Lowering A 360 or 430 | FerrariChat

Lowering A 360 or 430

Discussion in '360/430' started by GCalo, Mar 27, 2009.

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  1. GCalo

    GCalo F1 Veteran

    Sep 15, 2004
    7,645
    Northern California
    Full Name:
    Greg Calo
    #1 GCalo, Mar 27, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Lowering A 360 or 430

    Before one drops the vehicle height one must know if the current height is a factory setting. This is done by measuring the length from the bottom of the spring resting washer (part into which the spring bottom sits) to the center of the lower shock bolt. The factory values are as follows:

    Front Shocks Rear Shocks
    Yellow markings: 155.2 mm –156.2 mm 171.7 mm – 172.7 mm
    White Markings: 153.7 mm – 154.7 mm 170.6 mm – 171.6 mm
    Red Markings: 152.2 mm – 153.2 mm 169.5 mm – 170.5 mm

    If the front spring is not removed from the car, you can still measure the above distances to verify if you are at original settings before you start the lowering process. You will need a thin metric ruler that starts at 0 mm at the very edge of the ruler, because you are going to measure from the top of the lower shock mounting bolt to the bottom of the upper spring support ring. Slide the ruler down along the shock body so that it slips between the shock’s lower mount and rests on the securing bolt.

    The lower front shock bolt is 12 mm in diameter. So you will add to the measurement you make ½ of that or 6 mm for the total length, and compare that with the above.

    Alternatively if measuring the shock is difficult the car’s height can be measured before lowering.

    Find a suitable location to measure the before and after heights. Make sure the car is on level concrete so your measurements are accurate and then get under to measure the height!

    It is also important to know both the OEM height measurements and the points from which the measurements should be taken.

    OEM height measurements are: front at 125.2 mm (4.929”) and the rear is 146.8 mm (5.779”).

    Front: ahead of the front wheel at the structural member body side of the wheel and just forward of the lower A frame securing bolt. There is a rubber drain tube there. Measurement is just behind that tube on the aluminum frame. See photo on right.

    Rear: forward of the rear wheel at the structural member body side of the wheel which is right below the curve of the lower air scoop as seen from the external side of the vehicle.

    Ferrari suggest that each seat should be weighted with about 150 lbs of ballast and about 50 lbs in the trunk for proper height measurements and for proper height alignment purposes. That might be a bit over the top, but one should bear in mind that when lowering the vehicle w/o such ballast weight that the car will sit a bit lower with driver and then again slightly lower with passenger.

    Hill Engineering makes a wrench for the lower locking ring P/N: LNS-02. It is about $50.00. This tool works well if the shock rings are loosened when the spring is not on the vehicle. However, it is of little value if adjustments are made with the shock body on the vehicle. It is wide, flat, and will not fit w/in the wheel well. Not ideal for use when adjusting ride height with shocks mounted

    McMasters-Carr offers a variety of spanner wrenches that are tremendous for adjusting coilovers. Go to: http://www.mcmaster.com/#spanner-and-drum-wrenches/=wj7ul

    The main 360 shock spring collar has slots spaced at 90 mm’s in diameter. The McMaster’s spanner wrench P/N: 6975A22 will fit this. This is a fantastic wrench and makes adjusting both the spring securing ring and the locking an easier task. This is really the only one you’ll need. Buy it.

    The lower adjustable locking nut has slots at 70 mm’s in diameter. Their P/N: 6975A21 wrench should work, and it is easier to use with the shock still on the vehicle. This is highly recommended.

    Calculating vehicle drop is based upon the number of downward turns of the spring retaining ring. Total body drop is affected by the Motion Ratio which is the ratio of shock travel versus wheel travel. It is equal to the Shock Travel (in inches) per 1 inch of Wheel Travel. Motion Ratio is used to account for the different suspension geometries and the resultant mechanical leverage on the spring. In almost all cases, the Motion Ratio is less than 1.

    One can generally calculate the Motion Ratio by simply dividing the shock travel by the wheel travel. Example if the shock travels 0.5 inches and the wheel travels 1 inches then the motion ratio would be 0.5/1 = 0.5.

    It is believed that the Motion Ration of the 360/430 suspension is about 0.70. The value cannot be found in the Ferrari workshop manual for some reason, but it is believed to be accurate. Thus the formula below is based upon the 0.70 value for the Motion Ratio. M.R. 0.80 is shown for reference.

    So lets say you want to achieve a 1" drop. Basing the calculations on the MR value as 0.70, 12 turns will drop your vehicle 1" (25.45 mm/cm/1.5mm = 16.97 turns X 0.70 = 11.88 turns/cm).

    The threads on the Ferrari shock body are pitched at approximately 1.5 mm which means that every turn of the ring should equate to a drop of 1.5 mm.

    This means that for every downward turn of the spring support nut with a motion ratio of 0.70, you would get about .084” of downward travel of the body. The specifics are for two M. R.’s are below:

    See the Motion Ratio chart separately attached below.

