| Author | Message | ||
| Philip Airey (Pma1010)
Junior Member Username: Pma1010 Post Number: 99 Registered: 7-2002 |
When I bought my 77 308 GTB, it was similarly lacking in service records (although the PO [#2] had the car for 22 years). Looking it over at the PPI and subsequently, our evaluation was that the car likely had very few miles put on it over the last 5 years. As a result, in common with many "garage queens", most rubber hoses/gaskets and seals have needed changing. Suspension bushes are another candidate as are shocks. Valve clearances can tend to tighten up (as the valve forces its way into the seat) etc. Unfortunately, where you don't have good S&M records, the bias has to be to inspect and change if there is doubt. As you drive it you'll notice other things that you didn't pick up on earlier (my steering rack bushings were worn and the rack has been rebuilt; brake rotors have been replaced etc). The list gets long and expensive quite quickly as I have found. My advice is to sit down with the tech that did the PPI for you and develop a prioritized list of what needs to happen, when. Belts and shims are likely to be #1 with a number of "while you are in there" items, like the water pump. On "do you do it yourself/have someone do it for you", this comes down to appetite, aptitude and time (and the availability of a friendly tech if you get into trouble!). The SPC and WSM, can help you. As time has gone on, I've done more myself and I enjoy doing the work. A friendly technician will acknowledge this and be prepared to support your efforts. For example, I used my service shop to cut out and weld in new suspension bushings while I did the disassembly/claen up/paint/reassembly. Peter, generally 308 parts are fairly widely available however, prices also vary significantly (e.g., 50%) from one place to another depending on which vendor has which parts in stock etc so get some comps on the parts before you buy. HTH Philip | ||
| Ron R (Ronr)
Junior Member Username: Ronr Post Number: 103 Registered: 10-2002 |
What about checking valve clearances? I just had a 30k done on my new 308 because I didn't have a good history. The two things I was most concerned about were the belts/bearings and the valves. Now I don't have to worry about it. | ||
| J. Grande (Jay)
Intermediate Member Username: Jay Post Number: 1035 Registered: 10-2001 |
I guess what we are trying to say Peter is that an ounce of prevention is better than a pound of cure! | ||
| Verell Boaen (Verell)
Member Username: Verell Post Number: 505 Registered: 5-2001 |
Greg's right on: re:" It is a good idea to grease the tensioner spring assembly too." The 20 year old grease in my tensioner springs had turned into cosmoline & one of the springs had started to rust where it was NOT well coated with grease. An extra hour to thoroughly clean & re-lube the tensioners the 1st time you do a belt change is a good time investment. You shouldn't need to do it again for 5-10 years. | ||
| Greg Rodgers (Joechristmas)
Member Username: Joechristmas Post Number: 643 Registered: 3-2001 |
I would do them while you are in there. It is hard to tell the condition of the tensioner bearings without removing them and feeling there rotation. If you do that then you will want to do the belts. I have some pics if anyone wants to see of my 78' when I was doing the belts. The tensioner bearing assemblies come off fairly easily. Just make sure you mark your cams well, etc. before you remove the belts. I think that you have to remove the covers anyway to get the waterpump off for your model. It is a good idea to grease the tensioner spring assembly too. | ||
| Steve (Steve)
Member Username: Steve Post Number: 290 Registered: 2-2001 |
Peter I think the big issue here is you don't know when this service was done. I got my 77 in late 2000 with 32k miles on it and a fresh 30k service. I am now in the process of redoing the waterpump at 45k miles and asked myself if I should do the belts again. I also talked to Nick (one of the sponsors) to get his opinion. He said that I should not need to change the belts and as long as the tensioner bearings ar good you don't need to change them. So I'm still thinking as to if I'll change them. I do about 2500 miles a a year here and stay away from rain. | ||
| Ric Rainbolt (Ricrain)
Member Username: Ricrain Post Number: 440 Registered: 2-2002 |
The cam belts almost never show external wear before breaking. Usually, something internally gives way (or in some cases, an external problem causes the belt to jump or strip). A good friend's QV bit the big one after 7 years w/o a belt change. He had "documents" that said they had been replaced, but the date code on the belts told the truth. The outside of the belts looked fine. | ||
| Dan B. (Dan_the_man)
Junior Member Username: Dan_the_man Post Number: 84 Registered: 9-2002 |
