| Author |
Message |
noel smith (Noel)
Member
Username: Noel
Post Number: 303
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 20, 2003 - 9:30 am: | |
Michael, what did you end up doing? |
Dave Helms (Davehelms)
New member
Username: Davehelms
Post Number: 13
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Friday, May 16, 2003 - 11:52 pm: | |
Frank, Kind of figured that was you from the initials. Yes this is handy to keep in touch isnt it. Looking forward to seeing the new car soon! Dave |
FABS (Caruso360)
New member
Username: Caruso360
Post Number: 2
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Friday, May 16, 2003 - 4:12 pm: | |
Dave; Thanks for that bit of info. I guess I could've stopped by your shop or called. This chat is just another way to touch base. Yes, it's
me, Tim Barnett's other half. I should know from Kelly today on ETA for the 360. Later; Frank |
Dave Helms (Davehelms)
New member
Username: Davehelms
Post Number: 12
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Friday, May 16, 2003 - 6:13 am: | |
Trans ECU grounds are behind the pass seat in the fuse/relay compt. There are a number of major grounds where the center tunnel meets the rear firewall (under the consol) that are a real bugger to get at to clean, with out removing the consol. Motronic grounds are under the side panels in the engine compt. The 6 speeds dont have the problem because your clutch foot can not feel the slight differances in the flywheel shape. |
FABS (Caruso360)
New member
Username: Caruso360
Post Number: 1
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 15, 2003 - 9:17 pm: | |
Dave; Does this problem exist in 360's with a six speed tranny? |
michael aguilar (Michael)
New member
Username: Michael
Post Number: 5
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, May 15, 2003 - 6:26 pm: | |
Jason
Did they replace your flywheel? or was it machined to removed the imperfection?. |
Jason Fraser (Jfraser)
Member
Username: Jfraser
Post Number: 358
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 13, 2003 - 7:07 pm: | |
Dave,
That's exactly the problem I had...concave flywheel. |
michael aguilar (Michael)
New member
Username: Michael
Post Number: 4
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 13, 2003 - 9:18 am: | |
Dave
Thanks for that info, as soon as I get the car for service I would let them check all the info you have given. When this car was new my initial problems where the grounds , instruments would make false readings. Would you happen to know where the ECU's are located and you mentioned interior tunnel and engine compartment as where to check the ground wires, are they visible?
Thanks for your help. |
michael aguilar (Michael)
New member
Username: Michael
Post Number: 3
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 13, 2003 - 9:09 am: | |
Jason
Thanks for all that info, the dealer is yet to open here I believe within the next few weeks. I'm glad your familiar with the traffic around makati cause thats where the car runs. I believe Ferrari of Singapore would be handling service so most probably they would know what to do. the car is a Euro model 2000 360.
With your new clutch system in place what mileage
are you expecting before doing the same job all over again? |
Dave Helms (Davehelms)
New member
Username: Davehelms
Post Number: 6
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 13, 2003 - 6:26 am: | |
When the 99 360s were first delivered we found a number of them to have "concave" ground flywheels. This confused the ECU, because the disc and the pressure plate were flat, and as the pressure plate started clamping the disc, it would bend it to fit into the improperly machined flywheel "dish". The ECU already has its PIS (point of initial slippage) programed in, and it would calculate how much further to release the throw out bearing for complete clutch release. With the "dish, and flex" factors added to the equation the ECU would pull the TOB back out when it recieved readings from the TOB sensor it did not understand (one of the reasons for the surging clutch on the 360s). The clutch position sensor is mounted in the TOB on the end of a short stalk. On a number of the ealier cars the hole the stalk fits into on the TOB was a bit too large, and the sensor would wiggle back and forth giving the ECU false readings, again causing the surging in to clutch upon release. Another very big problem we encountered, were ground problems for the Motronic and transmission ECUs. Many of the shifting problems were fixed by simply cleaning grounds in the interior tunnel and the engine compt. This would be the first place to start. Every 360 owner should have a small brass brush and a bottle of Stabilant 22 in the glove box for a survival kit! |
Jason Fraser (Jfraser)
Member
Username: Jfraser
Post Number: 353
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Monday, May 12, 2003 - 9:15 pm: | |
Sorry Michael I didn't answer your question. The PIS is basically set by a computer that's plugged into the car....V1 ECU's set themselves (which is where a lot of the problems stem from)...There are tricks the dealer can do to make the ECU set in the desired range @ 4.8-5.2.....The key to success is how cold the car is (absolutely vital) on a V2 system I believe they are able to 'dial in' the setting. It's also possible to set the system up even if the car is warm. |
Jason Fraser (Jfraser)
Member
Username: Jfraser
Post Number: 352
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Monday, May 12, 2003 - 9:06 pm: | |
Michael,
I'm not an expert, but, would suggest the following....
Get a % clutch wear readout...Dealer does this via a computer they plug into the car....This should cofirm the clutch problem I think you're having....personally anything above 60% I'd replace it....I suspect it's above 70%.
I'm not sure what model year your car is, 00-01??
Some of the 00/01 models have a problem with the clutch positioning sensor (which is right in the guts of the transmission, but easily accessible when the clutch is out. I had mine replaced ($450), as I didn't want the transmission stripped/rebuilt, only to find that it was the sensor causing the neutral problem.
Regarding the ECU....I wouldn't change it unless the dealer strongly advises you to do so....Bottom line, it makes their life much easier in setting the F1 transmission for you, but if they're skilled enough they should be able to do it with a V1 ECU....If the V1 ECU is set correctly, you'll notice bugger all difference between the two ECU's.
Price for the clutch, clutch positioning sensor (and there are some other misc. parts) & labour is @ $4500. Noel said he replaced his ECU and it was $1600??....I seem to remember being quoted $4000, so you'll want to check on that.
Meanwhile, do you drive the streets of Manila in a 360?? That must be quite a sight to see. I've spent a lot of time there (Makati, Metro Manila, Cebu etc)
|
michael aguilar (Michael)
New member
Username: Michael
Post Number: 2
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Monday, May 12, 2003 - 7:56 pm: | |
Jason
Thanks for all the info. Look's like i'll be changing the clutch and ECU, with the new version 2 ECU you mentioned that it can manualy be adjusted anywhere between 4 -5.3 PIS , would you happen to know how is it adjusted. One more question how fat should my wallet be before driving for a service.
Thanks for a great help |
Jason Fraser (Jfraser)
Member
Username: Jfraser
Post Number: 351
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Monday, May 12, 2003 - 7:14 pm: | |
Michael,
Get ready to open your wallet, you're probably going to need a new clutch...I have had the same problem as you describe, and so have others...below are some of the threads relating to this issue...If you have any questions after this ,I'll try and answer them for you.
http://www.ferrarichat.com/discus/messages/21/184313.html
http://www.ferrarichat.com/discus/messages/21/192807.html
http://www.ferrarichat.com/discus/messages/21/212880.html
http://www.ferrarichat.com/discus/messages/21/244716.html
http://www.ferrarichat.com/discus/messages/21/237696.html
|
michael aguilar (Michael)
New member
Username: Michael
Post Number: 1
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Monday, May 12, 2003 - 5:48 pm: | |
Hi, did anyone encounter shifting problems with a 360 F1. At 9000km my car develop a problem that when you up-shift the gears the trans goes back to neutral, this happens when egine speed is below 3000rpm` |