16 M Value

Prices are coming down now fast .... and will continue to coming down now the Speciale Spider is coming soon ...

 

Rubbish. Prices are going up. UK prices are now back to list for the best examples and rising.

Speciale Spider is a limited production car, I see it having no effect. Of course, time will tell.

http://www.clinkardcars.co.uk/cars/ferrari/326/ferrari-16m-one-of-37-rhd-uk-cars

 

Buyers decide on prices Russell ... not the sellers.

Here a 16M at a pricy off F dealer, not negotiated yet ... I bet you get it at 10% off so let's say KE 145.

One year ago that would have been KE 180. I know because I keep track of all (67! on Mobile & Autoscout24) Scuds for sale in EU ...

 

Clearly markets vary, I am always very clear that I am quoting the UK market and the present going rate for the best 16M's is £200k. I have turned down 2 offers for my car at this price in recent months - so yes the buyer is setting the price.

My main point was in reference to the forthcoming Speciale Spider having an impact on 16M values - I just don't see it. 16M is now 5 years old and will be 6 by the time the SS comes out, I can't see either that many 16M owners will be trading in for an SS causing an over supply or that many people will be considering buying a 6 year old 16M or a new SS. The SS buyer isn't a 16M buyer!

 

Hmm..agree with some of the others..this is certainly not true in the US or the UK..Perhaps in other selective markets you are seeing like Holland maybe?

In the US there are fewer cars for sale and the prices are a touch higher. In the UK, prices are significantly higher than 1 year ago if you can find one. There are a few for sale now. With milleage between 8-11K miles they run between 175-200GBP. The scud is also creeping up--especially in the UK where they are some trading at levels that the 16M was about a year ago.

I don't know the Euro markets as well, but a quick look on autoscout24 shows that even high mileage examples are at least 226K USD with good example more expensive than the US...

Also agree, at first, the SS will be a different market. Also, the price is so much higher than the 16m that I really doubt there will be any downward pressure. Similar to the lack of downward pressure on the Scud when the Speciale was released.

 

I see Scuds entering the market from owners who swore 5 years ago "never ever to sell this car" now they have to pay for the new Speciale and the Speciale Spider ... believe me !

 

Also seen quite a few people go from 458s to scuds. The scud driving experience is outright different. Not necessarily "better" but a different experience. In addition the car is at a different phase of its depreciation/potential appreciation cycle. My guess(educated) is that those buying Scuds a year ago should be reasonably happy.

 

I don't!

 

Not reflected in the prices yet in this country. I was hoping this would be the case since I recently bought one.

OP - Scuds are pretty stable. You see some nice ones in non-red down in the low 160s now. 16m's have held their value better based on what I've seen and are still 200k+ in the US.

 

The guys at Ferrari of SF tell me that a very popular garage for their customers is 458 daily driver, and 430 Scud for track car. Pretty awesome; I can't afford that! ; )

 

16M values in the US are solely a function of mileage. A cursory examination of US model 16M prices on internet sites reflect AP's from $200K for a private seller model with approx. 30K miles to $275K for an authorized F car dealer model with less than 2K miles on the clock. Most 16M are priced between $225K and $250K in the US and have 5K to 10K in mileage (give or take a few miles). Are fully optioned $325K-$350K MSRP 16M fully depreciated now ? I leave that purely speculative question to the smart guys on the list, but clearly the car has depreciated approx. 25%-35%. My guess (thats all it is) would be that the prices have flattened out here in the States at about $$200K-$225K for a typical 16M with average mileage (maybe $200K for one with 10K miles and $225K with one with 5K in miles or less). The outlier with 30K miles and an AP of $200K maybe a bargain at $200K or sit for many months and eventually be sold/traded for $150K-$175K (maybe moving up to a 458SS???). I'd also speculate that in 20 years these prices will seem like a HUGE bargain as the 16M is a nice long term play AND a great drivers car (albeit for a V8.

 

I love my SCUD and have not driven or even seen a speciale in person. If I could afford one, I would trade my SCUD for it in an instant. Everything I have read about it is consistent, that it is a step in the right direction.

 

Yep, the Speciale is a gorgeous car. You see it in person, you will want it!

But hey, the 16M is no slouch. It's a mean looking spider.

