Bradan twin turbo 355 build. - Page 7

**f-man** · #**121** 04-18-2012, 09:12 AM

Can you tell us what is included in the kit? Or these kits...
Engine Twin turbo pkg
Suspension pkg
Big Brake kit

**FDT** · #**122** 04-18-2012, 02:33 PM

My 16 year old son asked me yesterday what car I would buy if I had serious money but not super rich money. I asked him what that meant and he said enough so that you could buy a new 458 but not an Enzo. This actually got me thinking and I realized there trully is not a car out there that excites me a lot more than the 355.......a little nuts I know..........

with this said, If I had it to spend, I really would rather sink money into the 355 to make it a very special ride. Something like having all the suspension and brakes replaced with the latest and greatest, having all the interior replaced with top grade leather, replace the steering wheel with a 360 unit and have the engine totally rebuilt with some serious power, like this Braden build,
then I would have in my opinion a very special and serious ride that I would actually enjoy more than a new 458. Why? because I like shifting my own car, I like a targa roof, I like gauges that are round and do not force me to read a manual to use, I like the sound of a high revving small displacement V8.

I told this to my son who like all 16 year olds like modern styling and tech a bit more than I do and he thought I was just saying that because I have a 355, not because I really think this way.... but I really do.

**sherpa23** · #**123** 04-18-2012, 05:15 PM

I would love to know the condition of the rods when they were taken out of the engine with 90k on the odo. Are they going to be replaced with other titanium rods or more durable steel ones? Not trying to start a debate, I'm just curious.

**Stefan_009** · #**124** 04-26-2012, 08:19 AM

Looking forward to more updates, what an incredible build

**BRADAN** · #**125** 04-26-2012, 08:32 AM

Right now all the engine internals are being reverse engineered. Our game plan for the engine is the following.

-Steel H-beam connecting rods
-9:1 compression forged pistons
-Thicker wrist pins
-Ductile iron sleeves
-Inconel exhaust valve
-Valve springs made 50 lbs stiffer
-Reinforce the cylinder head.
-Higher tensile strength rod bolts, head studs, main cap bolts.

**NeuroBeaker** · #**126** 04-26-2012, 08:48 AM

Just out of curiosity... what will adding a turbo do to the exhaust note of the car, which has long been one of the defining characteristics of the 355? Are you expecting there to be little difference, taking steps to minimise any impact in that regard, or anticipating an alternative aural quality for the car?

All the best,
Andrew.

**BRADAN** · #**127** 04-26-2012, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NeuroBeaker

Just out of curiosity... what will adding a turbo do to the exhaust note of the car, which has long been one of the defining characteristics of the 355? Are you expecting there to be little difference, taking steps to minimise any impact in that regard, or anticipating an alternative aural quality for the car?

All the best,
Andrew.

It should sound like a 355 still with wastegate, blow off valve, and turbos noise. If anything the intake noise is going to be intense.

**NeuroBeaker** · #**128** 04-26-2012, 09:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BRADAN

It should sound like a 355 still with wastegate, blow off valve, and turbos noise. If anything the intake noise is going to be intense.

Neat - if at all possible, it'd be very interesting to get a side-by-side noise comparison of the Braden 355 Turbo with a stock 355.

All the best,
Andrew.

**bobzdar** · #**129** 04-26-2012, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BRADAN

Right now all the engine internals are being reverse engineered. Our game plan for the engine is the following.

-Steel H-beam connecting rods
-9:1 compression forged pistons
-Thicker wrist pins
-Ductile iron sleeves
-Inconel exhaust valve
-Valve springs made 50 lbs stiffer
-Reinforce the cylinder head.
-Higher tensile strength rod bolts, head studs, main cap bolts.

Any reason for the stiffer valve springs? Only reason I ask is that the stockers can handle 9-10k rpm, do you plan to spin it higher? Are you going aftermarket cams or do you plan to widen the lobe separation at all to suit the boosted application? This is definitely an interesting project. Not my cup of tea but I can appreciate the engineering.

**BRADAN** · #**130** 04-26-2012, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobzdar

Any reason for the stiffer valve springs? Only reason I ask is that the stockers can handle 9-10k rpm, do you plan to spin it higher? Are you going aftermarket cams or do you plan to widen the lobe separation at all to suit the boosted application? This is definitely an interesting project. Not my cup of tea but I can appreciate the engineering.

It's not about rpm. The OEM valvetrain is designed to work under vacuum. If we run let's say 20 lbs of boost, the valve springs now have 20 lbs of pressure to work against. So a 50 lb valve spring now just became a 30 lb spring. Decreased spring pressure runs the risk of valve float at higher rpm. We increase spring pressure 50 lbs over factory just to stay safe. The plan is to run 14 lbs of boost on 93 octane and 20-25 on E85.

INTMD8 · #**131** 04-26-2012, 10:37 AM

Boost doesn't have too much to do with needing more valvespring pressure. Approaching IVC, intake manifold pressure and cylinder pressure should be near equalized and as soon as IVC occurs you start the compression cycle.

