| Author | Message | ||
| magoo (Magoo)
Advanced Member Username: Magoo Post Number: 2624 Registered: 2-2001 |
Barry, I see what you are referring to. Two blowers and one motor. This is I am sure what they are talking about 2 fans. Thanks. When the 2 Def. controls are pushed to "0" the outside air or VENT is cut off through the heater boxes and the air conditioning blowers under the dash pull air from the cockpit intreior and re-circulate it. Thus no outside air enters the cockpit resulting in better A/C efficency using cooler re-circulated cockpit air. | ||
| magoo (Magoo)
Advanced Member Username: Magoo Post Number: 2604 Registered: 2-2001 |
Great work Kelly. | ||
| Kelly J. Vince (Tifosi1)
Junior Member Username: Tifosi1 Post Number: 212 Registered: 2-2002 |
Greg the below is what I did to convert to 134A This weekend at 88 I got 50 to 55 at the vent. Below was my problem and how I fixed it. In my case it was a clogged expansion valve. the drier had gone bad > and dumped everything into the expansion valve. Below is what I did. > The drier I used is a > SCS/Frigette > Part # > 207 805 > XH9 DESICCANT > WWW.scsfrigette.com > Purchased at a local ACdelco AC shop for $49.00 > > Expansion valve > Murray Climate Control > PART# > MRY 38683 > THP AC3801C > UPC 9636138683 > NO WEB SITE THAT I CAN FIND > Purchased at O'Riely Auto Parts for $26.00 > > High and Low side 134A connectors, > high side $6.99, > Low Side $15.00. > Purchased at NAPA > DON'T buy the Aluminum cheap ones. > > 3 cans of 134A Wal-Mart $4.88 each I only used 2 > > 134A O rings Assorted $5.99 Autozone > > 2 8oz cans of ester oil > > I changed all O rings. took out the 2 Schratter valves and replaced them > with the 134A connectors. > > I used an Aquarium air hose to drain the oil from the compressor. I > siphoned it out, got about 8 OZ. added the ester until it would not take > any more about 11OZ. Manual call for 330CC or 11OZ. I used a turkey baster > to add the oil to the compressor. > > Drier remember not to open or connect it to the system until you are ready > to Evacuate. > > Make sure the oil drier did not dump any Desiccant in to the hose going to > the expansion valve. this is what killed me. > > Yesterday to was 93degrees here in traffic I got 60 degrees high way 50 > degrees. all reading from the lower vent. > > This evening 83 degrees, 86 heat index 40 Degrees at the lower vent. > > I have noticed one thing. Before my car ran at right below 195 on the > highway, traffic right over 195, no more than the width of the needle. Now > highway the needle is mid way between the 195 and the next hash mark. In > traffic it stays on the hash mark. This mark is between 195 and 250. > > I will double check the car tomorrow to see if I have developed an over > heating problem that may be unrelated to the AC. I did get a little air out > of the front radiator when I got home tonight. I'm going to drive it > without the AC on. > > Per Neville in England I'm going to over fill my expansion tank. It's been > about 2,000 miles since I have done this. When I had this over heating > problem before, over filling fixed it. It cooked off what it didn't need > and has been find ever since until now. > > OF course I am not responsible for anything that might go wrong with your > car in this process. This is only what I did to make it happen. And to all > your Ferrari Techs out there, please excuse my ignorance if I have said > anything that sounds stupid.. Thank God I got some common sense from my > father. I wish he were still here with me to take a drive. > > Kelly Vince > Do you have the Passion? > Tofosi | ||
| Edward Gault (Irfgt)
Intermediate Member Username: Irfgt Post Number: 1180 Registered: 2-2001 |
It sure looks like the Condensa agua tubular filanges dampener to me. | ||
| Barry Wolinsky (308gtb)
Junior Member Username: 308gtb Post Number: 63 Registered: 2-2002 |
Nuh-Uh! That's the tubo scarico condensa. They added the hole for the 328 series. | ||
| Edward Gault (Irfgt)
Intermediate Member Username: Irfgt Post Number: 1177 Registered: 2-2001 |
That would be on the lower right side in the picture. | ||
| Jim E (Jimpo1)
Member Username: Jimpo1 Post Number: 383 Registered: 7-2001 |
Where is the picture of the hole that allows all the freezing cold water to splash on my leg during a hard right turn? | ||
| Edward Gault (Irfgt)
Intermediate Member Username: Irfgt Post Number: 1176 Registered: 2-2001 |
The two fans are connected to a common motor, one on each end of the armature shaft. One motor, two fans. | ||
