Blasphemed 308 gets redemption with upcoming F355 heart transplant | FerrariChat

Blasphemed 308 gets redemption with upcoming F355 heart transplant

Discussion in '308/328' started by Cirorsi, May 23, 2017.

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  1. Cirorsi

    Cirorsi Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2016
    790
    Louisiana / Lac du Saint Sacrement, NY
    Full Name:
    Steven
    #1 Cirorsi, May 23, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Although my 1985 308 was a good value, I absolutely hate the GM motor behind my head so I've decided to replace it with a Ferrari engine albeit with a much stouter and aggressive drive train - an F355 engine and gearbox.

    Searching FChat, I've found where Blackhorse Motors did this in 2009 and thought that was one cool mod and one that brings real power to one of the most beautiful cars ever produced. I'm posting not to get kudos but to rather share the process of the mechs and builders who will make the transplant. One notable difference with my mod is that we will not widen the wheel track (will not use the 355 subframe), so I won't be flaring or extending the rear fenders. I wanted the body to remain as a 308.

    I want to thank Vinnie/Nick at VEX here in Baton Rouge for their expert, pre-op surgery on getting that heavy and loud engine out of my car! I will update this post as the build progresses over the summer. Really excited getting this done! Steven
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  2. Ferraridoc

    Ferraridoc F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Jun 20, 2012
    16,057
    Gold Coast, Aust.
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    Patrick
    A good project! Now your poor car can stop taking the anti-rejection drugs for the genetically incompatible heart transplant.
     
  3. cnpapa24

    cnpapa24 F1 Rookie

    Jan 19, 2014
    3,629
    NOLA
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    Chris
    That sounds AWESOME! I hope to see this car in LA at some point. Good luck with the project.
     
  4. Cirorsi

    Cirorsi Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2016
    790
    Louisiana / Lac du Saint Sacrement, NY
    Full Name:
    Steven
    Thanks Chris
     
  5. wildcat326

    wildcat326 Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 10, 2012
    1,777
    Chicago, IL
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    Justin
    I happened to see Carl's 355 transplant in person while shopping for a 308 on a trip to LA. He did it (reluctantly) for a good client by special request, and said it involved a lot of nightmarish re-plumbing, as I recall (forget for what - maybe intake and coolant pipes?). You may want to drop them a line about the re-engineering they did, or even offer to pay their hourly for an hour or two in order to make sure you've done the ancillary re-engineering.

    Cool project!
     
  6. Jdubbya

    Jdubbya The $10 Trillion Man
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 28, 2003
    37,253
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    John
    At least it'll be a Ferrari engine back in there!! Hey by the way ask your shop if they'd like to sell the Cayenne fender guards. I missed a set for sale not long ago. :)
     
  7. 19055

    19055 Formula Junior

    Jul 19, 2014
    493
    Netherlands, Europe
    Full Name:
    Emile
    You are giving your car back it's soul, honoring the car's origin. I'm not really an "all-original" guy, (my 308 handles like a dream with the custom shocks and the big brake's are great) but a Ferrari car should have a Ferrari engine. Any Ferrari engine. A 355 engine in a 308 car ? That means combining the wonderful looks of the 308 body with the best sounding V8 Ferrari ever produced, with real power as icing on the cake. I like it !!
     
  8. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
    11,968
    FRANCE
    Same feeling here. A very interesting project. Please keep us updated.

    Rgds
     
  9. Cirorsi

    Cirorsi Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2016
    790
    Louisiana / Lac du Saint Sacrement, NY
    Full Name:
    Steven
    Good advice, thanks Justin.
     
  10. energy88

    energy88 Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Jan 21, 2012
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    John
    How did the car drive, handle, and accelerate with the GM engine? How much HP? What are your expectations for the 355?
     
  11. hanknum

    hanknum Formula 3

    Nov 1, 2003
    2,050
    Santa Barbara
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    Henry
    Very cool. Good luck and keep us posted.
     
  12. Cirorsi

    Cirorsi Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2016
    790
    Louisiana / Lac du Saint Sacrement, NY
    Full Name:
    Steven
    The GM motor had great power, @ 380 hp just like the 3.5 liter that it's replacing. Two problems that negated the torque transfer however was the extreme axle angle and the somewhat lethargic ZF trans. My stouter and more agreesive comment was a comparison between the 3.5 liter to the stock 2.9 liter engine.
    As for handling, it did well. The chevy engine was loud in the cockpit which drove me nuts. I'm sure magna flow makes a good sounding muffler to help remedy that but I'm looking forward to my Tubi exhaust!
     
