550 LHD v RHD prices | FerrariChat

550 LHD v RHD prices

Discussion in '456/550/575' started by Themaven, Apr 14, 2017.

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  1. Themaven

    Themaven F1 Rookie

    Nov 2, 2014
    4,254
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    Darius
    I have never seen such a gulf (I think the correct financial world word is 'spread') between asking prices of Euro LHD and UK RHD 550s in the UK. Similar cars in RHD are asking more than double their LHD equivalents in the UK market.

    Take these two for example. A LHD with 16k miles asking £90k GBP and a UK RHD with more miles asking £180k. Same colour, and the LHD is a 2000 while the RHD is a 1999. Lots more examples like these.

    There were 457 UK RHD 550s out of 3083 550s, nothing exceptional about that.

    Has the Continent fallen out of love with 550s? Why the gulf? I know they are all just asking prices but still. The cheap LHD ones are not selling.

    https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/ferrari/550/ferrari-550-maranello-manual-16500-miles/

    https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/ferrari/550/ferrari-550-maranello--1999-t/7056882
     
  2. MogulBoy

    MogulBoy Formula Junior

    Sep 23, 2004
    969
    Devon
    That £90k LHD car does look rather good (just need to delete the aftermarket shields) but not sure that 'one recorded UK owner' is a particular selling point given that it is obvious that it has had a Continental life.

    In terms of RHD, we have debated this in the past and my personal view is that I would not feel comfortable shelling out more than 10% extra to have my steering wheel on the 'right' hand side as these cars can be enjoyed in the UK in either RHD or LHD configurations but they were born to be enjoyed on long distance Continental escapades..

    P.s. Did you spot this £140k RHD via a private seller? Higher miles than the Meridian car but conspicuously better value I would have thought.

    https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/ferrari/550/very-high-specification-ferrari-550-maranello-prepared-for-concours/7022117

    The bigger issue is who is actually buying these cars above £100k and to what end?
     
  3. au-yt

    au-yt F1 Veteran
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    #3 au-yt, Apr 14, 2017
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2017
    This discussion has been had numerous times about a number of the Modern V12 Ferrari's

    The difference between prices between left and right hand drive Ferrari's in general is the same world wide.
    Majority of it rarity by comparison RHD cars are made in much fewer numbers, compounded by taxes in some countries push the initial values up and they stay comparatively the same.
    Even between the US and Europe the taxes involved in Europe impact on new cars significantly.
    Adding to this in Australia until the car is 30 years old there are currently special requirement to even allow you to bring one in and even then you pay a significant Luxury Car Tax. then it must be compliance even if its RHD and converted by a gov approved facility. Then they suffer the resale stigma of an import.
     
  4. Themaven

    Themaven F1 Rookie

    Nov 2, 2014
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    I did see that concours private sale car. It looks great but at 140k for 30k miles it's not cheap. 140k for a 10k mile concours RHD 550, maybe.

    I am no finance whiz but I would have thought the weak sterling to euro exchange rate would mean continental cars would be more expensive in ££ terms now. Not cheaper! Certainly doesn't look like continentals are shopping for Euro LHD 550s in the UK.

    All rather strange. I can understand prices going up or down but this split is odd, and not reflected in any other car that I have seen.
     
  5. Themaven

    Themaven F1 Rookie

    Nov 2, 2014
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    Graeme - it's not a conversation I have seen re a 100% price difference between identical cars in LHD and RHD in the UK, ever before, and I have been watching and buying LHD/RHD cars here since 1986. RHD cars are made in smaller numbers but their market is also much smaller. No other Ferraris are showing this price spread, or anything near it, right now. Which is what is so strange.
     
  6. au-yt

    au-yt F1 Veteran
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    Yes that is strange, but buyers soon wake up to the disparity.
     
  7. MogulBoy

    MogulBoy Formula Junior

    Sep 23, 2004
    969
    Devon
    At some point mileage should become irrelevant, or certainly less relevant.

    When one is presented with a 'concours' car with a decent mileage on the clock, so long as the mechanical condition (as evidenced by comprehensive service records) matches the cosmetic appearance, it should be a very compelling proposition, irrespective of the recorded mileage, and one which in my book, would compare favourably with any low mileage example that could easily require significant recommissioning expenditure and then the necessary courage to actually use it for more than a couple of hundred miles per annum.

