| Author | Message | ||
| Warren E. Smith (Magoo)
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Mark, You're a tough man to convince, but it worked. Enjoy. MAGOO | ||
| '82 308gtsi (Mark)
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Thank you! Thank you! Thank You! You guys saved me some big bucks with your insightful input. Decided to take the car for a drive tonight. It smoked for about the first ten minutes and then stopped. I can't even get it to puff when I take off at a light. Gave me that same feeling that I had when I first bought it. Looks like I'll be driving to Indy for the Formula 1 race next month. Thanks a million! Mark | ||
| Herbert Edward Gault (Irfgt)
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I don't get the point in removing the exhaust to see if it still smokes. If it has oil in the exhaust, it will burn out shortly if all is well with the engine. If it is full of oil what are you going to do to get it out? The only simple way is to get in and take off and let it burn itself out. I have done dozens of cars that way when head gaskets have been blown and pistons cracked and have never had a problem. It is sure worth the time unless you intend to throw the stuff away and replace with new dry stuff.$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$. | ||
| '82 308gtsi (Mark)
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Still haven't had a chance to look into it. I talked with Nick last week and he suggested that I remove the exaust system up to the headers and run the engine. That way I'm bypassing the oil in the exaust. I've also been thinking that oil might be in the plenum. I'll remove the air filter and take alook before I fire it up. Nick also warned me that the now minus exaust will be loud, but it's a great sound he said. I'm looking forward to doing it. I will let you guys know what I find and it should be very soon. Thanks for all of the input, even you Herb! Mark | ||
| Warren E. Smith (Magoo)
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HeyMark, What happened? | ||
| Warren E. Smith (Magoo)
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Mark, What was the final outcome of the overfill condition? | ||
| Sam NYCFERRARIS (Sam)
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I heard you should use special hose clamps with telfon cooling hose... anyone want to reccomend teh best hose clamp to use...it is such trouble changing these hoses I think using the best hose clamp makes sense...anyone know a good source. also, anyone have gates part numbers for these hoses so we can go toa parts store and just order them without spening a day playing measure and match ( parts counter guys really love when you do that!) | ||
| kelly vince (Tofosi1)
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Sorry herb, I already got the hose. One hella of a job replacing all of them. My arms are sore from twisting the hoses on the pipes. Love those moons pies too. | ||
| Herbert Edward Gault (Irfgt)
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I can sell you some Gates green stripe for a lot less than that!!!! I have eaten mud bugs and they seemed more trouble than they were worth. I'll eat a Moon Pie and a Big Orange in a heartbeat though. | ||
| Craig Dewey (Craigfl)
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Kelly: We enjoy "mudbugs" in N. Florida too.... | ||
| kelly vince (Tofosi1)
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Herb, There's a rail road track about 12 miles north of Alexandria, LA. Anything north of that is consider to be a DAMN Yankee to us real southerner. So, Since you are some where up in South Carolina. It Ain't a Southern Thing. My uncle in Brevard, NC cannot believe we eat Crawfish and have big parties to eat them. HAHAHA Thanks for all you advise on my AC. I get 40 degrees at the vent. New project is changing all the coolant hoses. Did you know a 3 foot section fo gates green Stripe is $30.00. I think it has gold in the core threads. HAHA | ||
| Warren E. Smith (Magoo)
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WELL SAID HERB. MAGOO | ||
| Herbert Edward Gault (Irfgt)
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In my profession, I am serious as can be about my job, but I always try to inject a little humor in everything I do or say to try to break the tension. It is just a "Southern Thing" you wouldn't understand. We poke fun at each other and cut each other down but it is all in fun, I try to make light of everything because we are here only a short time so we need to have as much fun as we can while we are still healthy enough to enjoy life. We also need to accept the fact that we all make mistakes and we learn by them and we should accept a certain amount of ribbing from our friends when we do. I sure have earned some in my time. | ||
| Sam NYCFERRARIS (Sam)
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Hey, Herb is the sharpest, quickest, most responsive and pragmatic guy I've met. When it comes to cars and engines, you can bet the farm on his advice, he must have mobil 1 in his veins (or is it agip now?) He gives it to you straight, may not always be pretty but on target. Hey anybody that has a Corvair (hey, compare to a porsche of same vintage - identical specs! - Herb's no fool) AND a Ferrari in the same car collection has to be one interesting guy! | ||
| Herbert Edward Gault (Irfgt)
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Here is a picture of one of the valve seals that I removed from my engine that was causing the high oil consumption and smoke. As you can see there was quite a hole in the side and you wouldn't believe how much oil got through the hole.  | ||