| Barry Wolinsky (308gtb)
Junior Member Username: 308gtb Post Number: 59 Registered: 2-2002 |
Magoo, this is a more detailed view from the 1976 parts manual which seems to indicate two fans in the "Gruppo Ventilatore" unit. In my car, conditioned air comes out of all dash vents by the windshield as well.  | ||
| BretM (Bretm)
Intermediate Member Username: Bretm Post Number: 2411 Registered: 2-2001 |
I have to admit that I'm with Ed on this. I don't have a clue what switches are doing what. My labels came lose on all those big levers so I don't know which was is up, down, left, right, you get the idea. I think I corrected the vent valves when I had the heater cores out and could see when was closed and open. I haven't a clue what the blue/red levers do. I'm sure I could follow them and figure it out, but off hand I haven't an idea. All I know is when I put my A/C on or what I think would be fresh air, hot air still comes out underneath and it sucks. Nothing like the heat on during a 95deg day. I've tried sealing up the front compartment and have done so quite well, I will also add a piece of foam around the from of the spare tire fiberglass to really seal the radiator air flow from the cabin. Then I will try to figure out where the hot air is coming from. | ||
| Edward Gault (Irfgt)
Intermediate Member Username: Irfgt Post Number: 1167 Registered: 2-2001 |
Why would I ever want to read any instructions. Real men don't need instructions. I always only use the lower vents for my A/C and have never used the upper ones. | ||
| magoo (Magoo)
Advanced Member Username: Magoo Post Number: 2579 Registered: 2-2001 |
When you close the defroster vents to "O" it shuts off the outside air that comes from the blowers through the heater boxes and into the vents. To use outside air would only cut the efficiency of the A/C. The owners manual reads under Air Conditioning, "In order to achieve a correctly operating system make sure there is no air entry from the outside." So the blower under the dash operates the system in a re-circulating of the air in the cockpit only. This is shown in the heating and ventilation diagram in the owners manual. | ||
| Verell Boaen (Verell)
Junior Member Username: Verell Post Number: 96 Registered: 5-2001 |
PLANNED RELIEF FROM RESTRICTIVE VENTS An a/c mod I'm planning to do to my Euro 308 QV next year is to replace the standard vents & plenum holding them with a larger plenum that mounts 2-3 of the round vents like those on top of the dash. This should retain the F* flavor, but the vents will be much less resrictive. | ||
| Burnell P. Curtis (Burnell)
New member Username: Burnell Post Number: 8 Registered: 4-2002 |
On a 75 308 GT4, there is only one fan and it is located under the front hood near the brake system. The early GT4 had no ac vents except on the dash, pointed to the windshield. Later an add on was available that took this same fan output and directed it to the passenger compartment via vents under the dash. Someone sent me a notice with drawings and I still have it. Does anyone know where to buy one of these. The car needs MUCH MORE air flow directed onto the driver and passenger. Does anyone know of a BLOWER UNIT that can be put under the dash? Or a MUCH BIGGER BLOWER that can be put in. Temp will fall with more air flow but the passengers will be happier. | ||
| Edward Gault (Irfgt)
Intermediate Member Username: Irfgt Post Number: 1163 Registered: 2-2001 |
No, this ain't no joke. I do not know if the car recirculates constantly or brings in fresh air constantly. Since I got hit with a leaf, I assume that it gets it's air from the outside. I see no way to change it over. | ||
| magoo (Magoo)
Advanced Member Username: Magoo Post Number: 2577 Registered: 2-2001 |
Ed, It is not labled Re-circulating mode it is simply re-circulating the air in the cabin and not bringing in outside air when the A/C is being used. Or are we going into another joke? BRGDS | ||
| Craig Hess (Crag)
New member Username: Crag Post Number: 42 Registered: 10-2001 |
During the record setting weather of the past week, I tried out the AC in the 85 QV I bought last October. It was adequate with the ambient temp at 95. I found it worked much better with the defroster vents open and rotated around so they pointed away from the windshield and toward the driver and passenger. The vents under the dash leaked around the edges, putting a cold draft on my legs that would not be comfortable on a long trip. I'll try to seal that leak. The blower motor was pushing out a lot of air, but it was rather noisey on the highest setting (however the sound of the engine covered it up). I was generally pleased with the overall performance of my 17 year old system. | ||