    Meridian have priced their 19k miles car at £180k which is what that ultra low miles Argento car made at Silverstone last year.

    The private seller's superior, but 30k miles, car is up for £140k but if you think £90k is fair value for a good(average) LHD, then that price doesn't seem to be to far ahead of the LHD +30 per cent. rule of thumb that you appear to be comfortable with.

    The trouble is that for every 10 buyers of Maranellos at let's say £50k, there are probably less than 5 at £100k and probably less than 2 at £150k.
     
  8. au-yt

    au-yt F1 Veteran
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    #8 au-yt, Apr 14, 2017
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2017
    The milage component now never entirely goes away, but post 30 years seems a reasonable measure and then condition and originality play a much bigger part of value.

    On the flip side of buyers v value it never ceases to amaze me is how many new high end value cars have there production already sold out.

    And in support of the reduced numbers of buyers an interesting thought is the changing trend in buyers of modern classics to the younger demographic. My take on this when modern classic cars get with in value of new entry level exotica, the lure of the latest and greatest for gen Y say, over rides the stability of value (up to this point in time) of modern classics.
    I recon you could write a marketing masters thesis on this subject.
     
  9. Stryker1808

    Stryker1808 Rookie

    Jul 10, 2015
    40


    The 360 CS market was similar a while ago....may still be so.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
     
  10. Themaven

    Themaven F1 Rookie

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    That is an interesting subject. I was speaking to Jean-Claude Biver, CEO of watches and jewellery for LVMH and a big Ferrari collector and fan (Hublot) and he was saying new gens don't wear watches or drive, and when they do wear watches they want the newest, not classic brands (he runs both types).

    I don't know if it's always been like that, but there is more new money than ever before, and they don't remember or care about Maranellos!

    Meanwhile, it seems that 'old money' continental Europe has lost interest in 550s as well..for the moment.
     
  11. Calcifer

    Calcifer Karting

    Apr 17, 2016
    55
    On the other hand. I own a BMW M3 CSL in LHD and the price of LHD ones are double than that of RHD. Could it just be a Ferrari thing.

    Porsche do not have as large a price gap either.
     
  12. Roygarth

    Roygarth Karting

    Nov 27, 2013
    66
    Norfolk, England
    I suspect a large percent of LHD for sale in UK came over here last year as a pure arbitrage play - just as the market was softening. Vendors of these cars are getting desperate to get out and are lowering offered prices. RHD are owned more by long term owners, less by speculators. Hence the RHD/LHD spread has widened.

    LHD prices are quite a bit higher (more so than usual) on the continent than LHD in the UK. This is in line with the long term RHD/LHD spread.
     
  13. MogulBoy

    MogulBoy Formula Junior

    Sep 23, 2004
    969
    Devon
    #13 MogulBoy, Apr 16, 2017
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2017
    Not sure what you mean by long term owners? Those that have owned their cars for 5+ years already, or those that intend to?

    If I owned a RHD Maranello in the UK and comparable LHD cars could be had for half the money, I would be sorely tempted to cash in on that spread but I suspect that in practice, it cannot be done and if the delta was just 25%, it probably wouldn't be worth the hassle. However, as a buyer, I would be happier sinking £75k into a LHD than £100k into a RHD on a number of levels without taking a view over which one was a better 'investment'.

    Saying that, the future for LHD cars in the UK is a tiny bit less clear than has been for many years. First off, we/you have Brexit and the VAT status of used cars moving to and fro across the Channel will need to clarified.

    Then we see what's happening in South Africa, a RHD country that used to allow the import of LHD cars but no longer does (so I am led to believe).
     
  14. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Jul 19, 2008
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    Australia pretty much bans LHD cars, too.
     
  15. jtremlett

    jtremlett F1 Rookie

    Feb 18, 2004
    4,704
    Yes. There is absolutely no possibility of that happening in the UK, fortunately. In fact, it doesn't even impact on the insurance in the UK.

    When I bought my 550 I looked at a LHD car (in the UK) before I bought my RHD car and the difference in price was almost nothing. The LHD car I looked at was pretty nice and I came quite close to buying it although the service history was pretty minimal. Some of the LHD cars currently and recently offered have not been the best examples, in uninspiring colour combinations, and history can be scant, especially for some that are ex-Japan and just bought because they were cheap by dealers hoping to turn a quick profit. I think that explains a bit of the price differential but certainly not all.