| Joe Baker (Joeferrari)
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Sorry in a hurry 308 same as 328 | ||
| Joe Baker (Joeferrari)
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This might help you, If your 308 is the same as the 308 you should run the car until say 60 C ( lowest temp mark ie warm engine ,shut it down and wait exactly 15 min before checking it should then be on max mark. Is it smoking out of all pipes ,if yes best news as it is unlikely that you would have taken skirts off all pistons or valve seals by overfilling. I would take a reading off dipstick say 10 minutes after running engine, then if no metalic noises, and oil pressure is ok then take it for a run, every 15 minutes stop to ensure the dipstick level is about ok, not running out, I tend to agree with the others that it will need a good run say 30min or so to get it out , but only if everything else appears ok | ||
| Warren E. Smith (Magoo)
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Mark, You've got to learn about Herb. Best source of info. on the chat line but likes to play with your mind. Great guy. MAGOO | ||
| '82 308gtsi (Mark)
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Gee thanks | ||
| Herbert Edward Gault (Irfgt)
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Oh, we thought you were pretty dumb but we did not say it out loud. | ||
| '82 308gtsi (Mark)
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I want to thank everyone for their help and advise. I also want to thank everyone for not cracking on me for doing such a brainless move. I'll let you know how things go. My wife is currently on vacation and I am watching the little ones until Friday. Hope to have it up and running by the weekend. Mark | ||
| Warren E. Smith (Magoo)
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I agree Mark, I think it will eventually get back to where it was before. You have oil in places that it was never intended to be and plenty of it. You definetly have to drive the car to rid it of all of the oil in those places it doesn't belong. Putting the engine under a load by driving it will clean up the situation quicker. | ||
| '82 308gtsi (Mark)
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Magoo- It would some times smoke at start up. But it never smoked while I was running it. I talked with my friend Mike today. He is an import mechanic at a high end dealership. Mike said the same thing, that I would have drive it to clean up the oil in the exaust. He said letting it run in my driveway was not the same thing as running it on the streets. Mark | ||
| Martin (Miami348ts)
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Herbs diagnosis is the same that my mechanic told me I was lucky did not occur in my case. My bill was only $450 for that "experament". ONe I paid with a huge smile I may add. | ||
| Warren E. Smith (Magoo)
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Mark, Did the engine smoke at all before all this overfilling of oil occured? | ||
| Warren E. Smith (Magoo)
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Herb, I got a question. How would he have damaged the seals by adding too much oil? That is if it didn't smoke before. | ||
| '82 308gtsi (Mark)
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Did you have to pull the engine when you rebuilt the heads? How many $ in parts did you have just for the heads? I'll pull my own engine and have the heads redone by some one other than myself. | ||
| Herbert Edward Gault (Irfgt)
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you might as well get ready to pull it apart and replace the valve guides and seals as I just did for the same problem. | ||
| '82 308gtsi (Mark)
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Still smoking. I'm not going to try driving it. I'm afraid I'll be ticketed by the police. I still haven't had a chance to pull the spark plugs and check for oil. I'll let you guys know what I find. In the mean time any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks | ||
| Warren E. Smith (Magoo)
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Hey Mark, What's happening? Is she still smokin'? | ||
| Frederick Thomas (Fred)
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Hey mark, Things are good in Indy. Let me know when you are coming down. Fred | ||
| Warren E. Smith (Magoo)
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Mark, Martin makes a good point here in that oil could be in the air filter. This could clog it and could have caused the engine to pop at times. I would cetainly check that for sure. | ||
| Martin (Miami348ts)
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Thanks Mark; I own a 348, so the 308 will not do. My oil intake is 10 Qts if I remember corectly. I got me a owners manual on eBay and also got workshop manuals and spare parts cataloge copies for my car. Those will do you no good either at the moment. I think too you have to run the car for a while. Change the oil filter and air filter and check if there is any oil in the air intake. I think I had that too. They had to clean something out anyway, so check for that, that is no major work. Thaks for your offer. | ||
| Herbert Edward Gault (Irfgt)
