| Author | Message | ||
| Manfred Heger (Mondi991)
New member Username: Mondi991 Post Number: 14 Registered: 4-2003 |
Thanks Steve, a very interesting Site. I decided to buy a new complete Set of genuine Ignitionwires from a german dealer (230 $ round about) Then I�ll see and hope bella macchina will run fine again. Regards Manfred from Germany | ||
| Steve (Steve)
Member Username: Steve Post Number: 344 Registered: 2-2001 |
I would think if you have a carb car and have converted to breakerless ign then I would replace the coils.A good site that has a lot of technical info is http://www.magnecor.com/magnecor1/main.htm CARBON (SUPPRESSION) CONDUCTORS Carbon conductors are used in original equipment ignition wires by most vehicle manufacturers, and in the majority of stock replacement wires. This style of ignition wire is cheap to manufacture and generally provides good suppression for both RFI (radio frequency interference) and EMI (electromagnetic interference). Conductor usually consists of a substrate of fiberglass and/or Kevlar over which high-resistance conductive latex or silicone is coated, and functions by reducing spark current (by resistance) to provide suppression � a job it does well while the conductor lasts. Vehicle manufacturers treat ignition wires as service items to be replaced regularly, and limited life is never an issue. This type of conductor quickly fails (burns out) if a high-powered aftermarket ignition system is used. EMI (electromagnetic interference) EMI from spark plug wires can cause erroneous signals to be sent to engine management systems and other on-board electronic devices used on both racing and production vehicles in the same manner as RFI (radio frequency interference) can cause unwanted signals to be heard on a radio receiver. Engine running problems ranging from intermittent misses to a dramatic loss of power can result when engine management computers receive signals from sensors that have been altered by EMI emitted from spark plug wires. This problem is most noticeable on modern production vehicles used for commuting where virtually every function of the vehicle's drive train is managed by a computer. For many reasons, the effect of EMI on engine management computers is never predicable, and problems do become worse on production vehicles as sensors, connectors and wiring deteriorate and corrosion occurs. The problem is often exacerbated by replacing the original ignition system with a high-output system. SOLID CORE CONDUCTOR WIRES Solid metal (copper, tin-plated copper and/or stainless steel) conductor wires are still used in racing on carbureted engines, but can cause all sorts of running problems if used on vehicles with electronic ignition, fuel injection and engine management systems, particularly if vehicle is driven on the street � and damage to some original equipment and modern aftermarket electronic ignition and engine management systems can occur. Solid metal conductor wires cannot be suppressed to overcome EMI or RFI without the addition of current-reducing resistors at both ends of wires. | ||
| Ben Millermon (Brainsboy)
Junior Member Username: Brainsboy Post Number: 239 Registered: 5-2001 |
As for all things in a motor more is not always better. Is 15:1 compression good? sure if you have 120 octane, are large cams good? sure if you have the induciton system to go with it. Ignitions are the same way. You cant just always slap a set of solid core wires on something and expect it to work. Despite popular belief resistor wires are not only for radio noise. Ignitions are design to have certain draws on them. A coils amperage draw will very with different sparkplugs and wires. A ferrari coil is not famous for its performace, in fact its common for going bad. These coils sometimes are old, cracked, ect,ect, and border line working. For street use you may not notice. When you change the design by adding MSD or adding solid core wires you can over work the coil, this is no big suprise, if you call MSD and talk to a tech you will find that they changed the design of the MSD and no longer carry warrentys if you use solid core wires. Infact the instuctions tell you not too. Im not saying solid core wires are bad, Im saying the chances of you burning up a coil or more likely on a ferrari coil. If solid core wires where were it was at im sure ferrari would come with them. If you still dont believe me stick your right hand on a valve cover and your left hand on the coil, if you get shocked you know you have less resistence then the wire, so like I said less resistence is not always better  (Just kidding dont try that.) | ||
| Steve (Steve)
Member Username: Steve Post Number: 343 Registered: 2-2001 |
Ben you have me confused here. The coil generates a specific voltage output. Depending on the coil you can get 10K or 20K or even 30K volts from the coil. A solid copper wire has less resistance then a Resistive type of wire. So the net is you get more voltage to the spark plug which is goodness. The resistor wires were initially designed to stop radio noise but it hinders performance. So less resistance = better spark/performance and more resistance = less spark and less performance. We are talking basic electricity here. The Ferrari coil set up has a start resistor circuit which in the start position gives the coil a full 12 volts which gives you max volts to the plugs. When you go to the RUN key position the coil now gets 6 volts so it will run cooler and you now get a reduced voltage at the plugs. If you run this coil on 12 volts all of the time it will burn up.Most older vintage racers use copper core wires because of the performance improvement. With the onset of on board computer systems these solid core wires have a tendency to throw out noise signals which sometimes effect the CPU's so this has caused the advent of spiral core carbon type wires which prevent this problem and also lets you hear your radio.I use Lucas Blue coils with my Pertronix ignition set up.These are 15K 12V coils and I needed to jumper out the start resistor.Oh the reason for the reduced voltage coils on the stock engine is because it uses points. | ||
| Ben Millermon (Brainsboy)
Junior Member Username: Brainsboy Post Number: 237 Registered: 5-2001 |
You can use after market wires, its just a stock ferrari ignition system doesnt like the copper wires very much. Buy a set of 7mm accel resistor wires or 8mm and cut them to fit the caps. Also im not saying this is your problem. Im just pointing out that from what I have seen copper wires burn it up. The damage may already be done, you may need a new coil, I went through 2 coils before I figured it out. I would test the coils first to see if thats where the problem is. If so replace the coil and buy resistor wires. Ben | ||
| Manfred Heger (Mondi991)
New member Username: Mondi991 Post Number: 11 Registered: 4-2003 |
Ben, if you want to have a look on my car, you can see it at "Ferrarichat Europe". Sorry I�ve got to leave now. I�ll take alook in this Chat tomorrow in the morning. Bye | ||
| Manfred Heger (Mondi991)
New member Username: Mondi991 Post Number: 10 Registered: 4-2003 |
Could be possible, but a complete set of genuine ignition wires is really expensive? | ||
| Ben Millermon (Brainsboy)
Junior Member Username: Brainsboy Post Number: 236 Registered: 5-2001 |
Copper wires have less resistence then normal ferrari wires, while you may think this is good for power and helps the coils, it will burn out the coils. It may take 1 month could take 1 hour. How fast depends on the age and condition of your ferrari coil. Your ferrari coils are not made for this type of wire, there is a reason why they have resistor wires. Im sure some guys can claim they have solid wires and been running for years, but from what I have seen most Ferrari coils are sensitive and wont take it. Its like the old cars that had a ballast resistor, removing the ballast gives you more power, less resistence, but only works for a few hours until everything burns up. | ||
| Manfred Heger (Mondi991)
New member Username: Mondi991 Post Number: 7 Registered: 4-2003 |
Sorry Ben, I don�t think so. Copper wires have much less Resistance than Resistancewires? | ||
| Ben Millermon (Brainsboy)
Junior Member Username: Brainsboy Post Number: 235 Registered: 5-2001 |
It is a problem, I did the same thing once when I first bought my 308 and ended up with the same problem as you, turns out I burned up a coil. The copper wires dont have enough resistance I guess. | ||
| Manfred Heger (Mondi991)
New member Username: Mondi991 Post Number: 1 Registered: 4-2003 |
I`ve got some Ignitionproblems with my car. Everytime it runs higher than 4000 rpm it quits with misfire. Now I changed Sparks and Ignitioncables(but i used coppercables instead of the original resistancecables) It shouldn�t be a problem? Need Help |