| Author | Message | ||
| lou staller (Lou_staller)
New member Username: Lou_staller Post Number: 3 Registered: 12-2002 |
Thanks to everyone that posted advice on the engine removal from my 308 QV. I'm about ready but now I have to wait for my daughter to come home from college so I can give her a ride before I tear into it! So, the journey begins in a few days! Thanks again for all the valuable info. This site is great! | ||
| lou staller (Lou_staller)
New member Username: Lou_staller Post Number: 2 Registered: 12-2002 |
Test | ||
| Mitchell Le (Yelcab1)
Member Username: Yelcab1 Post Number: 475 Registered: 11-2001 |
I weighed my 2V 308 with tranny when it was out. It was 500 lbs. A QV maybe a bit more, but not much more. I used the freezer bag method. Still, you need to take very good notes, especially about things like ... what side of the bearings go in/out, what wires go where, how many washers, etc. I hooked up the oil cooler with the engine outside the car, hooked up the starter and battery, and checked the oil pressure before I put the engine in. I also did a full engine pressure test to find leaking head gaskets ... and fixed it. | ||
| Ric Rainbolt (Ricrain)
Member Username: Ricrain Post Number: 326 Registered: 2-2002 |
Timothy, if you unbolt the fuel unit from the firewall, you can use bungee cords to hold the head close enough to the engine to take it all out at once. I have to admit though, I generally remove the fuel head, but it isn't strictly necessary. Email me at [email protected] for my cell phone number. Lou, I've never weighed it, but I suspect the engine/tranny combo is around 7-800 lbs. Tom/Lou, I always fully remove the half shafts. They're too costly to risk damage to either the joints or the shafts. In addition, anytime I pull the engine, I generally plan on servicing the CV joints anyway. Tom is right, the freezer bag is the only way to go. Just put related parts in, label and toss the bag into a larger box until later. | ||
| Martin - Cavallino Motors (Miami348ts)
Advanced Member Username: Miami348ts Post Number: 3461 Registered: 5-2001 |
Lou, the engine and tranny weighs a lot. You would be surprised. I need a fork lift to lift them all up. Martin | ||
| James Selevan (Jselevan)
Member Username: Jselevan Post Number: 278 Registered: 6-2002 |
Lou - one other thing to entertain. When rebuilding my Dino, and a friends 308, I had the exhaust and radiator out of the car. After the rebuild, I hooked everything up, with the engine on the floor (on a piece of carpet), used after-market water hose, attached the exhaust system to the headers, got a five gallon gas jug and fuel pumps, and fired it up. No vibration or tendency to "walk" at all. Sat rock-steady on the piece of carpet. In all, took an extra hour to hook up hoses to radiator, fill with water, connect fuel pump to lines, and attach exhaust. This was likely easier in a carbureted car, but you get the picture. The advantage was that I could let it run for an hour to operating temperature, while slowly running the RPM up and down (2000 rpm). This enabled me to check for oil and water leaks before replacing the engine in the car. As I was not in a hurry, I did this for 10 consecutive evenings, for 1 hour each. I had an external (cheap) oil and temperature gauge hooked up. After these 10 cycles, I retorqued the heads and readjusted valve shims WHILE ON THE GARAGE FLOOR. It is a heck of a lot easier than when in the car. With confidence that I did not have leaks, and that the valves and heads were serviced, I replaced the engine. (Other details, like electric house fan to cool radiator, charging battery, no half-shafts, are easy to work through, and I am happy to share with you.) My educated assumption is that 10 hot/cold cycles are sufficient for the heads to expand and contract, and for valves to seat, thereby allowing the torque and shim clearance adjustment. Others may disagree, but both engines are running fine 20 years later. Just another, perhaps dumb, suggestion. Jim S. | ||
| Tom Treue (Treue)
New member Username: Treue Post Number: 29 Registered: 4-2002 |
Lou: Be careful with the half-shafts: don't let them hang free with one end still mounted to the axle (either differential or upright). If you let the solid, heavy shaft hang free, it will touch the flanged tube bonded to the cv joint body causing it to become egg-shaped. If it's bad enough, it can cause leaks where the boot mounts to the cv joint. After you disconnect one end of shaft assembly, hang it from a frame member with baling wire to keep it off the cv joint tube. Put your small parts in a labeled and dated freezer bags as they come off the car. Example: starter mount bolts, Intake plenum fasteners... Check your Vibrachoc isolators. Mine were deeply corroded inside. Tom | ||
| Erik R. Jonsson (Gamester)
Junior Member Username: Gamester Post Number: 217 Registered: 11-2000 |
oops, i erased it Don't forget the ground strap and speedo sender wires. Go to www.caplugs.com and get a free assortment of plugs/caps. Get a box of ziplocks and a sharpie and label all your bolts/nuts. Remember to put in your front header first when reinstalling the engine as it is very difficult to do after the engine is in. Call an expert if you get stumped, my number is on my website. | ||
| Timothy Fulmer (Tf308)
New member Username: Tf308 Post Number: 30 Registered: 5-2002 |
ric...master of all things ferrari..w. the qv the unit is bolted to the back of the engine bay and the metal lines go to the intake runners. Maybe I am insane, but something needs to give here. That would be alot of weight you are asking those metal lines to hold if you pulled the whole unit out w. the motor. I took the unit out and it was really easy. I just unbolted it from the fuel source, then unbolted the 8 connections to the intake runners, that was about it. PS...why dont you ever answer you phone or did lash just give me a bad number  pss it seems like the fuel unit is so close to the exhaust that it has to have a detrimental effect on the intake temps. what do you think the gain to direct injection would be if you could then have a cold ram air effect going straight to the throttle body? | ||