| Edward Gault (Irfgt)
Intermediate Member Username: Irfgt Post Number: 1158 Registered: 2-2001 |
I do not think mine has a recirculating mode. If it does I don't know how to do it. I put all my heater controls I believe in the forward positions and using the A/C switches the air comes out the center vents. I rarely ever use my A/C since the top is usually off in the summer and I do not care to drive it with the top on. | ||
| magoo (Magoo)
Advanced Member Username: Magoo Post Number: 2576 Registered: 2-2001 |
Barry, If you will notice by the pic you have posted there is only "ONE" circulating fan in the A/C box under the dash. This is the one I am referring to. It sounds like they are saying there are 2 fans under the dash which there are not. I still think it is a misprint. It doesn't make any difference I still have to check the "ONE" blower under the dash. | ||
| Barry Wolinsky (308gtb)
Junior Member Username: 308gtb Post Number: 56 Registered: 2-2002 |
Gruppo Ventilatore (fan group) is part 10  | ||
| Barry Wolinsky (308gtb)
Junior Member Username: 308gtb Post Number: 55 Registered: 2-2002 |
Magoo, This is from the parts manual:  | ||
| magoo (Magoo)
Advanced Member Username: Magoo Post Number: 2571 Registered: 2-2001 |
Sorry, it should read I only have 1 fan that I use. There are 2 heater blower fans. | ||
| magoo (Magoo)
Advanced Member Username: Magoo Post Number: 2570 Registered: 2-2001 |
I don't have a parts manual but I can tell you that when my A/C is in the recirculating mode I only have fan that I use. At least that is what my owners manual shows. The only other fans that I know of are the heater blower fans. | ||
| Barry Wolinsky (308gtb)
Junior Member Username: 308gtb Post Number: 54 Registered: 2-2002 |
Mine is the original unit too. Then again, my windows open and close fast as well. Who knows? Maybe 1976 was a good year for Ferrari motors. | ||
| Barry Wolinsky (308gtb)
Junior Member Username: 308gtb Post Number: 53 Registered: 2-2002 |
Magoo, the parts manual shows the fan assembly in the AC unit and lists it as "gruppo ventilatore." It appears to be a double fan unit. That would explain the reference you made in the owner's manual. | ||
| magoo (Magoo)
Advanced Member Username: Magoo Post Number: 2569 Registered: 2-2001 |
Barry thanks, My blower fan is the orig one. If your 76 blows hard, what ever that means, mine must have a problem. I guess I will continue with my modification attempts until I find a answer. Maybe tinting is the answer here in south Fl. | ||
| Barry Wolinsky (308gtb)
Junior Member Username: 308gtb Post Number: 52 Registered: 2-2002 |
My 1976 308 GTB's AC blows hard too. My system needs to be recharged though. | ||
| magoo (Magoo)
Advanced Member Username: Magoo Post Number: 2566 Registered: 2-2001 |
Has anybody tinted their windows in their 308? I know you can't do the windshield except for a strip across the top but we already have tint there now made into the glass. That will help a lot in lowering the cockpit temps but it seems like it would look like sh-t. Am I wrong? | ||
| magoo (Magoo)
Advanced Member Username: Magoo Post Number: 2565 Registered: 2-2001 |
P.S. Ed the motor is not in reverse because ther is a moderate flow of air. The car cools down ok but it just seems that it needs a kick of blower speed. As someone said the large window glass spread doesn't help anything. This is true but my system couldn't perform any better it just needs a air boost it seems. | ||
| magoo (Magoo)
Advanced Member Username: Magoo Post Number: 2564 Registered: 2-2001 |
Thanks Ed, There shouldn't be any insulation since the whole system is basicly plastic except for the small pieces of foam rubber on the doors in the system which comes apart with age and has blown out in small particles with age. I don't seem to have any restriction so maybe your blower is a higher speed blower than mine. I know our compressor evap. cond., and other components are the same. But strangely enough I was reading my manual in the A/C section pg. 50 It says Should air circulation be required with the engine stationary the "two fans" of the air conditioner can be left running by leaving the air flow control 38, blower speed control, in one of its positions. That has got to be a misprint. There are two fans that control the heater from out under the grille and are operated by the heater blower switch. The one fan with the A/C in the re-circulation mode,under the dash, is the only fan you would use. | ||