  13. Alex308qv

    Alex308qv Formula Junior

    Jul 1, 2016
    378
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    Alex
    "Extreme axle angle"... aha... I was about to ask how the SBC/ZF fit longitudinally within the stock wheelbase. In the 288 GTO, where they placed the V8 longitudinally, the rear wheels were moved back.
     
  14. Crowndog

    Crowndog F1 Veteran
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    Jul 16, 2011
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    Robert
    Interesting project, best of luck. Will be following for updates.
     
  15. Nino1964

    Nino1964 Formula Junior
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    Aug 14, 2015
    285
    North Georgia
  16. Russ Gould

    Russ Gould Formula 3
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    Nov 8, 2004
    1,073
    I just did this (or rather Bob Norwood did it for me) on a 288 GTO rebody car. We used the 355 subframe. It was doable but it involved an awful lot of custom fabrication. We got the car with the rear half of the 308 chassis already cut out (and that's another long and sordid story.) The fuel tanks both had to be modified to make room for the new powertrain. Custom coolant lines. Custom fuel filler. Custom gear shifter and linkage. Custom exhaust. Custom oil cooler and lines. Custom mounts for air cleaners. Custom air intakes. Custom alternator. Custom a/c and heater lines. Custom sensors to work with the 308 gauges and the Motronic ECU. Custom wheels. Rewired the entire back half of the car, converted to Motronic (the later 355 ECUs have some kind of security sensors that really mess up your install, and the early ones have dual ECUs that are a PITA to work with.) It cost a small fortune. Only good news is that once it's done (right) the motor comes out really easily.

    You can't do this with a standard 308 body. The 355 rear wheel track is such that the wheels stick out a mile on each side. Even the wider 288 body requires custom wheels to make it all line up.

    I suppose you can do it without the 355 subframe but I believe that will present a whole list of separate problems, not the least of which the 355 powertrain is mounted longitudinally and has to be right up against the firewall for the axles to line up correctly in the wheel wells and there isn't enough room for a stock exhaust. Also you are "on your own" as far as the halfshafts.
     
  17. Bradley

    Bradley F1 Rookie

    Nov 23, 2006
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    Bradley
    I approve.
     
  18. Cirorsi

    Cirorsi Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2016
    790
    Louisiana / Lac du Saint Sacrement, NY
    Full Name:
    Steven
    Russ, why couldn't you use the oil cooler? air cleaners? - Did you remove the rear trunk or keep it? I suspect I'll have the same shift linkage and of course electrical problems that you faced. Cooling this beast will be a challenge too. Interesting that you used Bob Norwood, I'm using his friend, Tim Taylor at Red Car Restoration for this build.
     
  19. tinterow

    tinterow Formula 3

    Nov 1, 2014
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    Chaya Tinterow
    You saw the light!
     
  20. wildcat326

    wildcat326 Formula 3
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    Dec 10, 2012
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    Justin
    I'm pretty sure it was an enlarged radiator and up-sized coolant plumbing that Carl described for his build. Maybe look into a Nicks Forza aluminum 3.5L unit.
     
  21. Ferraridoc

    Ferraridoc F1 World Champ
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    Jun 20, 2012
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    Patrick
    But apart from that, it was pretty easy? :)
     
  22. Cirorsi

    Cirorsi Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2016
    790
    Louisiana / Lac du Saint Sacrement, NY
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    Steven
    #22 Cirorsi, Jun 25, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Well, so far so good except that I can't use the Tubi muffler, it's too tight of a fit. Surprisingly, I am able to use stock 308 half shafts with no hassle. The shocks will be moved to a more vertical (and natural) position and we'll add a stainless steel cross bar that will go under the air intakes to give lateral strength to the rear end.
    Most fab work has been done to accept the the engine so next week Tim will start hooking everything up. The custom exhaust has been my only disappointment thus far.

    Once I get pics and more info on the Tubi system (HP cats, Y pipe, muffler), I'm going to list it for sale on this site and most likely EBay.

    Steven
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  23. 4right

    4right F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Engine out and engine in in just 4 days. Those guys don't mess around! Looks like a nice fit.
     
  24. Brian A

    Brian A F1 Rookie

    Dec 21, 2012
    3,079
    SanFrancisco BayArea
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    1983 US 308 GTS QV
    Very cool project.

    You're going to have to change the 'Quattrovalvole" badge to a "Cinquevalvole" badge.
     
  25. hyenahf

    hyenahf F1 Rookie

    May 25, 2004
    2,603
    very cool project! ive posted some pics i took of a gts 355 transplant of carls garage in LA some years ago....
     

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