| Ric Rainbolt (Ricrain)
Member Username: Ricrain Post Number: 325 Registered: 2-2002 |
But it isn't necessary to remove the fuel injection. It can be removed with the engine. Just be careful of not bending or breaking the small lines. | ||
| Timothy Fulmer (Tf308)
New member Username: Tf308 Post Number: 29 Registered: 5-2002 |
Ric...you forgot the fuel injection. Lou, I am currently almost there (just need to remove the oil cooler, ac, and its out!) Let me know what you plan on upgrading. People tell me the valve job isn't that good from the factory and extra flow can be picked up here for a reasonable cost. I will say my prayers for you with the head removal...what a #$%&ing #@$%ty pain in the ass! | ||
| Rob Lay (Rob328gts)
Board Administrator Username: Rob328gts Post Number: 3038 Registered: 12-2000 |
Yes, take detailed pics and notes for when the rest of us do it.  Thanks. | ||
| Lou Staller (Lou_staller)
New member Username: Lou_staller Post Number: 3 Registered: 12-2002 |
By the way, what does the engine and gearbox weigh? Being aluminum I would imagine no much. I have a cherry picker and engine balancer so off I go. Actually I don't plan on removing it until after the holidays, 'cause if I do I'll want to spend all my time in the garage and that wouldn't fly! Ric, appreciate the step by step, and Paul, high compression pistons sound good! I have a guy that's been doing Jag and Ferrari engines for years so I'll ask him what he thinks works best for the street. But all that is way down the road. Anyone else have any tips before I tear into it? | ||
| Mark Foley (Sparky)
New member Username: Sparky Post Number: 23 Registered: 3-2002 |
Lou: In a previous thread, somebody said Harbor Freight has a good engine load balancer for pulling the engine. When you are getting ready to pull it, if you want, I could possibly help. Send me a email off line. Good luck. | ||
| Ric Rainbolt (Ricrain)
Member Username: Ricrain Post Number: 323 Registered: 2-2002 |
If you proceed to pull the engine, here's a very quick summary (not necessarily complete or in order): You'll need an engine balancer Remove rear bonnet cover Remove air box and associated plumbing Remove half shafts (don't swap them or turn them around before reinstalling) Disconnect exhaust manifolds Disconnect alternator/starter cables Disconnect shift lever Disconnect clutch cable Remove oil cooler air conveyor (it's not necessary at this point to disconnect the oil cooler itself) Disconnect auxiliary electricals (oil temp sensor, etc) Remove compressor Disconnect coolant lines Unbolt motor mounts The engine comes out "whole" with transmission, clutch, heads, etc. all in place. Lift the engine with an engine hoist, using the balancer to lower the back of the engine. Don't set the engine directly on a hard surface (I use a wooden pallett dolly or set it on a workbench) | ||
| billy bob (Fatbillybob)
Junior Member Username: Fatbillybob Post Number: 101 Registered: 8-2002 |
Lou, Best tip is....its just a motor don't freak out. Use common sence and rebuild it don't go crazy. You have a 30 Y/O car and you are never going to have a 360 out of a 308 so don't try. Follow basic rebuild processes like minimal deck milling, line honing, plastic guage bearings etc. and you will be fine. There are really no surprises here if you take your time and think before you wrench. The tricky part is finding how he whole kluge is held together. Use judicious use of force and ask before you swing the 5lb hammer. mild hot builds are o.k. and do not affect driveability. Hot cams and greater than 10:1 pistons, 328 cranks in 308 blocks make for engine management headaches unless you want to go to a completely new system. but then you need to spend money on the suspension and then you would have a 348 into it you should have bought one of those. It never ends. Rebuild it as fast as you can and enjoy it ASAP. | ||
| Matt Morgan (Kermit)
Junior Member Username: Kermit Post Number: 92 Registered: 8-2001 |
One tip for you. I fabricated a lifting "bridle" out of angle iron pieces about 3" long, drilled to match the end intake ports. To the 4 of these, I attached 4 i/2" turnbuckles that join in a ring on top. This allows you to tip, turn, etc. easily. Once the plumbing, etc. is out of the way, and motor mounts undone, simply lift, and tip the motor so that the gear housing (clutch end) is vertical. It will easily come out. I have done it this wayby myself easily. Hope that helps. | ||
| Paul Newman (Newman)
Member Username: Newman Post Number: 890 Registered: 12-2001 |
BretM is almost finished his and posted several pictures of the process. He has a QV as well. I have a carb 2 valver but its very different so no sense in telling you about mine. Look under 308 QV engine rebuild pictures. that might get you there. Im sure bret will pop in at some point anyway. p.s. buy high compression pistons. make it fast while you are there. | ||
| Barney Guzzo (Trinacria)
New member Username: Trinacria Post Number: 47 Registered: 8-2002 |
Someone in a recent thread said there is going to be full coverage of this topic in The next few issues of Forza magazine. Try a search on the site as well. I purchased my F car needing a bit of work also. Hope you got a really good price. | ||
| Lou Staller (Lou_staller)
New member Username: Lou_staller Post Number: 2 Registered: 12-2002 |
I just purchased a '84 308 GTS QV that needs a complete rebuild. I know what you're thinking, I should have bought a good running one 'cause the rebuild is big $$! I know, but doing this sort of thing is my hobby and keeps me sane. I do most of the work myself and for the stuff I don't do I have some great friends! Anyway, before I pull the engine and gearbox out, can someone direct me to a thread that may have already covered this process? Why with 5 miles of hoses and emission contraptions I've never seen before, I'm hoping someone that has been here can suggest where to start. (This car is the newest old car I've ever worked on! No emissions on the old stuff!) I've glanced through the archives but can't find anything. Any suggestions? And please, be nice! |