| Author | Message | ||
| Andreas Forrer (Tifosi12)
Member Username: Tifosi12 Post Number: 482 Registered: 10-2002 |
Mike, absolutely. There is a ricer with such wheels in the hood. Looks funny. BTW: Where could I put all those batteries for the hydraulics to make the 308 dance at the red light?  | ||
| Mike Charness (Mcharness)
Member Username: Mcharness Post Number: 252 Registered: 8-2002 |
Andreas, yes that sizing would work if you put on the GTO fenders. Otherwise I think it would look kind of "ethnic" to have the wheels sticking out past the wheel wells. | ||
| Mike Charness (Mcharness)
Member Username: Mcharness Post Number: 251 Registered: 8-2002 |
Philip, I had mentioned it in a previous post in this thread. I got it from www.xpel.com/bulk.html | ||
| Andreas Forrer (Tifosi12)
Member Username: Tifosi12 Post Number: 480 Registered: 10-2002 |
Mike, very true, my profile doesn't show the spacers. I haven't installed them yet and yes, they would push the tires outside the wells. That's the intention as I have some 288 fenders in my mind... Weather permitting I will try them on for size and shoot some pictures. BTW: The FK spacers have a TUEV certificate, which means, that the German authorities really looked at them and approved them. They wouldn't have done that if they had caused any troubles. | ||
| Philip Airey (Pma1010)
Junior Member Username: Pma1010 Post Number: 135 Registered: 7-2002 |
Mike Where did you get the stoneguard material? Philip | ||
| Dr Tommy Cosgrove (Vwalfa4re)
Member Username: Vwalfa4re Post Number: 568 Registered: 5-2001 |
Post pics when it's on! | ||
| Mike Charness (Mcharness)
Junior Member Username: Mcharness Post Number: 249 Registered: 8-2002 |
The 3M StoneGuard paint protection film arrived today. For those rear panels, a single 18"x12" piece would be large enough for both sides of the car if you don't make any mistakes. Not having done it before, I'm glad I did have some extra material! I'm very happy with the final result, though, and I will probably do the small lower panels behind the front wheels also. | ||
| Mike Charness (Mcharness)
Junior Member Username: Mcharness Post Number: 248 Registered: 8-2002 |
Andreas -- since your spacers are about twice the width of mine, please post pictures, as I'd like to see the results. If you've got "upsized" rear tires on your QV, I would think the end result might push the tires past the wheel wells. It doesn't look like your profile picture has them installed. | ||
| Andreas Forrer (Tifosi12)
Member Username: Tifosi12 Post Number: 479 Registered: 10-2002 |
Mike, you made me nervous. So I had to run home and check what spacers I got. Phhewww! Not yours. Mine are from FK, a German company and the guy who sold them to me, has the same set on his 328 and sent me some pictures (which I deleted afterwards) and it does look awesome. He said they would fit instantly, so I'm hopeful. Machining would be a bit more than I can chew. OTOH mine were about twice your money. | ||
| Mike Charness (Mcharness)
Junior Member Username: Mcharness Post Number: 246 Registered: 8-2002 |
Tom, right, that's exactly what I did. | ||
| Mike Charness (Mcharness)
Junior Member Username: Mcharness Post Number: 245 Registered: 8-2002 |
We had some better weather today, so I pulled the car out of the garage for a couple more pictures. Here's a before and after (only change is having added the spacers):  I am going to add some 3M StoneGuard material on the lower panel behind the rear tires. It was about $20 for the StoneGuard material in two 18"x12" pieces from www.xpel.com/bulk.html that I'll trim and install myself... I've already cut a paper template piece. And here's the new look from the rear of the car:  It looks good from all angles, and I'm sure isn't going to hurt handling sliding through corners at the track in a couple of weeks! | ||
| TomD (Tifosi)
Advanced Member Username: Tifosi Post Number: 2786 Registered: 9-2001 |
nice, while you prob did this, I find when cutting a threaded bolt it is better to put a nut on first and then back off after cutting - this helps get the threads right at the end. FWIW | ||
| BretM (Bretm)
Advanced Member Username: Bretm Post Number: 3164 Registered: 2-2001 |
Very cool stuff. Looks great too. | ||
| Mike Charness (Mcharness)
Junior Member Username: Mcharness Post Number: 244 Registered: 8-2002 |
I talked to the General Manager of H&R/USA yesterday afternoon. Their intention is that the spacers and bolts would indeed be "plug and play", though he's heard of the similar hub extension clearance problems once before, but it was on a euro model. I told him this probably happened on ANY 16" 308 rear wheel, and he probably just didn't hear about it, as I almost didn't bother to call him either. Of course the concern is that if someone doesn't realize it's a problem and installs it anyway, then there's a safety issue. Same goes for the bolt lengths. He said he would look into both issues, and also into the problem of inconsistent chrome finish quality on the bolts. He has my contact info now, so I'll report back if/when I hear back from him after he researches it. | ||
| Mike Charness (Mcharness)
Junior Member Username: Mcharness Post Number: 236 Registered: 8-2002 |
"Standard" 348 rear track is 62.1" The 308QV original stock rear track width is 57.9". With "upsized" 245/45 tires and 5/8" (16mm) spacers, my 308QV is now about an inch and a half wider rear track width. Even the "standard/early" 348s certainly still have the edge on width. But I do like the 308/328 "Magnum P.I." body style. Yes, I'll report back after the March 8 event at Talladega Roadcourse. | ||
| Philip Airey (Pma1010)
Junior Member Username: Pma1010 Post Number: 128 Registered: 7-2002 |
I don't have the specs to hand, so can anyone tell me how much wider the rear track is on a 348/348 (understanding the latter had two specs)? Mike, please post what you find on your next track excursion Thanks | ||
| Mike Charness (Mcharness)
Junior Member Username: Mcharness Post Number: 233 Registered: 8-2002 |