    Remember that these figures for the 0.70 Motion Ratio are based upon lowering the vehicle with the factory springs in place! M.R. 0.80 is shown for reference purposes only.

    An important point is that there is a 10 mm bolt that holds a metal strap that supports the wiring for the brake pad sensor and for the ABS connection. It is advisable to remove that bolt and let the wires hang down out of the way before doing any shock height adjustments!

    You will then need to loosen the lower locking ring first and then rotate the ring downward to the desired number of turns. You can use a 2 ¾” stainless steel hose clamp to hold the adjusting ring at the desired # of turns. It will hold it firmly in place.

    Note that the rings have red/green marks on them. Use them for reference but also mark the two aluminum rings for additional reference in case the turning scratches off the paint marks.

    WD40 has a new spray can that has a fixed tube that pops up to spray into tight spots. You will need to well lubricate the area above and below the spring retainer! There is considerable pressure against that ring from the spring so be prepared to use a good deal of muscle to start the ring turning. It gets easier as it is turned down, but it does initially take a good bit of energy.

    When you get to the desired level lightly tighten the lower ring and then do all the others. When you have the desired drop, recheck all vehicle height measurements from underneath, and then securely tighten the locking ring.

    Two important considerations about lowering with factory springs:

    1) You are extending the motion of the factory spring and this can cause body roll. If you add a spring such as the AFCO, you are reducing the spring motion while increasing the spring pressure which is ideal.
    2) Make sure to get the car properly aligned after changing the springs and/or lowering.

    Note: for some reason the lowering chart is not spacing properly. I have separately atached it.

    I have this as a separate file if anyone wants it.
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    Performify likes this.
  2. ehagen

    ehagen Karting

    Mar 20, 2008
    91
    Orlando
    Full Name:
    Erik
    This is a great write up. I am thinking about lowering my 360 soon. I have a couple of questions.

    Do you have to take the springs / shocks off of the car before you turn the spring collars? Or can you turn the collars by just removing the wheel?

    You mentioned that lowering will cause more body roll? are you sure about this? It seems like the spring is the same spring as it was before. The only difference is that it is at a different position on the shock resulting in a different ride height, but the spring 'stiffness' should remain the same. Is this correct?
     
  3. GCalo

    GCalo F1 Veteran

    Sep 15, 2004
    7,645
    Northern California
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    Greg Calo
    #3 GCalo, Apr 10, 2009
    Last edited: Apr 10, 2009
    Springs do not have to come off. Get the WD-40 "double straw" container and lubricate the area well. Do get the suggested wrench from McMasters-Carr. Greatly simplifies the process.


    You are extending the travel distance of the spring by lowering and that can cause a bit more body roll. Try it first to see. Adding the AFCO springs will stop that.
     
  4. masar

    masar Formula 3

    Aug 19, 2007
    1,367
    Czech republic
    Full Name:
    Petr
    great write up !
     
  5. Rytt

    Rytt Karting
    BANNED

    Apr 14, 2009
    130
    I-town
    Full Name:
    Badda-Boom
    great write up!
     
  6. Argento6spd360modena

    Argento6spd360modena Formula Junior

    Nov 20, 2009
    309

    Awesome write up!!

    Just to reconfirm, this is the "only" tool I need for both adjustment ring and locking ring? Is this tool durable enough for the job? It is so cheap that I don't know if I should just order two incase one breaks during the process : )
     
  7. GCalo

    GCalo F1 Veteran

    Sep 15, 2004
    7,645
    Northern California
    Full Name:
    Greg Calo
    #7 GCalo, Jan 21, 2011
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2011
    If you can break that tool then you will take the title of the new Charles Atlas!!!

    And yes it adjusts everything.

    You'll need lots of spray WD40 as well.

    Be patient and do it slowly.

    After the springs settle you may want to lower it about another 3-4 turns.

    Wait a while after the install to tell for sure.
     
  8. anxpert

    anxpert Formula Junior

    Mar 4, 2008
    970
    Oceanside, CA
    Full Name:
    Enrique Mar
    I bought the same tools, they will outlast your lowering process. I would suggest taking the strut off, I tried turning the spring support while in the car with quite a bit of WD -40 and in my case extremely difficult to turn under pressure. It is not a difficult job. I strongly suggest you roll the front fender lips, they will catch once the car is lowered ! Good Luck
     
  9. djastral69

    djastral69 Formula 3

    Aug 6, 2007
    1,883
    Fl
    Full Name:
    David
    Perfect, thanks guys....I'll be using this this weekend for adjustments.
     
    imflyinbiya likes this.
  10. GCalo

    GCalo F1 Veteran

    Sep 15, 2004
    7,645
    Northern California
    Full Name:
    Greg Calo

    Not necessary.

    Raise the car on the working side and w/another floor jack take a bit of pressure off the A-arm.

    Once you get the lock ring loose, you can squirt a good amount of WD-40 onto the threads and the rubber spring bushing.

    After starting turning you can then remove the floor jack under the A-Arm.

