Ferrari 308 2v engine mods

Welcome..

The 2V can achieve ~320Hp at the crank. Keep in mind though it'll be a very peaky TQ curve, as in power will be from 5k to 8k rpm. Carb'd would be the easier route to go and probably a bit less expensive, EFI would be required to reach 300+Hp.
High comp pistons, range 10:1 ~ 12:1 depending on cam profile
shim under bucket followers and new springs

You could copy the Le Mans spec engine builds from the 308GT4.

 

IIRC, the bottom end is the same, with the same compression ratio, but much more conservative cam timing to work with the CIS. You are going to have to do a full set of cams, likely a fair amount of porting work, possibly increasing the intake valve size. At the very least, you are going to want to get rid of the old sodium valves.

The required compression increase is probably going to need race gas and as long as you are doing that, you might as well go with a computer controlled ignition, (the dyno guys are going to thank you).

320 horse is probably going to take a larger aluminum radiator and more oil cooling.

Keep us posted, probably half the guys on this forum wished they could "go for it".
Good luck,
chris

 

Yes you can put carbs on the 2V injected engines, need to swap out the injected manifold for the carb one and ofcourse get carbs. The injected cams will not get you the power you're looking for, you'd need P6 or a custom grind.

If you're looking for an early race spec engine I just finished assembly on a 1974 GT4 Le Mans spec one, sadly it is not dry sump though. The heads, cams and carb setup are correct though.

I think the Michelotto Group B rally cars only made ~280 Hp for the 2V and 310Hp for the quattrovalve.

do you have to comply with FIA homologation rules?

 

Look at formula gt in Germany they are getting 340bhp out of 2v motors, but big cam lobes, hc pistons, shim under etc, also very peaky.

 

Michelotto 308 2v Gr.4 had 305 Hp @8000 RPM, 10.5 CR. RPM useful range: 3500-8300. Kugelfischer fuel injection. This 35 years ago: with updated low losses pistons, better aluminum Nickasil slivers with 82 mm bore (2999 cm3), DLC camshafts, better ignition, I would say 320-330 Hp is possible and not too difficult even with standard downdraft 40 mm Weber carbs

ciao

 

Hej Pete, the 2V heads don't flow well and there are a few good threads on this subject. My brother in law in Göteborg has a flow bench and does heads if you want them ported and optimized. CAT cams have some pretty agressive profiles and I'd change the rods as well as pistons, skim block/heads and use Cometic gaskets, balance everything to be sure (incl. crank with pressure plate), programmable ignition if it's allowed. Lycka till!

 

Personally I would not use CAT cams for a spec race engine. I looked into CAT a couple yrs ago and they could not meet our demands. Given the specialized mfg nature of Ferrari camshafts there are 3 grinders that I know of that I would let touch a Ferrari cam and all of them specialize in racing. For most street builds CAT cams would most likely work just fine, for racing and running an engine at near full tilt for long periods of time I'd prefer to have a camshaft that I'm not worried is going to fail.

Ferrari stock rods are really stout, unless one is changing out the bore and stroke significantly the stock rods will do just fine. Definitely replace the pistons for newer though

Unless there is damage I don't recommend skim cutting the block or heads, I know water corrosion can cause pitting, if it's bad enough I recommend having those areas welded up then cut back down but avoid removing any more material then absolutely needed.

 

Scott, which three cam grinders do you recommend?

Pete, CAT does custom grinds and can design profiles to match your specific needs. They use new billets and I was very impressed by the finish of the ones I got. You could talk to Enem or check if Janne at Ellemann Jakobson in Partille is still grinding cams but I suggest you find someone to run some simulations first based on your needs and the limits of the regulations.

 

I'm new here but has a bit of experience building race engines.
I made some alfa nord engines too for histo racing, which has been built
after measuring the internals and run a lot of simulations.Alfa and the 308 2v engines has the same architecture, so they are great comparison. The result was
aprox 100hp/L on them. After the engines built 12:1 compr high lift cams
(catcams ). with weber cars etc the dyno results were very close to the simulations.
1.6L a bit over 160 the 2l over 190... I could check the engines after races with endoscopic
camera and saw bad things..
The problem is that the hemi style combustion chamber is almost the worst ever made, it
is not very efficient nor compact so you cannot push the compr high enough for a race
specs cams needs. so in real life the 100hp/l is possible but will lose power very much
after each use... I can explain it later if interested.
I use catcams many times their parts has great quality, i reached 500hp/l with turbo
engines and 140hp/l on n/a.... sometimes over 10k rpms....
I will use their custom grind on my project too,my plan is to share the project
on this forum too...

 

Elgin and Web, I'm not at liberty to disclose the 3rd, hope you understand.

 

later 4v 308's were group B, it didnt make much more than the gr4 2v cars which were more extensively modified due to having to retain stock plenum and mild modified injection.

if you want a true racer special you need to homologated it with 200 units

 

This setup has been bulletproof on my euro carby 308. The hardest part is getting all new linkage correct and lever arms made properly. Getting manifolds made (if one needs to )and bolting them on is the easy part. Luckily, most of my linkage bits came from Borla (formerly twm)
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And increasing to 3.5 liters.