So, pressures on the intake side effect valvetrain stability to a small degree but where stock valvesprings become a real problem on a turbo motor is EVC. When the exhaust valve tries to close against all of the exhaust backpressure (which on a responsive street based system can typically be 2x intake manifold pressure) it can bounce on the seat causing power to drop dramatically.

As for the cam timing, widening the LSA would likely just reduce horsepower (from the tests I've done). Just like dropping the compression ratio

**ernie** · #**132** 04-26-2012, 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BRADAN

The plan is to run 14 lbs of boost on 93 octane and 20-25 on E85.

I saw a pretty trick setup in a Caddi SVT. They had three different tanks. The regular gas tank, then a custom tank that held E85 in the trunk, and another smaller tank in the spare tire space for methanol.

**bobzdar** · #**133** 04-26-2012, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by INTMD8

Boost doesn't have too much to do with needing more valvespring pressure. Approaching IVC, intake manifold pressure and cylinder pressure should be near equalized and as soon as IVC occurs you start the compression cycle.

So, pressures on the intake side effect valvetrain stability to a small degree but where stock valvesprings become a real problem on a turbo motor is EVC. When the exhaust valve tries to close against all of the exhaust backpressure (which on a responsive street based system can typically be 2x intake manifold pressure) it can bounce on the seat causing power to drop dramatically.

As for the cam timing, widening the LSA would likely just reduce horsepower (from the tests I've done). Just like dropping the compression ratio

Cool, good info. The reason I ask is I thought that overlap wasn't great for boosted motors, and the stock Ferrari valve timing has a pretty tight lobe separation and a decent amount of overlap. Granted, everything I know about boosted applications is on low rpm pushrod v8's so things may work a lot differently.

INTMD8 · #**134** 04-26-2012, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobzdar

Cool, good info. The reason I ask is I thought that overlap wasn't great for boosted motors, and the stock Ferrari valve timing has a pretty tight lobe separation and a decent amount of overlap. Granted, everything I know about boosted applications is on low rpm pushrod v8's so things may work a lot differently.

Many say that overlap is not good on a boosted engine and I once thought the same. My experience is with American V8's (many street cars and some approaching 1800hp/8500+rpm). I've tried several reverse split and wide LSA cams and from my testing, within reason overlap=power and the best turbo cams have very similar specs to what you would use on a naturally aspirated car. Any time I made no changes to a combination but reducing overlap with a wider LSA, power would drop. (and that is even with combinations that had more than 2-1 exhaust to boost pressure)

**KKSBA** · #**135** 04-28-2012, 04:56 PM

I'll get another F355 when this project completes. One of the most beautiful Ferrari's ever but could use a little more oomph!

$50K without a core? Seems pretty reasonable to me for a zero timed engine...

**dailyferraridriver** · #**136** 04-28-2012, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ernie

I saw a pretty trick setup in a Caddi SVT. They had three different tanks. The regular gas tank, then a custom tank that held E85 in the trunk, and another smaller tank in the spare tire space for methanol.

Apparently there isn't a lot of E85 in NJ stations - hopefully by the time this build is done there will be.

Erik

nuclear · #**137** 05-03-2012, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BRADAN

Right now all the engine internals are being reverse engineered. Our game plan for the engine is the following.

-Steel H-beam connecting rods
-9:1 compression forged pistons
-Thicker wrist pins
-Ductile iron sleeves
-Inconel exhaust valve
-Valve springs made 50 lbs stiffer
-Reinforce the cylinder head.
-Higher tensile strength rod bolts, head studs, main cap bolts.

Inconel? For the love of God. We used monel and inconel in the primary systems of the nuke plant I worked at. Big $. What am I getting myself in to?! It would be cheaper to be a crack addict!

jcosta79 · #**138** 05-03-2012, 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nuclear

What am I getting myself in to?! It would be cheaper to be a crack addict!

Yes it would. But you can't drive a crack pipe.

Not that I've heard anyway.

**NeuroBeaker** · #**139** 05-03-2012, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcosta79

Yes it would. But you can't drive a crack pipe.

Not that I've heard anyway.

Well, the user might think they're driving the crack pipe.

I reckon this car would be a lot more fun though.

All the best,
Andrew.

Markphd · #**140** 05-07-2012, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by INTMD8

Boost doesn't have too much to do with needing more valvespring pressure. Approaching IVC, intake manifold pressure and cylinder pressure should be near equalized and as soon as IVC occurs you start the compression cycle.

So, pressures on the intake side effect valvetrain stability to a small degree but where stock valvesprings become a real problem on a turbo motor is EVC. When the exhaust valve tries to close against all of the exhaust backpressure (which on a responsive street based system can typically be 2x intake manifold pressure) it can bounce on the seat causing power to drop dramatically.

As for the cam timing, widening the LSA would likely just reduce horsepower (from the tests I've done). Just like dropping the compression ratio

Several valve train experts would state that both sides need attention. Many times however the stock springs are adequate when factoring in the additional boost. A plan for stiffer springs makes a lot of sense.

He's gonna need some serious injectors to keep up with e85 under boost.

Mark