| Author | Message | ||
| Mike B (Srt_mike)
Junior Member Username: Srt_mike Post Number: 101 Registered: 12-2002 |
I agree the M1A1 is far superior, but in terms of "kill ability" a T-80 is nothing to sneeze at. It's not like an M1 commander wouldn't be dropping a load if he saw a few T-80's coming his way. As for the AK, it is a formidable weapon and I would say in close quarters it is superior in many ways. Bear in mind that most firefights are within 500 feet or so. The stopping power of the M16 is not as good as some other weapons. That "NATO" ammunition kills it. | ||
| Nebula Class (Nebulaclass)
Member Username: Nebulaclass Post Number: 324 Registered: 11-2002 |
Mike - While the T-80 may be a little faster, there are fundamental differences between it and the M1-A1 Abrhams that make the M1 a FAR superior piece of equipment. Aside form tech and armor, the biggest, and most important, difference is this: The US Military puts a barrel on the M1 that can sustain 600 - 800 fired rounds before it is useless. The T-72's and the T-80's use a barrel good for about 100 shots. Costs a lot less to build, but it kill the ability to effectively train in the tanks. When US M1's hit the field, the tank teams driving them have had months mof live-firing excercise training, whereas Russian and Iraqi troops have about 1/6th the live-fire training. Where US tank teams fire about 100 - 150 live fire training rounds, the T-80s crews only get about 15 - 20 of them....this is too preserve the barrel life. The difference? The US M1's are commanded by a much more effective team of soldiers, and that's what gives them the edge in the field. | ||
| arthur chambers (Art355)
Intermediate Member Username: Art355 Post Number: 1223 Registered: 6-2001 |
Dave: Good answer, but where is the web site? Art | ||
| martin J weiner,M.D. (Mw360)
Member Username: Mw360 Post Number: 845 Registered: 5-2001 |
Matt, Get in your 307.5-head north and come here to Portland to visit.I'll put you on the couch-we'll have some talk therapy,maybe spoon again and you'll be all recovered from whatever funk is ailing you. Remember anger is always secondary to underlying fear! Love you,guy! | ||
| "The Don" (Mlemus)
Advanced Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 3625 Registered: 8-2002 |
Mike, "The AK47 is also in many ways the equal of the M-16... although it depends a lot on rounds used. " AK-47's have far more recoil and are very inaccutate from a distance. They are equal in close quarters but after that the m-16 is a far better weapon. Matt | ||
| Mike B (Srt_mike)
Junior Member Username: Srt_mike Post Number: 98 Registered: 12-2002 |
A few things to add.. First, re: the Iraqi Air Force... their MiG 29's are not to be sneezed at. The MiG-29 is a similar role fighter to the US F-15, and actually the MiG surpasses the F-15 in some ways. From what I know, the F-15 is superior at distance because it has better avionics and it's long-range weapons can take out a MiG-29 before they ever meet... but, once the range difference is nullified, the MiG is the superior performer. Similarly, don't underestimate the Iraqi armor. The T-80 has a higher speed than the M1 Abrams and, depending on ordnance, can match the M1's range under certain circumstances (although not most). The AK47 is also in many ways the equal of the M-16... although it depends a lot on rounds used. The bottom line is that the Iraqi military is not a retarded force. They have *some* capable equipment. That we beat them so handily in round 1 is a testament to the overwhelming tactics and combined technology we employ. A MiG-29 might be able to outgun an F-15, but it can't when you have an AWACS in the air that gets a bead on the MiG well in advance of when the MiG gets a beat on the F-15. This is not a walk in the park... this is a tough fight and we're doing an amazingly good job! P.S. Dave, that chick is so hot! At first, I feared the horns. Then I realized they would be great for breaking the ice at parties (literally and figuratively), and it's something to hold on to! | ||
| William H (Countachxx)
Intermediate Member Username: Countachxx Post Number: 2194 Registered: 2-2001 |
more than a few have become heaps of rubble. Dont you like the way the Iraqi information Minister tells his people that "US troops were defeated at the coast, then they were defeated down South, then they were defeated a little further North. Now they are defeated at the Airport outside Baghdad" If they were defeated at the coast , what The H were they doing at the airport outside Baghdad ?!?!?!  LOL | ||
| "The Don" (Mlemus)
Advanced Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 3580 Registered: 8-2002 |
YAWN | ||
| MFZ (Kiyoharu)
Junior Member Username: Kiyoharu Post Number: 195 Registered: 2-2003 |
Thank you Mr Dunham, I hope the info I provided has enlightened you a bit. As for Matt, for a grown-up, he sure acts a lot more childish than me. I put the issue to rest once I saw he edited his earlier post to correct the spelling, and did not respond to his constant if not childish taunts. I have said it before, if you want a civil discussion, I am there. | ||
| Dave (Maranelloman)
Member Username: Maranelloman Post Number: 990 Registered: 1-2002 |
