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  #1  
Old 11-03-2012, 03:19 PM
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Ferrari F70 (LaFerrari) vs Mclaren P1 vs Porsche 918

Who do you think comes out on top?

Bonus video p1 opening doors
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  #2  
Old 11-03-2012, 03:40 PM
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With all due respect "which comes out top", according to who? Some faceless motoring journalist or according to a game of which has the highest and best figures? Its a senseless comparison in my opinion, each will give its owner/driver driving pleasure.

Me, I like Ferrari so the Enzo replacement would be my choice, does that make the other two bad, definately not. Its so subjective.

I have said many times, these cars arent defined by figures, the 288GTO is slow in todays terms, yet when I walk up to one I get goosebumps, when I stand next to an F40 I feel a unique thrill.
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Old 11-03-2012, 03:59 PM
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Originally Posted by fmanny View Post
Who do you think comes out on top?

Bonus video p1 opening doors
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IB_ss80isRo
Why all the secrecy with the black cloth?
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Old 11-03-2012, 04:20 PM
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Why all the secrecy with the black cloth?
Maybe the prototype still has not a finished interior. That would explain the blacked windows too.
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Old 11-03-2012, 05:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fmanny View Post
Who do you think comes out on top?

Bonus video p1 opening doors
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IB_ss80isRo
Thanks for the Video, I think they will all be great cars in their own right, to each their own. I love the P1, but I have a feeling the F70 will be the most stunning in the looks department all though the P1 might be faster around a racetrack.
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  #6  
Old 11-03-2012, 06:31 PM
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Until there is a finished product it's all talk and even then numbers on paper don't always tell the story the bull**** stops when the flag drops
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  #7  
Old 11-03-2012, 06:44 PM
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We must all have too much time on our hands.
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  #8  
Old 11-03-2012, 09:45 PM
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None. Give me the F-40, Mclaren F1 and 959 and we'll have a real race.
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Old 11-03-2012, 10:09 PM
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Originally Posted by DeSoto View Post
Maybe the prototype still has not a finished interior. That would explain the blacked windows too.
The opposite in fact - the interior of P1 is already finished and was present inside the car unveiled at Paris, but McLaren were not ready to show it publicly yet. They also blanked off openings around the car, including the massive outlet in the rear to keep prying eyes from seeing what's underneath. A few people who have been privileged to see the P1s at the McLaren factory have been invited to see what's inside.

>8^)
ER
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  #10  
Old 11-04-2012, 01:41 AM
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It's exactly what you expect from the outside, inside. Very futuristic, iRobot style. Kers red buttons on the f1 shaped steering wheel, loads of carbon.

Really don't know why they didn't show it. Typical McLaren get as much exposure over the longest time possible with one product.
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  #11  
Old 11-04-2012, 11:51 AM
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I still can't grasp on the realization that all three of these hypercars are hybrids. As car enthusiasts, I thought we don't take kindly to new age advancemnts involving more emission restrictions, more driver driver aiding technology, and less of the true car driving experience. They are all beautiful, mega powerful cars that many of us can only dream of owning, but in reality...I'd think the F1, Enzo, and Carrera GT provide a much more authentic driving feel vs the mega hp batteries cars of today and the future. Please share your thoughts on this, I am afterall only 13 with little knowlegde on any of these vehicles I've mentioned (in the behind the wheel sense).....just my 2 cents though.

Parker
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  #12  
Old 11-04-2012, 03:41 PM
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The F70 will undoubtedly come out on top if we are talking about popularity and, most likely, sheer 'awe' factor.

The CGT never attained anything close to the popularity of the Enzo, in both sales and number of posters hanging on teenage walls.

If you are talking performance...I dunno....doesnt matter to me as they are all so incredibly close to each other its very much splitting hairs.
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Old 11-05-2012, 10:06 AM
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I still can't grasp on the realization that all three of these hypercars are hybrids. As car enthusiasts, I thought we don't take kindly to new age advancements involving more emission restrictions, more driver driver aiding technology, and less of the true car driving experience. They are all beautiful, mega powerful cars that many of us can only dream of owning, but in reality...I'd think the F1, Enzo, and Carrera GT provide a much more authentic driving feel vs the mega hp batteries cars of today and the future. Please share your thoughts on this, I am afterall only 13 with little knowlegde on any of these vehicles I've mentioned (in the behind the wheel sense).....just my 2 cents though.

Parker
Youth..

Parker my Friend.

As Dr. Seuss said: "The places you'll go the thing's you'll see..."

What you must guard against is forming opinions by reading about things as opposed to experiencing them first hand.

KERS is fantastic and has changed everything.