    It takes a bit of muscle power but it is doable.

    Make sure you have a good mark on the ring to accurately count your turns!
     
  11. Gh21631

    Gh21631 F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 24, 2011
    8,341
    East
    I am under the impression that the alignment will have to be adjusted if you lower the car.
     
  12. GCalo

    GCalo F1 Veteran

    Sep 15, 2004
    7,645
    Northern California
    Full Name:
    Greg Calo
    Any time you alter the suspension you should seek an alignment and I would do a 4 wheel alignment after this work.
     
  13. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 19, 2008
    38,093
    Clarksville, Tennessee
    Full Name:
    Terry H Phillips
    A good 4 wheel alignment includes juggling ride height and camber until everything is perfect, including toe-in. So naturally, you need an alignment if you lower the car, like Greg said.

    Taz
    Terry Phillips
     
  14. GCalo

    GCalo F1 Veteran

    Sep 15, 2004
    7,645
    Northern California
    Full Name:
    Greg Calo
    You heard it from Da Man.

    Do it!

    Keep us posted on your progress.
     
  15. Mikkofin

    Mikkofin Formula Junior

    Jun 30, 2011
    291
    Finland
    I bought the H&R lowering springs for my Spider.
    Was it a very wise move considering this option would have also been possible?
    Maybe the shorter / possibly stiffer spring will also reduce body roll compared to the original?
     
  16. blackbolt22

    blackbolt22 F1 Veteran

    Sep 25, 2007
    5,753
    Boca Raton, FL
    Full Name:
    Mr. Anderson
    I haven't noticed any negatives for highway driving. If anything, it handles and drives better.

    Different springs may be better for the track. The track guys will have to chime in.
     
  17. UH-Matt

    UH-Matt Karting

    Mar 31, 2011
    95
    #17 UH-Matt, Jul 20, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  18. blackbolt22

    blackbolt22 F1 Veteran

    Sep 25, 2007
    5,753
    Boca Raton, FL
    Full Name:
    Mr. Anderson
    Looking good. I like the black wheels with the yellow calipers.
     
  19. Stevely

    Stevely Formula Junior

    Jul 21, 2011
    634
    LA, CA
    Anyone have a suggestion for a marking tool to keep track of turns? Yellow spray paint? I notice Ferrari puts marks on a lot of their bolts. I don't think its permanent marker. Anyone know what it is?
     
  20. arenared

    arenared Karting

    Dec 22, 2005
    211
    Silicon Valley
    I am planning on using a metallic silver Sharpie. I'll let you know how it goes :) You could also try to steal some of your significant other's fingernail polish.
     
  21. Stevely

    Stevely Formula Junior

    Jul 21, 2011
    634
    LA, CA
    That's a great idea! Will try the nail polish over a sharpie to give it some longevity.
     
  22. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    26,467
    socal
    UH matt,

    What color is that called? Looks awesome!
     
  23. UH-Matt

    UH-Matt Karting

    Mar 31, 2011
    95
    #23 UH-Matt, Dec 10, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  24. D16RR

    D16RR Karting

    Nov 4, 2011
    168
    Florida
    Full Name:
    Drew
    Two McMaster spanner wrenches, a bottle of Liquid Wrench Penetrating Fluid, 8 busted knuckles, 36 Rotations and a few hours later, I am now lowered by about 22mm all the way around...

    I will have to say a few things to help...

    Issue 1: Between the spring and the collar is a rubber disc that gets squished out and cracks a bit over time. I found that the rubber disc was overlapping the collar and it was making it hard for me to get a good bite with the spanner wrench...

    Solution: Take a razor blade and cut off the squished rubber that overhangs past the spring and the collar. This made the job so much more easier.

    Issue 2: After you do the first spring with the spanner wrench, your hand will be pretty bruised up. So I went looking for a bar that I could put over the spanner wrench to get more leverage. I found a 3 foot long piece of PVC pipe that was just big enough to fit over the spanner wrench handle and was about 3/8" inch thick.

    Solution: 3 Feet of PVC was too long. I cut it down to about a foot long. Then I used the pvc pipe over the spanner wrench handle to give me leverage and give me a better grip on the wrench without bruising my hands.

    Issue 3: Make sure to have your masseuse at your house within 4 hours of you finishing the job.

    Solution: Opt for the two hour deep tissue massage.

    Otherwise, just letting my car settle in after the first drive now. I plan to check the final measurements tomorrow...may have to do some final tweaking, but at least all of the hard work is done!!
     
  25. Stevely

    Stevely Formula Junior

    Jul 21, 2011
    634
    LA, CA
    I tried an absolutely couldn't get the ring holding the compressed spring to turn no matter how much WD40 I sprayed. I also had a problem with the rubber overhang, but left it as is and gave up. Maybe I'll try again after reading your post.

    How did you get around the suspension arms? In an attempt to get more access, I started to undo the upper links but realized that wasn't going to release the suspension the way I wanted. Then I went after the camber? or toe? link with the hex bolts but gave up.
     

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