| Author |
Message |
Richelson (Richelson)
Member
Username: Richelson
Post Number: 783
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, August 03, 2002 - 12:16 pm: | |
I am glad to hear that it worked well for you. It isn't easy to put in the exact amount without the proper equipment. That is what I meant by not as forgiving. The amount needs to be much closer to what the car requires with 134a for it to work effectively. I can't really comment on the blends as I haven't used many of them. I know there are many out there such as Freeze 12 and Autofrost. |
Christian (Christiank)
Member
Username: Christiank
Post Number: 378
Registered: 1-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, August 03, 2002 - 11:12 am: | |
Richelson:
As I said it blows ice cold. I drove 50 miles to a guy who did a great job on a A/C installation in my Jeep last year the same this time. I haven't tried it myself but maybe its not as easy as you guys think. |
Richelson (Richelson)
Member
Username: Richelson
Post Number: 781
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, August 03, 2002 - 8:54 am: | |
I have yet to see a 134a conversion that works as efficiently as R-12. Every conversion seems to be ok when air is moving through the condensor but at idle IMO it does very little. The new cars built for 134a work fine. R-12 is also more forgiving when charging a system. However with all of this said R-12 is still around $40 per 12oz. can and 134a is $4.50 at Walmart. Has anyone used the leak detectors that use a diode probe? I have been chasing a leak on another car I own and want to find a good way to do it. |
Christian (Christiank)
Member
Username: Christiank
Post Number: 376
Registered: 1-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, August 03, 2002 - 12:30 am: | |
I had my Ferari recharged with R12. Didn't like the result and cost a lot of money. Then I went to a specialist for R12 to R134a conversions. Cost was about USD 250 and the result was amazing. Ice cold air. Forget R12!!! |
Steve (Steve)
Junior Member
Username: Steve
Post Number: 180
Registered: 2-2001
| | Posted on Friday, August 02, 2002 - 8:19 pm: | |
I got tired of playing the R12 game on the 308 and also on my wife's 89 volvo 740. So even though I have about 20lbs. of R12 left I've gone the conversion route and think it works great. I did a oil change and new receiver /dryer plus added a can of COLD SHOT and both cars blow around 40 degrees out of the ducts. Also you need a licence in NY to get R12 plus you need a reclaim system in order to buy it. Just another scam to get your $'s. Just fill the system to about 80% of the R12 capacity and you're done. Simple to do. |
Horsefly (Arlie)
Junior Member
Username: Arlie
Post Number: 116
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Friday, August 02, 2002 - 3:04 pm: | |
I think that the R12 to R134 to R whatever is just another scam to make someone more money. It's like standard tools to metric tools to torx head tools to allen head tools to whatever. One doesn't need to continuously change formats, unless someone wants to continuously make more money selling the different tools, fittings, systems, etc that the new format requires. Those stupid torx head bolts are my favorite pet peeve. Standard hex head screws did the job just fine for a hundred years, but some idiot decided that everybody NEEDED to spend big bucks on a new type of fastener socket. What next, screw head slots shaped like Mickey Mouse ears? Give me a break. |
Richelson (Richelson)
Member
Username: Richelson
Post Number: 776
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Friday, August 02, 2002 - 2:09 pm: | |
I use R-12 and highly recommend it. On cars that were built with/for 134a they work effectively but most of the conversion are never as efficient as they were with original R-12 IMHO. |
Bruno (Originalsinner)
Member
Username: Originalsinner
Post Number: 325
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Friday, August 02, 2002 - 1:27 pm: | |
All refrigerant must be reclaimed due to "blanket" epa law from congress.
R-12 is banned from USA production. The cost to make r-12 is still about 5$ per 30 .lb can. Everything over 25$ per can was federal tax. Go buy can tomorrow for $900.0+ and the tax is $875+.