 

a musing.
the 16M is made in fewer number than CS or F40. strange that its value is very slowly declining instead of rising (like F40) or holding (like CS).

 

In Italy they say: "Ognuno tira l'acqua al suo mulino", translated into "Everyone pulls water to his own mill"

328 owners say 328/308 are rising in value, so are saying CS owners, 16M owner too, maybe also F430 and 360 owners will hope that one day....and so are 355 and 348 owners...

I belive no modern car is a good value or money invest, except very very few limited special production cars. Maybe the 16 M will be in 30 years, but....who ever among us will keep his 16M or Scuderia 30 years? I won't...

 

You need to look at the value of these cars over the years, there have been drastic rises and falls at various points in their life cycle.

 

Funny..when I look at 16M prices in Europe and the UK as well as the US they are higher. The UK seems to be leading where 16Ms are higher and scuds are now trading where the 16Ms were last year. UK only has a few scuds for sale though..(pistonheads has a pretty good classified section for the UK--tons of Ferrari's in general). There seem to be more CSs offerred than last year--but they are at higher prices as well. Especially right hand drive cars.

Although less familiar, in Europe there are a few high mileage examples that trade similar to US prices--but the rest seem a bit higher (check out autoscout24).

You may have been peaking about a longer period then a year. In that case seems like scuds/16Ms had generally traded lower as the "first buyers" sold them. Now, IMHO, they seem to have entered the next phase where people are seeking them out as keepers rather than "latest and greatest" in the garage.

 

+1

Great post. IMHO accurate for the US (I might quibble with $225k average transaction price for 5000 miles or less - I think they may be a bit higher, but its close anyways). I think these are smart buys to both enjoy and keep for a long(er) term from a value retention perspective. Keep in mind 458SS will be circa $400k average MSRP I bet...

 

Seeing as a lightly used Speciale coupe is $400k, imagine what a used cab is going to sell for.

 

Forget the Scud referenced in some posts that is a different car and disregard the UK cars as that is an isolated market.

Overall it is a tough question as only comppleted sales should matter, not asking prices and there have been such few sales yet a lot of inventory seen repeatedly, some have sat for nearly a year unsold. I know the owner and can say that an exceptional condition 166772 sold for $200k 11 months ago.

Others on the market with asking prices are below but I would expect sales would be negotaited down:

$229k 2263 miles, on market 10 months
Used 2009 Ferrari SCUDERIA 16M For Sale | Salt Lake City UT

$229k 3701 miles, on market 9 months
2009 Ferrari F430 SCUDERIA SPIDER 16M Hinsdale IL 6958991

and the $199k asking price 8864 miles with front bumper replaced ... On market a year
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

Small market maybe, but still a valid barometer of market values - particularly if you live in the UK, just like a lot of Fchat users!

 

I think perhaps there is a little survivor bias in those examples. That Chicago car is well known and well discussed in terms of issues--with a history like that certainly not the real market and priced lower and sticking around for good reason. Would not use it to characterize the broader market myself. The Salt Lake car is curious as it seems to have stuck around while all the other cars on the market seem to have come and gone. Would be interesting to know more about that car as I am not as familiar with it.

As for pricing and inventory sitting around I have seen something quite different. I personally know that Both FofBev Hills and F of Newport Beach each had two 16Ms that were very good examples and came and went very quickly. Also, Ferrari of Denver had one that was actually not so great, but it came and went very fast as well. In general there are about half as many 16Ms on Dupont as there were a year ago. Many of those good some of them bad..but not there any more.

As for the UK, I think you are correct for Right Hand Drive cars as there is a very limited supply of those and some trade particularly high--for example the CS, Scuds and 16Ms. However, one of the cars (there are only two available) is left hand drive. There is usually no/little price difference for LHD models as the can move quite easily between the UK and Europe. FYI the RHD car is 11K miles and 335K USD! The LHD cars has lees miles at 8K and about 290K USD.shan 20K KMs

RE my UK vs Europe point above. If you look at Autoscout24 you will see that any care with 20,000KMs or less starts at 240K USD and goes up to 325K USD. Interestingly they have a few very high mileage examples as well that are much cheaper but obviously not apples to apples with the low miles car.

Here are some links in case anyone wants to see for themselves:
Offers: Ferrari, Final price (?) from ? 1,000.-

Used Ferrari cars for sale with PistonHeads