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There could also be oil accumulated in the converters and muffler having been blown out into the exhaust. The car needs to run at speed for at least an hour before a verdict is rendered. There is still something wrong though because the dipstick reading should not vary that much hot or cold. A quart one way or another but not four quarts. | ||
| '75 308 GT4 (Peter)
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Removing heads is an engine-out job.... like Magoo said, give the engine a GOOD chance to burn off any residual oil that'll be caked/gooped in there from the over-filling, before contemplating something like that. | ||
| '82 308gtsi (Mark)
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Hey Fred how's Indy? You're right it is over 9 quarts. I didn't change my filter so I only added 8. Hope the smoking stops soon. Keep in touch. Mark | ||
| Frederick Thomas (Fred)
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Am I mistaken or is 2.34 gallons a bit over 9 qrts? | ||
| '82 308gtsi (Mark)
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Can't drive it around the neighborhood because it smokes to much. I'll start it tomorrow and let it warm up. See if that helps. Wish me luck. Mark | ||
| Warren E. Smith (Magoo)
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Like Bret says. Put approx. 8 gts. in the car on a oil change. | ||
| Warren E. Smith (Magoo)
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God Mark, Don't panic. You obviously wayyyyyy overfilled the engine and got oil in the combustion chamber. It will take a good run to get it all out of the combustion chamber. Drive the car for at least 1/2 hr. If there is no improvement you may have other problems that occured at the same time. But I doubt it. | ||
| '82 308gtsi (Mark)
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My owners manual says that my engine holds 2.34 (US gallons) of oil. I was lucky to get an owners manual and service book with my car. Now if I could just find a shop manual. Martin would it be of any help to you if I copied my owners manual for you. I could fax it some time next week. Let me know. Mark | ||
| '82 308gtsi (Mark)
|
Thanks for the input. I drained the oil and found that I had over filled the engine. Put in 8 quarts of 20w50 and she still smokes. For a while it appeared to have stopped, so I gave it a little gas and the smoke returned. I waited for the engine to warm up but still it smokes. The popping sound has almost stopped. Occasionally I hear a pop. I think it's the oil igniting in the cylinder. Does anyone know where I can find a 308 shop manual. If I have to have the heads worked on I would atleast like to save some cash by removing and reinstalling them. I think I might start a mosquito fogging service to help pay for the repairs. Mark | ||
| Warren E. Smith (Magoo)
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10/4 Martin You called it also. I think that is his problem. | ||
| Martin (Miami348ts)
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Hey, did I mention that AAA Plus is a great program...you will need it. I used it 6 times in one year (no not just the Ferrari...more so for my BMW, but in any event it pays) | ||
| Martin (Miami348ts)
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 you did what I did to my car last year....added oil while the engine was cold or shutting it off while checking. I added and added and had smoke coming from my car like crazy and then the engine quit on me on my way to downtown. Anyway, have the car towed to your mechanic tell him you added too much oil and have him check it out. I had the sysdtem cleaned and flushed and added Mobil 1 Synthetic. $500 bucks later I had a perfect running car. BTW checking the oil should be discussed in your owners manual, if you have one, if not you likely bought the car at Prestige Imports in Miami, like I did and never received yours. Those bastards! | ||
| BretM (Bretm)
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Yeah, the max oil level is 8qts and min is 6qts. So for it too be right you would have had to been ridiculously low on oil. I would do like you said and look at all the cylinders, as well as take out all the oil and put in 8 qts (the only way you'll know if you have the right amount or not). | ||
| Warren E. Smith (Magoo)
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Mark, Chances are you added too much oil to the crankcase. You wouldn't have "blown" a valve seal. You should check the oil within a few minutes after you shut the engine down. It should read somewhere close to max., but not over max. As for the popping at idle I can't imagine what that could be. Is that all you put in there was the oil? Check that first and make sure you do it shortly after you shut down the engine. | ||
| '82 308gtsi (Mark)
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The other night I checked my oil and found that I was down several quarts. I added two quarts 20w50 and again checked the dipstick. I ran the engine for several minutes and then allowed it to sit for two minutes before I checked it. I ended up adding a total of four quarts. After a short drive I noticed the engine missing (popping) at idle and up to 3 grand. I checked the oil level again and had to add four quarts. Now I have alot of smoke coming out of the exaust with an engine that has only 30,000 miles on it. Did I over fill my oil? Did I blow a valve seal? I've heard that 308's have a problem with valve seals and guides. I figure that if I pull the spark plugs one at a time I should find the cylinder that has the problem. I know it may be time for the heads to be redone. Ant help would be appreciated. Mark |