Taking the 918 first. It has massive battery life and can run an entire lap of the Ring electrically which gives it an 85 MPH result. That's one reason it's so heavy. Not to worry a MUCH lighter version is coming soon and it will be wicked fast.

KERS allows you to turn design on it's head. Take the P1. It will make more HP from a touch more than half the displacement of the New Enzo lump by using HUGE turbo's. Huge Turbo's have a lot of lag but with KERS you can use KERS torque to fill in the Turbo lag gap and the combined power will be beyond belief especially as P1 will weigh a lot less than a new Enzo. I saw and sat in P1 and spent a lot of time talking to their engineers. No hypercar existent will be able to stay with it around a race track. It's much smaller than an MP12 and is designed to make massive downforce which can be bleed off by the driver with DRS.

Both the 918 and P1 can be raced, The new Enzo because of it's fuel inefficient engine can't and racing with KERS is amazing. We developed a computer program that can map a road course and apply KERS using GPS triggers exactly where it is needed (Coming out of turns before the Petrol engine can make torque, adding instant torque for the 4 second gap). We're working with The FIA to develop KERS Sportcar regulations for 2013 and 2014 and the FIA is also merging GT3 and GTE as Grand AM is merging ALMS and Grand AM. The one IMO that will have trouble will be the WEC as LMP1 will likely be only LARGE manufactures such as Audi/Toyota and Porsche. WEC will restrict KERS a lot more than FIA EXP Hybrid.

The new Enzo looks interesting and it will be interesting to see how it uses it's KERS. A big part is the way drivers control it. In the system we developed the GPS Triggers allow a driver to bring it on at the most efficient places for the most efficient time simply by using the gas pedal and no other controls. If it's button operated it becomes NOS like "Push to pass Boost" and isn't as easy to use.
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Last edited by Napolis; 11-05-2012 at 10:26 AM.
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  #14  
Old 11-05-2012, 11:00 AM
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supercars are not track cars.

Ferrari has a track car FXX...i think a 918 spyder is faaar farr behind a fxx.. P1 may be close behind/front...

I think all 3 makers are playing different games. Ferrari stil plays clasic Supercar game.............
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  #15  
Old 11-05-2012, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Napolis View Post
Youth..

Parker my Friend.

As Dr. Seuss said: "The places you'll go the thing's you'll see..."

What you must guard against is forming opinions by reading about things as opposed to experiencing them first hand.

KERS is fantastic and has changed everything.

Taking the 918 first. It has massive battery life and can run an entire lap of the Ring electrically which gives it an 85 MPH result. That's one reason it's so heavy. Not to worry a MUCH lighter version is coming soon and it will be wicked fast.

KERS allows you to turn design on it's head. Take the P1. It will make more HP from a touch more than half the displacement of the New Enzo lump by using HUGE turbo's. Huge Turbo's have a lot of lag but with KERS you can use KERS torque to fill in the Turbo lag gap and the combined power will be beyond belief especially as P1 will weigh a lot less than a new Enzo. I saw and sat in P1 and spent a lot of time talking to their engineers. No hypercar existent will be able to stay with it around a race track. It's much smaller than an MP12 and is designed to make massive downforce which can be bleed off by the driver with DRS.

Both the 918 and P1 can be raced, The new Enzo because of it's fuel inefficient engine can't and racing with KERS is amazing. We developed a computer program that can map a road course and apply KERS using GPS triggers exactly where it is needed (Coming out of turns before the Petrol engine can make torque, adding instant torque for the 4 second gap). We're working with The FIA to develop KERS Sportcar regulations for 2013 and 2014 and the FIA is also merging GT3 and GTE as Grand AM is merging ALMS and Grand AM. The one IMO that will have trouble will be the WEC as LMP1 will likely be only LARGE manufactures such as Audi/Toyota and Porsche. WEC will restrict KERS a lot more than FIA EXP Hybrid.

The new Enzo looks interesting and it will be interesting to see how it uses it's KERS. A big part is the way drivers control it. In the system we developed the GPS Triggers allow a driver to bring it on at the most efficient places for the most efficient time simply by using the gas pedal and no other controls. If it's button operated it becomes NOS like "Push to pass Boost" and isn't as easy to use.
Napolis . . . trying to get a handle on the "feel" of KERS . . . .

I have driven a Tesla. Was interesting at how consistent the acceleration was--no episodes of greater or lesser acceleration on the torque curve. Also, when I let off the accelerator pedal, no engine braking (though it did slow down--felt like this was induced and not natural).