One more thing, I decided that I would change my belts every year. this is due to my driving habits, (VERY agressive, ask Donny and Tracey) and the fact that I drive it daily. I bought it in April, and I have put almost 24,000 miles on it. That is correct, 24,000 miles. I often rev it to 8,000 rpm's. I was not willing to rev it past 5,500 before changing the belts. Also, Peter, if you have cat's on it, then take them off and gut them out. that will help alot with the "loading up" in traffic that the webbers do. My 79 had the cones in the end of the cat's. VERY restrictive. I cut them out and gutted the cats. the heavy fuel smell, high smutt build up on the rear, and the loading up almost completely went away. Plus, when I drove it from Mobile AL to Washington DC I got (No joke) on the average of 20 mpg. running about 85 all the way. I get around 12 to 16 in town depending on how hard I am driving. Very comfortable ride on a long trip too. Dan | ||
| Dan B. (Dan_the_man)
Junior Member Username: Dan_the_man Post Number: 83 Registered: 9-2002 |
Peter, If you have ever changed a timing belt before on another car (successfully) then I would suggest you do it your self. A car is a car is a car. set the belts, rotate the engine by hand and make sure the alignment marks are correct. Change the tensioner bearings. I say this due to the fact that these cars do not see allot of miles during their life time and bearings seize up. also, rebuild the water pump while you are in there. the seal and two bearings are about $130 bucks or so. Again, these pumps leak because people don't drive the cars alot and they sit. you will need to know if the pump is the early or later model pump before ordering your parts. My 79 had the later model pump on it. As for the belts, it is not necessary to pull the cam gears off and do all that cam dialing. the book tells you to do that because that is how ferrari set it up. you are basically degreeing the cam when you do that. again, don't fool with that. You will not see a difference to justify the work. IF you were racing your Ferrari at timed events then MAYBE. If you have a seal leak at the front of the cams then replace the seals. you do not want oil on your timing belts. I took the rear valve cover off, rotated the engine until the crank and that bank of cams came up to the timing marks, then I took a chisel and marked the forward cams where they come out at the seals behind the gears, and marked a corresponding mark on the valve cover (Thus I did not remove the forward valve cover). I then removed the belts, replace them with the new ones, and rotated the engine by hand to make sure all the marks aligned correctly. then reassembled the front of the engine. the hardest part is getting the AC compressor out and back in. That is a ho dog! You will have to find a larger than normal socket for the crank, I went and bought a cheep 3/4 drive metric socket set just for this purpose from Harbor Freight. Other than that, it is strait forward. there are places on the net where you can down load the service manual for these 308's. I don't remember where it is, but it is in acrobat format. Dan | ||
| Randall Booth (Randall)
New member Username: Randall Post Number: 27 Registered: 1-2003 |
I'm in the same boat. I just bought an '82 308 with no records. As for the mileage during the first year? I've put 1500 miles on it in the first 3 weeks. Parts are on the way for a 30k service, don't know if it's needed, but I do know it will make me feel safer about driving it. | ||
| david handa (Davehanda)
Member Username: Davehanda Post Number: 455 Registered: 5-2001 |
Well Jay, then I completely agree with you then! Three years it is! :-) I put over 19k miles on my 308 GTS in a little over two years, so it can be done. I've put about 4500 miles on my current 328 in 4.5 months of ownership. That just driving it on evenings and weekends, but includes a couple trips from Seattle to Vancouver. | ||
| J. Grande (Jay)
Intermediate Member Username: Jay Post Number: 1021 Registered: 10-2001 |
Yes, change the fluids once a year! I say 3 years for the belts because with a new car you're gonna put alot of miles on in the first few years, I know I will!  | ||
| david handa (Davehanda)
Member Username: Davehanda Post Number: 454 Registered: 5-2001 |
I would do a complete major service, then you can drive in confidence for several years as mentioned. 3 years? That is being WAY conservative, I would say you are good for 5 or 6 years... Just change the fluids as needed. | ||
| J. Grande (Jay)
Intermediate Member Username: Jay Post Number: 1019 Registered: 10-2001 |
Let's put it this way...the only thing standing between a $20K engine job and driving around worry free is a $20.00 belt. Change it and forget about it for the next 3 years! While you're at it change the tensioner bearings also. I wouldn't recommend you change your own belts if you've never done it before. That's just my own view. | ||
| Peter Sedlak (Peters)
New member Username: Peters Post Number: 4 Registered: 1-2003 |
Hi All:Replies greatly appreciated: I bought my '77 308 without maintenance logs. It has 65K miles ( looks great, runs good @ $15.5K ). The timing belt appears to be in extremely good condition. No abnormal wear, cracks, etc. How weary should I be and how tough of a job is its replacement? Peter |