Philip: 245/45 is the "right" size for upgrading the rears, and that's the size I had on the car already before adding the spacers. Using 245/50's adds height compared to the original tires, which is why you might have had the problems with rubbing the fender liner. With this combination, I'm getting the extra rubber and width from the 245/45's, and now I'm also adding extra track width. Just going to the upsized tires made quite a difference, and this should improve it even more. I don't expect any difficulties at the racetrack, as there's still plenty of vertical clearance, but I'll find out March 8, which is our next event (www.fca-se.org). In fact, I expect better handling at the track because of the extra width. | ||
| Mike Charness (Mcharness)
Junior Member Username: Mcharness Post Number: 232 Registered: 8-2002 |
Paul, no, that's why I wrote this up. If someone didn't know any better they'd potentially mess up their hubs, have their wheels loose (the 60mm bolts won't tighten the wheels down all the way because of the interference) and put the load on the hub extension instead of the spacer flat. You're right, potentially dangerous consequences. I plan to call the U.S. office of H&R next week. It's a Germany-based company, but their US office is in Washington state. | ||
| Philip Airey (Pma1010)
Junior Member Username: Pma1010 Post Number: 125 Registered: 7-2002 |
Mike I am curious how you find them at the track. I put 245/50 rears on my 308 and found they rubbed the fender liner. Putting on 245/45s solved the problem. I know you've moved the wheel "out" rather than used a bigger tre, but I am curious if you run into the same thing. Thanks for posting the details of the how to. Sounds like it was a bit of an exercise rather than plug and play. Philip | ||
| Paul Hill (348paul)
Junior Member Username: 348paul Post Number: 52 Registered: 12-2002 |
Mike, Did they tell you that there was a possibility that you would have to a mod to them? - Its OK if you know what you are doing but to someone who is less skilled could put themselves into all sorts of danger. Nice job though! Paul | ||
| Mike Charness (Mcharness)
Junior Member Username: Mcharness Post Number: 231 Registered: 8-2002 |
I'd read several of the threads about wheel spacers on a variety of Ferraris, and decided to try some on the rear of my 308QV. I'd already "upsized" the tires on my stock 16" Cromadora wheels to 245/45-16's on the rear and 225/50's on the front. The fronts nicely filled the wheel well, but the rears, while looking ok, didn't "match" the fronts. I decide to purchase H&R spacers (15mm) from www.ecstuning.com who had them at $82/pair. Longer Ferrari-style wheel bolts were $5 each. I was hoping this would be "plug and play", but that was not to be so. H&R only offers Ferrari wheel bolts in 70mm and 60mm. For the rears, I needed aprox 50mm (the stock 35mm bolts plus added length of 15mm for the spacers). I bought the 60mm bolts hoping they would fit in without binding. Nope. The extra length hit the curve of the inner hub. With the help of a friend who has better tools than I do, it took about an hour total to use a cutting wheel to take aprox 10mm (3/8") off the end of each of the 10 bolts, do a quick touch up of the end on a grinding wheel and use a triangle file to clean that end thread. Tedious, but no problems. I'd gone to the hardware store and bought a 14x1.5mm nut so I could make sure the thread worked without binding. If you were putting spacers on the fronts, the 60mm bolts would be the perfect size with no modification. The bolts themselves were a very hard steel, but the chrome finish was mediocre. I don't think it's noticeable unless you've got stock Ferrari bolts to compare it to, but they really could do better. The main thing is that they're inconsistent... about 3 of the 10 bolts were really highly polished, 4 of the 10 were ok, and 2 of the 10 were really poor, though I was able to buff them up to give them a slight improvement. Then there were the spacers... they weren't plug and play either. H&R makes just one spacer to fit Ferraris, and it's p/n HR3035670 and supposed to fit my 308 as well as 328, 348, 355, 456, 512TR, Testarossa and Mondials, so that's what I got. By the way, the spacers are marked 5/8" so that really is closer to 16mm instead of the 15mm advertised (fine with me!). The spacers look very well made, nicely machined out of an aluminum magnesium alloy, and hubcentric. The problem was, the hub extension was almost 1/8" too long, so when fit into my stock wheels, the end of the hub extension hit the inside of my wheels' hub lip, keeping the wide flat mating surface from properly touching the inside flat of the wheel itself. The hub extension is supposed to be for centering, not load bearing! After trying sanding (too slow) and filing (too slow), I went over the hub extensions with a tungsten carbide bit on my dremel tool, finishing them off with a flat file and then sandpaper. It was rather tedious on the first one trying the different methods and then testing/retesting to find out just how much I needed to take off (probably ended up around 3/32"), but the second one went quickly as I ground it down to match the first one. Installation was quick and easy after that, and I tightened the bolts to the standard 72ft/lbs. I'll check/retighten them after I've driven a bit. I'm very pleased with the way the rear wheels and tires look relative to the wheel wells now. And of course, I don't mind joining the "wider is better" crowd! I thought I'd write this all down so you other 308/QV owners know what's involved. The price was much better than other sources (one FChat source I heard back from was $250/pair of spacers, and $20/bolt), and the small amount of tweaking I had to do was worth it. Maybe other Ferrari wheels won't have that 'problem' with hub extension clearance that my QV Cromadora's do and yours will go more easily with as-delivered stock spacers, though you'll still likely have to "customize" the length of the bolts. Here's the spacers showing both sides, and a 60mm "untrimmed" bolt.  This shows the hub extension I had to trim down.  And here's the final result. Sorry for the indoor picture, it was at night and it's supposed to rain all weekend!  |