There is nothing wrong with r134 other than it does cost about twice as much as r12 to produce.r-22 would work in car if the condensers could handle the extra heat and pressure 400 psi+. They cannot.There use to be 5 main refrigerants. There are now over 50 blends. There is another refrigerant that is suppose to be r-12 compressor friendlly but you must change tx valve ,drier,oil.The difference is in the type of oils used.mineral,synthetic,ester etc. If you can get R-12 stay there. I will be posting temp/pressure chart to show the difference between r-12 and r134 at various temperatures. |
Edward Gault (Irfgt)
Intermediate Member
Username: Irfgt
Post Number: 1699
Registered: 2-2001
| | Posted on Friday, August 02, 2002 - 10:43 am: | |
They are already working on a replacement for R-134A since they have decided that it is toxic too. I think all the fuss was due to the patent running out on R-12. If 134 is safe then why do we have to recycle it. Makes you wonder which Lobby/Corp. handled that debacle. |
Greg Rodgers (Joechristmas)
Member
Username: Joechristmas
Post Number: 419
Registered: 3-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, August 01, 2002 - 8:30 pm: | |
I agree with Rob. If you can get R-12 by all means stay with it. 40 deg. at the vents is great. Is that moving or at idle? |
Bruno (Originalsinner)
Member
Username: Originalsinner
Post Number: 323
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, August 01, 2002 - 7:20 pm: | |
r134 will work and yes r12 has a lower evaporator temperature. If you have access to r12 use it. If not convert. |
Robert W. Garven Jr. (Robertgarven)
Junior Member
Username: Robertgarven
Post Number: 66
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, August 01, 2002 - 3:12 pm: | |
Daren,
I am not an expert but recently took an auto AC class (received an A) at my local college. here is my observations. I wanted to keep my car stock. R12 produces cooler temps. My car on a hot day the vents cranking out 40 degrees is still not able to cool the car, because the large greenhouse, small output oem fan and vents only on dash. R134 wopuld even be less. R134 compressors run at higher pressures also, which may comprimise older hoses. It also runs a different refrigerant oil which is not compatable with the R12. I vacuumed out the system changed my drier (TedR) and o-rings and refilled R12. It is still being made about in every country but the US. will always be as available as a 308 distributor cap and I think I paid 125 for the 2 kilos or what ever the system held. These cars were made when the stuff was cheap and the compressors leak a little normally. They were meant to be recharged every year or so. With all the money I have recently spent on the car this seems a little price for less hassle and cooler temps. As an enviromentalist I have all but given up trying to save the world, hoping it will send us the way of the dinosaurs when it has had enough SUV's and greenhouse gases. Im my little world the Ferrari comes first everything else second :-)
Rob |
Daren L Adkins (Schumi)
New member
Username: Schumi
Post Number: 38
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, August 01, 2002 - 2:59 pm: | |
No, a garage here locally is going to do it - if everyone thinks its a good idea. Still haven't heard any down side - and there is ALWAYS a down side. |
Stanley DiGuiseppi (Standig)
New member
Username: Standig
Post Number: 34
Registered: 5-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, August 01, 2002 - 2:48 pm: | |
Daren
When you have your system converted have them put a flourecent dye in the system. It will make it easier to find the leak.
Are you looking to do the conversion yourself?
Stan |
Eric Eiland (Eric308gtsiqv)
Member
Username: Eric308gtsiqv
Post Number: 349
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, August 01, 2002 - 12:32 pm: | |
Daren...I had mine converted recently on the 308 when it went in for 30k service. Can't recall the $$$ figure, but it wasn't much at all. I can check the paperwork tonight if you'd like for a more exact amount. And, yes, they did replace the compressor oil, but I'm not sure if they changed the "type" of oil. Not aware of any down sides, but it sure does blow ice cold now! The savings in the long run over the cost of R12 vs. R134 made the switch-over worth it; and, since they had all the belts, etc. removed anyhow, it wasn't that big of a deal to retrofit. |
George Daina (Oof_n_goof)
New member
Username: Oof_n_goof
Post Number: 7
Registered: 7-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, August 01, 2002 - 12:21 pm: | |
yea...u will pay a kings ransom for R12, if you can find any...and besides, be a good guy, save the environment, switch. Conversion is a walk in the park....any competent A/C guy can do it....should cost you around a 50 dollar bill...but then u are driving a Ferrari....and the cash register starts to jump, and the proprietor is making travel plans to Fiji when they see u, me, the rest of us pull up.
|
Daren L Adkins (Schumi)
New member
Username: Schumi
Post Number: 37
Registered: 6-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, August 01, 2002 - 11:42 am: | |
Should I convert my 82 400i to R134? What are the down sides? Do I need to change the oil type in the compressor? Help - its hot here. |