car undriveable in damp UK conditions this time of year on the grounds that the windows mist and I can't keep them very clear (cracking a side window down helps a little)!
Anyone seen this hidden fuse in any wiring diagrams? |
Jeff B. (Miltonian)
New member
Username: Miltonian
Post Number: 13
Registered: 12-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, December 28, 2002 - 1:19 pm: | |
Have you checked for the "hidden" fuse in the front trunk compartment? I don't think it is shown in the books, I found it by accident and it fixed the A/C in my 348. It's under the trunk liner between the right trunk latch and the heater air intake box, not easy to find!! In my case, the fuse wasn't blown in the conventional manner, it was defective and had broken down internally, shutting off the entire A/C system. I fixed it for 25 cents! I don't know if all 348's have this fuse in this location, but it was stock on my 12/1990 348ts.
Good luck.
Jeff B. |
billy bob (Fatbillybob)
Junior Member
Username: Fatbillybob
Post Number: 111
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, December 28, 2002 - 11:56 am: | |
348 electricals suck. do not charge battery with battery hooked to car. There is relay and fuse to A/C in front left tire fuse box. FWIW I can rebuild the fuseboxes. I have excorcised some demons by doing this. Also sometimes you blow instrument lights but have working A/C. Push the on button and try that first to isolate your problem. Instrument light fuse is in passenger footwell fuse box. |
Ric Rainbolt (Ricrain)
Member
Username: Ricrain
Post Number: 334
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, December 28, 2002 - 11:51 am: | |
I hope it's the fuse, because the A/C control units are notoriuosly finicky (fragile) and... sadly, expensive. If the unit has failed, you might consider sending it to me for repair. I also own a 348 and I'd be interested in discovering the failure mechanism of these units. |
Dave Penhale (Dapper)
Member
Username: Dapper
Post Number: 422
Registered: 4-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, December 28, 2002 - 9:47 am: | |
Stupidly allowed my battery to go totally flat (share an Optimate conditioner between bike and car but forgot to swap it over!). Now battery is fully up and the air con plant in console is dead, no LED's light, even the clock is no show...any ideas? Other than loosing the radio/CD station tuning presets, all else seems fine.
If its fuse(s) or relays, location/ident no.s would be appreciated (doubt if I'm that lucky) as the manual is next to useless in identifying likely fault.
I did not cross poles when applying a proper charger so hopefully no serious damage done? |