    Jonathan
     
  16. Themaven

    Themaven F1 Rookie

    Nov 2, 2014
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    A lot of proper wisdom here, as ever..it's also very true that other desirable cars are not showing this gap; LHD LP Gallardos and 997 GT3 RSs (to take just two examples) show much less difference to RHD in the U.K.

    Still while we may have nailed the reasons here, something has to happen. Either LHD buyers in the UK market will get themselves a bargain or..I can't see RHD prices crashing, but who knows.

    The strangest thing is that these (admittedly mainly quite ordinary) LHD examples aren't selling - even the nice looking ones. I think only the exceptional cars (mileage, colour etc) are selling now. Mogulboy I take your point about mileage but if you look back in the 12 cyl lineage, mileage has a strong correlation with value for F512M, 512TR, Testarossa..it's only back with the BBs, pre-84, that it starts to become less important than condition, etc. I would humbly suggest.
     
  17. MogulBoy

    MogulBoy Formula Junior

    Sep 23, 2004
    969
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  18. AlfistaPortoghese

    AlfistaPortoghese Moderator
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    Mar 18, 2014
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    Nuno
    Dear Darius,

    That is a very interesting point indeed. I wish I had something meaningful to add, but unfortunately I lack the knowledge and experience you have in all things Ferrari.

    Nevertheless, it is my humble opinion:

    - Generation gaps do play a role. The world and the rate at which events happen (and change!) is faster than ever. Being born in 1985, I find my personal tastes to have much more to do with the previous generation than with the so-called millennials. People nowadays tend to prefer and admire things under a new set of values. I feel there's a certain degree of disdain for the past and it makes you "chique" to both despise the old and jump on the newest bandwagon available, no matter how acephalous (the more, the better).

    I'm somewhat pessimistic (to put it mildly - if we had this conversation in person, believe me I'd be much more "colourful") regarding the future and regarding what this current generation will like and relate to. It may play a role on how much and how fast a Ferrari may appreciate and depreciate in monetary value. The world is far from being what it was when Enzo and its myth were at its zenith. Ferrari is no longer the force it once was in F1. Ferrari has all but disappeared from Hollywood movies and celebrities. The competition in the supercar world has never been more fierce than it is nowdays. All variables combined may lead to seamingly odd market behaviours.

    - For what it's worth, here goes a mere empirical and practical ascertainment without further analysing the merits or demerits of it: many prospective Ferrari buyers in Europe looking for a good deal, start by looking at LHD cars in the UK. Prices are usually far more attractive there than in continental Europe, as it is common knowledge that LHD cars in the UK take a hit in terms of value. Basically few people actually want them in a predominantly RHD market, whereas in the rest of Europe cars in general don't depreciate due to the side in which you find the steering wheel and pedals, once the vast majority of us live in LHD countries.

    That said, the 550 is probably one of the most sought-after Ferraris in my neck of the woods. I can't actually remember the last time I saw one for sale on a mainstream website or dealer, and the ones that very rarely pop up, are sold in a matter of hours. Yes, hours, not days. I know of a 550 sold in Portugal in the last trimester of last year that was sold in less than 72 hours. Not one of a kind, not in a very rare or particularly stunning colour, not particularly well equipped in terms of extra equipment, with your average 30.000km. Main source of interest? Few owners, always maintained by the official Ferrari dealer in Lisbon, accident-free and completely original as it left the factory, down to the last brochure and leaflet. However, there are so few 550s in my country (and the Iberian Peninsula as a whole) that one really can't provide any meaninful feedback regarding asking prices.

    Kindest regards,

    Nuno.
     
  19. Priley

    Priley Rookie

    Jun 15, 2015
    26
    Essex, UK
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    Pete Riley
    I'm one of the UK LHD 550 owners having bought the car two years ago after selling my 612. I've contemplated selling the car (perhaps in favour of a 575...) but as has been suggested here, it feels like quite the Ferrari V12 bargain for the relatively small inconvenience of overtaking requiring a little more effort.
    I also think over time they will re-take the ground currently being lost to 456's and 612's (as similarly priced V12's) as it is a manual two-seat V12 Ferrari, regardless of which side is the steering wheel. Plus it's a far more engaging drive than either of them, both of which I've driven and have a soft spot for.
     
  20. Themaven

    Themaven F1 Rookie

    Nov 2, 2014
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    Hi Nuno, your thoughts are extremely interesting, actually..
     

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