| Edward Gault (Irfgt)
Intermediate Member Username: Irfgt Post Number: 1157 Registered: 2-2001 |
My blower blows really hard and it appears to be a standard issue system. Check for some kind of restriction or possibly your motor is blowing in reverse. I have seen this happen on other cars. Also sometimes a mouse can build a nest or some insulation can restrict the flow. A leaf came through the vents the other day and hit me in the face, thats how hard mine blows. | ||
| magoo (Magoo)
Advanced Member Username: Magoo Post Number: 2563 Registered: 2-2001 |
Ed, The only problem with the older blowers is that you don't even have what would be a normal low speed even on high. So my point is that if 58*,which is good, is at the vents you could drop a couple of degrees with somewhat of a better low and medium speed from a higher rpm motor it can't do anything but direct more cool air on the driver and in the cockpit and of course recirculate faster. Then you may have 60*s at the vents on a real hot day. In my car I cannot feel the blower pressure blowing on me sitting in the drivers seat. The blower is not binding. | ||
| Dr Tommy Cosgrove (Vwalfa4re)
Junior Member Username: Vwalfa4re Post Number: 113 Registered: 5-2001 |
Paul-can you post some pictures of your a/c conversion? | ||
| Paul Sloan (Sloan83qv)
Member Username: Sloan83qv Post Number: 308 Registered: 3-2001 |
I live in Southwest FL and drive my 308QV almost everyday. I converted my car to R134 and replaced that piece of crap York compressor with a rotary compressor, I also removed the vents, vent housing and flex tubing and just have the air coming out the round plastic tube way underneath as well as the defroster vents. My 308 couldn't be more comfortable even when it's 95, but nothing solves that sun hitting your chest. | ||
| Edward Gault (Irfgt)
Intermediate Member Username: Irfgt Post Number: 1153 Registered: 2-2001 |
I you get 40 degree air temp out the center vents with the blower on low speed then the A/C is doing all it's going to do. You can make it blow harder but the air temperature will be warmer. Your best results as far as cooling goes the low and medium fan speeds provides the coolest temperatures. | ||
| Dr Tommy Cosgrove (Vwalfa4re)
Junior Member Username: Vwalfa4re Post Number: 112 Registered: 5-2001 |
I drive my (black) 308 to Atlanta from Birmingham at least twice a year in the spring. One trip last year the outside temp was the upper 80's I put one of those special thermometers that a/c repair techs carry in their shirt pockets in the vents and drove the whole way with the a/c on full blast. I don't remember the exact temp it averaged now but I do recall it was in the 40's. I thought that was a pretty good for a 17 yo Ferrari except I was roasting. The only way I knew the a/c was working was by turning it off. Then I really got hot. I think nomatter how well you get your a/c working on a 308 it will never be able to overcome the solar-panel windshield. Its size and angle relative to the small interior is always going to win the climate control battle on a hot day. Has anyone ever noticed the hot spot it can put on your chest after just a few minutes of driving directly into the sun? | ||
| magoo (Magoo)
Advanced Member Username: Magoo Post Number: 2542 Registered: 2-2001 |
Greg, If you read my comments under the post 95* and the A/C..... under Gen. Ferrari Diss, I have started asking for comments about the replacing of the old blowers on the older 308s with the newer ones on later 308s and 328s. Maybe more rpms. I am asking for comments if anyone knows. | ||
| Greg Rodgers (Joechristmas)
Junior Member Username: Joechristmas Post Number: 241 Registered: 3-2001 |
Ok, I thought I would ask and see if anyone has any tips on improving a 308s A/C. We all know how restrictive the vents etc. I am still using R-12. I removed the vents and that helped move a lot of air but it doesn't get up to my face though. I have heard that changing the expansion valve and trying a larger drier(not sure how on this one) has helped. What do you guys think? To me it seems it is because of the vents. I don't want to make it too cold at the vents as I don't want to freeze the evaporator but I would like to improve the efficiency. Any ideas on this? |