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Message |
JRV (Jrvall)
Intermediate Member
Username: Jrvall
Post Number: 1288
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Friday, April 18, 2003 - 11:34 am: | |
J.Scott,
back on topic...that's certianly not the most concise answer I've ever written for sure.
But the reasons are simple...sometimes, like this scenario, it's not allways easy to determine when to go the long drawn out approach or when to fix what's broken and get out.
25K miles is almost nothing on a Ferrari engine in many ways...OTOH...one critical part has gone bad and risk exists that others might follow, until one knows precisely why that one part failed. Trying to walk that tightrope between excessive exploratory surgery and careful, profesional, conscientious, inteligent, prudent servicing is not all that easy in situations like this.
Look at it from the mechanics/shops point of view...if you do both heads and one head needs virtually nothing you're considered gouging...OTOH do one head to save the customer money & time and the second head later goes bad and you look like an idiot...
So really the most important part of some of these situations is carefully assessing the broken/worn pieces and evaluating the degree of wear, why it failed and the odds of the other side succuming to a like problem. So following the direction the evidence leads is the correct procedure, however it's not as easy as it sounds sometimes. Unless of course the owner wants Carte Blanche...then just do it all and be done.
But I've always held "failure analysis" at the top of my list of "must haves". Because any proper repair imo address's "why" and corrects that issue if neccesary at the same time as "what" to insure succesful finality to the issues. |
Sean F (Agracer)
Junior Member
Username: Agracer
Post Number: 93
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Friday, April 18, 2003 - 10:07 am: | |
Thanks for the reply.
JRV, you've got mail. |
j scott leonard (Jscott)
Member
Username: Jscott
Post Number: 353
Registered: 1-2002
| | Posted on Friday, April 18, 2003 - 7:54 am: | |
No relationship! I always make myself known and think that it is a coward who hides behind a fake idenity! Just trying to bring a little humor to a sometime confrontational chat. Take a look, I was being complementary. You guys need to lighten up and enjoy. Whenever I get hatemail from an imposter or unsigned, I just toss it out with the trash. Someone who is not willing to sign with their own name is not worth reading or paying attention to! Sorry, not me. |
JRV (Jrvall)
Intermediate Member
Username: Jrvall
Post Number: 1287
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Friday, April 18, 2003 - 1:51 am: | |
>>Exactly why JRV is worth the trouble. He actually does know more than the rest of us!<<
huh????????? that sounds like something the imposter would say.
second time in two days you've been right behind me helping out. Coincedence? are you related to the imposter or just his casual aquiantance? |
j scott leonard (Jscott)
Member
Username: Jscott
Post Number: 351
Registered: 1-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 10:48 pm: | |
Exactly why JRV is worth the trouble. He actually does know more than the rest of us! |
JRV (Jrvall)
Intermediate Member
Username: Jrvall
Post Number: 1284
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 10:29 pm: | |
Pull both heads, "inspect everything carefully", and fix whatever is broken/worn and leave the rest alone other than cleaning, measuring, reseating, etc.
Although it's really a question if it's worth pulling the second head with such low mileage...it's a matter of that piece of mind knowing that everything is inspected and corrected all at the same time and preventing the second head from succuming to the ill of the first head. And dealing with the valve guide boss issues (95's) while you're in their. As well as all the service updates it may need.
The one head shortcut leaves you open to a possible second failure but then again, the condition of the bad heads parts will give strong indications of how much wear is on the parts of the good head. So you go the direction the evidence dictates.
Total cost in the $10K -$12K ballpark (assuming some old parts are still fine) and probably take 6-8 wks I'd guess, because the really good head rebuilders have a line, and alot of checking and work will go into the head rebuild itself.
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Sean F (Agracer)
Junior Member
Username: Agracer
Post Number: 92
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 9:45 pm: | |
Miles ~25K. All regular service performed per the manual (based on time or mileage, whichever came first).
Used mostly as a weekend car.
Driven hard occasionally.
Will continue to use in the same manner. |
arthur chambers (Art355)
Intermediate Member
Username: Art355
Post Number: 1325
Registered: 6-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 5:30 pm: | |
Sean:
If the car is anything but a salvage title, I would replace all the valves, the guides, etc. I would estimate the price for this at about 10 - 12k, and it would include all parts for the 30k service. I would do that since the motor has to be removed for the valve replacement anyway, you might as well get the service done.
Art |
JRV (Jrvall)
Intermediate Member
Username: Jrvall
Post Number: 1276
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 4:44 pm: | |
questions:
How many miles on the motor?
how has it been used?,
what are your future intentions for use?
To answer the quesrtions you've asked honestly one needs to know where the motors been and where it's going to. It's called asses & plan. |
Steve Magnusson (91tr)
Intermediate Member
Username: 91tr
Post Number: 1667
Registered: 1-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 3:59 pm: | |
Wouldn't make sense to me to do all that labor and only replace the 1 bad valve, and I'd do both sides unless the other side was very, very fresh (especially on a '95 355 where documented replacement of the valve guides would be a plus on resale). I think you could reuse/regrind the intake valves with little risk if the mechanical dimensions are OK, but the exhausts are always a little suspect -- JMOs.
What are the details -- year/model, mileage since last top end freshening, and what caused just 1 valve to burn? |
Sean F (Agracer)
Junior Member
Username: Agracer
Post Number: 91
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, April 17, 2003 - 3:35 pm: | |
Obviously it needs to be fixed.
What needs to be done, how long should it take and at what cost? Lets assume we've discovered what caused the burned valve and that has been fixed (or will be fixed, but I'm not interested in that cost). All I want to know is what is required to remove/replace or fix this burned valve? Should I replace ALL the valves on the car, or just the one bank that's bad. Should both sides be checked and only the bad valve be replaced?
Tell me what your recommendation's are, about how long that would take (weeks, months) and a guess on cost for parts and labor. Give me a wost case senario. I know there are a lot of variable here (at least 40) but just give me a best guess.
I know this is a very general question, but I'm doing a little comparison here to satisfy my own curiosity.
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