Art, the French sell me mine, despite UN embargoes & sanctions! And just for you:  | ||
| Mike Procopio (Pupz308)
Junior Member Username: Pupz308 Post Number: 246 Registered: 10-2002 |
I hear ya, Matt. You needing an F-car drive is like somebody needing a cigarette, and Wayne's P-car is Nicorette gum. Go get that puppy! | ||
| L. Wayne Ausbrooks (Lwausbrooks)
Intermediate Member Username: Lwausbrooks Post Number: 1314 Registered: 8-2002 |
Matt, get your ass over here, pick up the P-car, and go drive the holy f*ck out of it. | ||
| "The Don" (Mlemus)
Advanced Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 3579 Registered: 8-2002 |
Mike, I have been in some wierd sorta funk. I need to drive the f-car on a long drive soon. | ||
| Mike Procopio (Pupz308)
Junior Member Username: Pupz308 Post Number: 245 Registered: 10-2002 |
Matt, You know you rock and I think you're awesome, but are you on your period? Do you need to join TimN88 for a day in nursery school? Maybe you didn't have your nap today, hmmmmm?? | ||
| arthur chambers (Art355)
Intermediate Member Username: Art355 Post Number: 1203 Registered: 6-2001 |
Matt: Where do you get those little clips? Both you and Dave seem to have an endless supply. Art | ||
| djmonk (Davem)
Junior Member Username: Davem Post Number: 215 Registered: 1-2002 |
Half of thier AF was destroyed in 91. They have estimated say 300 left, 100 of which delivered to Iran for safekeeping. They are still there. They have 3 diffrent fighters. The french (boo, hiss) Mirage an MIG-21's an 29's. Most of these are in poor repair with scant spares to go around. The pilots are not well trained either supposedly. Most are hidden so well that they can't be readily put into service, on top of that these are old less sophisticated jets that cant match ours. Maybe one theory is that in a last ditch effort at the close of war they might take to the skies, perhaps in a suicide mission which it would be as they would be picked up quickly. | ||
| Nebula Class (Nebulaclass)
Member Username: Nebulaclass Post Number: 318 Registered: 11-2002 |
I f*ckin' love this place. | ||
| "The Don" (Mlemus)
Advanced Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 3567 Registered: 8-2002 |
I am sorry Jere as well  | ||
| Jere Dunham (Questioner)
Member Username: Questioner Post Number: 274 Registered: 1-2003 |
Maybe Matt has been here longer than that but look to your left at his Register date and it will read 8-2002, just as Des does. If the registration date is wrong, it is not my fault. And Matt, all I was asking was for ya'll to cool down a little. It was getting pretty heated and there really is no call for it. I am on your side. I do not like what MYZ or MFZ or XYZ, whatever, was saying in regards to the US and our policies. However, he did answer my question in a civil way and I appreciated that. If he had come back differently and made some slam against me or the US I probably would have reacted differently. I only entered the part about the postings to inject a little levity into the exchange, not to rile you. I want to apologize to you if I came across wrong on that part. Sometimes, my type of humor is taken wrong and for that I am sorry. Now, back to your corners, when the bell rings come to the center of the ring and begin. No hits below the belt, no kidney punches, no clinching and when the referee says to break,,break!! | ||
| "The Don" (Mlemus)
Advanced Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 3562 Registered: 8-2002 |
Arlie, LMAO O.k. I have calmed down. Jere, no problems here. Matt | ||
| Horsefly (Arlie)
Member Username: Arlie Post Number: 933 Registered: 5-2002 |
The Iraqi jets all ran out of coal. | ||
| "The Don" (Mlemus)
Advanced Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 3560 Registered: 8-2002 |
Jere, when YOU know what you are talking about, we can discuss it. Until then.... | ||
| "The Don" (Mlemus)
Advanced Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 3559 Registered: 8-2002 |
Jere, f-off | ||
| Pat Pasqualini (Enzo)
Member Username: Enzo Post Number: 378 Registered: 2-2002 |
Jere- Matt has been here alot longer than that. I think it is around 2001 am I right Matt? | ||
| Jere Dunham (Questioner)
Member Username: Questioner Post Number: 272 Registered: 1-2003 |
Oh, and Matt. Did you know that you and Des have been registered here for the same length of time and you have posted 10% more than he has. Wow, 3100 posts for him and 3558 posts for you. You definitely lead by 448 posts in the same length of time. Are your fingers getting tired yet?? | ||
| Jere Dunham (Questioner)
Member Username: Questioner Post Number: 271 Registered: 1-2003 |
Ah come on guys. I asked a simple question and all the bandwidth is being wasted on useless namecalling and back and forth drivel. Anywhere that MFZ responds, whether in a meaningful way or in the way he has in the past with anti-US stuff, he gets blasted the same way. Matt, stop wasting your breath and time on this useless stuff. Give it a rest. MFZ, lay off. Let's take this back to a civil tone. I mean you are beginning to sound like a bunch of 2nd graders here (my old man can lick your old man. Cannot and your momma wears combat boots). Makes just about that much sense. I have now seen this bantering on about four or five different topics. It just so happens that MFZ answered my question about the bodies of Iraqis killed in action. I did not know how it was handled traditionally and he informed me. I appreciate his answer and taking the time to let me in on something I did not know. Why attack him for that and start provoking more dissension?? No, I do not agree with many of his previous posts but I want to thank him for giving me an answer on this one that sounds genuine. Rant off, gotta get back to work. | ||