Using KERS, does it "even out" the acceleration, making it more Tesla-like, or does it just accentuate the internal combustion acceleration with uneven periods?
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  #16  
Old 11-05-2012, 12:17 PM
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Napolis . . . trying to get a handle on the "feel" of KERS . . . .

I have driven a Tesla. Was interesting at how consistent the acceleration was--no episodes of greater or lesser acceleration on the torque curve. Also, when I let off the accelerator pedal, no engine braking (though it did slow down--felt like this was induced and not natural).

Using KERS, does it "even out" the acceleration, making it more Tesla-like, or does it just accentuate the internal combustion acceleration with uneven periods?
KERS used the way we've engineered it is seamless. On the Ring we gathered 24 hours of data from three different drivers and found where they used it. They all used it as you'd use it on the street. Coming on the throttle. To bridge the gap before the petrol motor can make Massive torque and once it does to boost that Torque. Our program triggers the KERS at the braking point to regenerate lost kinetic energy and adds it to the foot throttle on the next application at 100% throttle for 4 seconds. Our drivers can also use it manually as they wish but found auto GPS triggering worked great.
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Old 11-05-2012, 02:32 PM
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I can see that programs and data accumulated by Napolis will likely show the massive potential of this technoghy well beyond the mere "green" benefits have may have been its genesis. Jim is truly a pionneer beyond the initial beginnings of his aesthetic designs.

As a racer I am tickled with the possibility of having maximum variable torque the moment I need it, and without the burden of cumbersome additional mass of the cubic inches normally necessary to produce it. I imagine it could give a racer superman like racing powers of strength and agility. Racing is all about managing these forces and when you can put maximum torque down. For light high revving engines like those made by Ferrari, this is an amazing advantage. I can imagine the nimble flexibility and high revinv engine of a Ferrari engine with the massive torque from of a Corvette! All this is brilliant especially when paired with a highly sophisticated variable tranction control.

What seemed to many as a forced and green gimmicky techno, may really turn out to me a completely new dimention in racing machines. Who would have guest that the word Hybrid may soon be the ulitkmate in racing spec?


Napolis, you remind me of a mix between Jim Clark, and Count Volpe in 1962. You are on your way to creating a legend with cars that keep amazing people in more and more legitimate ways. Bravo!
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  #18  
Old 11-05-2012, 03:05 PM
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I can see that programs and data accumulated by Napolis will likely show the massive potential of this technoghy well beyond the mere "green" benefits have may have been its genesis. Jim is truly a pionneer beyond the initial beginnings of his aesthetic designs.

As a racer I am tickled with the possibility of having maximum variable torque the moment I need it, and without the burden of cumbersome additional mass of the cubic inches normally necessary to produce it. I imagine it could give a racer superman like racing powers of strength and agility. Racing is all about managing these forces and when you can put maximum torque down. For light high revving engines like those made by Ferrari, this is an amazing advantage. I can imagine the nimble flexibility and high revinv engine of a Ferrari engine with the massive torque from of a Corvette! All this is brilliant especially when paired with a highly sophisticated variable tranction control.

What seemed to many as a forced and green gimmicky techno, may really turn out to me a completely new dimention in racing machines. Who would have guest that the word Hybrid may soon be the ulitkmate in racing spec?


Napolis, you remind me of a mix between Jim Clark, and Count Volpe in 1962. You are on your way to creating a legend with cars that keep amazing people in more and more legitimate ways. Bravo!


KERS works very well with high revving Ferrari motors. Our 4.5 Liter Ferrari based engine revs to 9K but it's torque curve is not Corvette like. With KERS it is. Using KERS to fill in Torque is an amazing thing to feel. On a race lap at the Ring we recapture 50 seconds of KERS (50KW) every 8:15 second lap just from braking. We also increase MPG by 10% which is huge in that it enables us to run 10 liters less fuel per stint which is a big weight saving.
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Old 11-05-2012, 03:24 PM
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KERS works very well with high revving Ferrari motors. Our 4.5 Liter Ferrari based engine revs to 9K but it's torque curve is not Corvette like. With KERS it is. Using KERS to fill in Torque is an amazing thing to feel. On a race lap at the Ring we recapture 50 seconds of KERS (50KW) every 8:15 second lap just from braking. We also increase MPG by 10% which is huge in that it enables us to run 10 liters less fuel per stint which is a big weight saving.
So is your "new car" quick and efficient enough for the Manthey 911 or as quick as the Farnbacher 458 was?
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Old 11-05-2012, 03:25 PM
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auto GPS triggering worked great.
Holy crap! That sounds like the Star Trek Enterprise.

The auto GPS . . . is it that precise to 'come on' consistently when needed? That is an amazing concept.
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