| Tillman Strahan (Tillman)
Member Username: Tillman Post Number: 499 Registered: 11-2001 |
I call BS. I don't like MFZ, but I saw the same spelling he did. | ||
| "The Don" (Mlemus)
Advanced Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 3558 Registered: 8-2002 |
still showing your stupidity | ||
| MFZ (Kiyoharu)
Junior Member Username: Kiyoharu Post Number: 192 Registered: 2-2003 |
Edit button, I presume. | ||
| "The Don" (Mlemus)
Advanced Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 3557 Registered: 8-2002 |
You must be crossed eyed...... Let your dim light shine! | ||
| MFZ (Kiyoharu)
Junior Member Username: Kiyoharu Post Number: 191 Registered: 2-2003 |
"And you spelled it the same way I did....... Ya... you sound really smart about now." You = Patronas Me = Petronas (PETROliam NASional) But who cares, right? | ||
| "The Don" (Mlemus)
Advanced Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 3555 Registered: 8-2002 |
Yes, it's WAY past your bed time little camper. | ||
| Jim Schad (Jim_schad)
Member Username: Jim_schad Post Number: 929 Registered: 7-2002 |
MFZ: isn't it 2 or 3am where you are? Go to sleep. | ||
| "The Don" (Mlemus)
Advanced Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 3553 Registered: 8-2002 |
And you spelled it the same way I did....... Ya... you sound really smart about now. | ||
| Nebula Class (Nebulaclass)
Member Username: Nebulaclass Post Number: 315 Registered: 11-2002 |
Yeah Don (LMAO at calling you Don)! Take that, you stupid non-petronas spelling idiot! Yeah! Go MFZ! You are GOOD! | ||
| "The Don" (Mlemus)
Advanced Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 3552 Registered: 8-2002 |
And it's petrol what where you saying about sounding stupid? | ||
| "The Don" (Mlemus)
Advanced Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 3549 Registered: 8-2002 |
No, you just sound stupid. and my name is Matt | ||
| MFZ (Kiyoharu)
Junior Member Username: Kiyoharu Post Number: 189 Registered: 2-2003 |
Unlike you Don, I try not to sound both funny and stupid at the same time. At least learn to spell Petronas properly. Oh, I forgot, you call it 'gasoline' there. | ||
| "The Don" (Mlemus)
Advanced Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 3547 Registered: 8-2002 |
Oh and MFZ, The jets are in the same place your head is...... | ||
| "The Don" (Mlemus)
Advanced Member Username: Mlemus Post Number: 3546 Registered: 8-2002 |
MFZ, No anti-US babble? You had the perfect shot! Or are you waiting for another nut job like yourself to fly a plane in to the petronas towers? | ||
| MFZ (Kiyoharu)
Junior Member Username: Kiyoharu Post Number: 182 Registered: 2-2003 |
There was footage that showed coalition bombers bombing the hangars of the jets you mentioned above using precision guided bombs, maybe that's the answer. I read somewhere (Fox news I think) that the US troops are trained to bury killed enemy soldiers somewhat properly (head pointings towards Mecca, in Saudi Arabia). A small fact probably not known to many. Muslims who died a natural death is bathed, wrapped in white piece of cloth, is prayed by his peers and then buried with head pointing towards Mecca. Muslims who died in a war is buried without any preparations (meaning they get buried in the clothes that they got killed in, blood and all) as a mark of martyrdom. They skip the bath and the wrapping in white cloth and just go straight to the prayer and actual burial. At least that's what I found out in my readings. | ||
| Jim Schad (Jim_schad)
Member Username: Jim_schad Post Number: 925 Registered: 7-2002 |
Military "expert" in Dallas said he thinks the Iraqi jets aren't up because for one they are not very skilled/trained and secondly it would be very embarassing if they took off, turned left and went to Iran to defect. | ||
| Jere Dunham (Questioner)
Member Username: Questioner Post Number: 268 Registered: 1-2003 |
I heard it said in an interview with an American general yesterday that Iraq has 300 Migs. If the coalition controls all the airstrips in Iraq except Baghdad and they are attacking it now, where are these migs?? I know they would be taken out quickly if they did come out to play but just wonder if their pilots are smart enough not to try to engage. Also, I should know this being ex-military but I will admit I do not know the answer. As the coalition is advancing and overrunning Iraqi positions, what are we doing with the bodies of the Iraqis who are killed by coalition soldiers? Do we take them to a field morgue somewhere, bury them where they are, leave them or what? I really do not know and am very curios. I am sure the families of these Iraqi soldiers who die would probably want their bodies back for proper burial in their own traditions. I am just full of questions today. |