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Best $1500 I have ever spent.

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by Randyslovis, Dec 22, 2015.

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  1. Randyslovis

    Randyslovis Formula Junior

    Jul 7, 2011
    897
    Atlanta, GA
    Full Name:
    Randall J Slovis
    #1 Randyslovis, Dec 22, 2015
    I just picked up my 2013 spider from the dealer. I had them complete the 3rd yearly service before my warranty expired. I wanted to find ANY problem while still on Ferrari's dime. Sorry, I just cannot justify $9500 for 2 years of extended coverage given the 458s reliability.
    Despite the 7 year maintenance plan, I did multiple "routine" maintenance procedures not covered by Ferrari. SO GLAD I DID.
    I grew up in the age of every 2K oil and filter changes. I have always had a hard time with the current extended service intervals. Whenever the manufacturer pays for it, it is around 10K. Whenever I have to pay for it it is 5K. I am talking VW, BMW, MB, Acura. Each of the previous manufacturers changes the intervals depending on who pays. Ferrari up until they picked up the tab required more each year.
    I elected in addition to the "free" oil change to do gearbox, differential, coolant and power steering fluid changes. I also put in a new battery. Brakes done last year and will be done next year on Ferrari's (ultimately my!) dime.
    In changing the fluids I found that the power steering fluid was becoming used up and filter /reservoir had metallic fragments. Turns out to get the rapid steering we have, tremendous pump pressures are needed. To save weight a small pump is used. Dare I say it is under engineered. It takes a beating. Lots of heat and wear is occurring in there. Apparently Ferraris have been having some pump failures as miles pile on. Something you never see in the big GM et al systems. Net, to save the cost and hassle of a pump replacement, this usually inert unstressed fluid should be changed. If filter/reservoir is filled with fragments/trash it is only another $100 to add that to the tab. Mine was able to be cleaned. Next time I will replace.
    In regards to gearbox/diff, after only 2400 miles, clear change in fluid color noted when drained.
    In regards to battery, it is a no win situation. Keep it on the charger as I do and apparently more heat occurs and battery literally bloats from heat generated by near continuous charging. Keep it off the charger and risk electrical maladies that get expensive. So, I now have an Interstate battery (close to $500 installed. WTF?!) that clearly has car starting quicker/easier. Yes, it is that noticeable. Now that I have a real battery, I will periodically disconnect the charger - especially on weekends I drive car. This will allow battery to not always be percolating. Tech says, just plan on every 3 year battery and forget about it. A full charge is mandatory for those pesky electronics. In other words, charging better than not charging.
    Coolant which is long life and could be argued was a waste to change, allowed me to get a full cooling system pressure test/assessment. Happy to say car checked out fine. But if it didn't, I caught it when warranty would cover it.
    Net, driving home from dealer, gear changes at part and full throttle clearly quicker/smoother.
    Downshifts as I slowed for traffic lights while letting electronics do their thing also occurred smoother/quicker.
    I promise you this is not some rationalization on my part or placebo effect. The car literally felt like it was operating at peak performance.
    One could argue even with an extended warranty what I did made sense.
    The car just runs better.
    Plus, any occult wear issues can be found before any real damage/failures occur.
    In regards to the ubiquitous discussion of resale, I cannot believe that a properly maintained car won't be more desirable.
    Best
     
  2. fredhassen

    fredhassen Formula Junior

    Apr 18, 2015
    709
    Las Vegas, Nevada
    Full Name:
    Fred Hassen
    #2 fredhassen, Dec 22, 2015
    Hmmmm......this is gonna get interesting. Thx!


    Cars:

    2013 Ferrari 458 Spider (Daily Driver)

    Ordered 2016 Evora 400
     
  3. TheMayor

    TheMayor Ten Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Feb 11, 2008
    105,293
    Vegas baby
    #3 TheMayor, Dec 22, 2015
    They found metal shavings in my power steering fluid in the first 100 miles or so in my 12 coupe during a routine inspection. I think there was a defect in some manufacturing of some units. FNA asked it to be sent back for inspection and replaced the complete unit.

    Also, both batteries in both of my 458's were defective. One arrived with a leak, the other had a dead cell in a couple of months.
     
  4. bobbyd

    bobbyd Formula Junior

    Nov 17, 2003
    722
    #4 bobbyd, Dec 23, 2015
    The batteries in new Ferrari's are known to be junk.

    With respect to the power steering pressures and engineering - I would suggest that Ferrari emulate either Porsche's set up or, better yet, that of Lotus. They both steer better and, in the former case, rarely ever have steering maintenance even in very high mileage cars.

    But hey what do I know, have only owned multiple examples of all 3 marques for over 20 years...
     
  5. of2worlds

    of2worlds F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 6, 2004
    17,689
    ON
    Full Name:
    CH
    #5 of2worlds, Dec 23, 2015
    Randy you gave us a full report here, very interesting details especially regarding the power steering pump. Thanks!
    Still wonder about the high pressure used on direct injection motors and possible future problems though...
     
  6. garak

    garak Formula Junior

    Dec 28, 2010
    303
    Florida/Arizona
    #6 garak, Dec 23, 2015
    Thanks Randy for the writeup.

    Anybody know if gearbox and differential fluid changes are done as part of the 7 year maintenance program? If so, do you know at what year/mileage? Thanks
     
  7. rockitman

    rockitman F1 Veteran

    May 31, 2015
    5,989
    Upstate, NY
    Full Name:
    Christian
    #7 rockitman, Dec 23, 2015
    My 7 year no charge maintenance which is the car's second year in service included: Motor Oil, Brake Fluid flush/change, pollen filter, air filter (declined as I use BMC), AC Control belt.
     
  8. djantlive

    djantlive Formula 3

    Jun 30, 2005
    1,015
    #8 djantlive, Dec 24, 2015
    Get a battery tender, not a battery charger. You can leave a tender on for months
     
  9. synchro

    synchro F1 Veteran

    Feb 14, 2005
    9,294
    CHNDLR
    Full Name:
    Scott
    #9 synchro, Dec 24, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2015
    I understand your frustration with having your Ferrari Tech tell you that it is good advice to spend $500 every three years for a new battery. That just seems so wrong to me so perhaps there is a better way to extend your battery life, first some clarification on equuipment.

    A Battery Maintainer monitors your battery voltage and conditions as it charges then stops when topped off.
    A Battery Charger is designed to pump current into the battery continuously without regard to the state of the battery. As long as it is plugged in then you are forcing energy into the battery. While it can absorb that for a while, when the battery gets full the extra energy escapes any way it can; heat, gas and expansion result. You are damaging your own battery this way and your Tech did not point that out!

    Ferrari knows that battery Maintainers (not chargers) ned to be used and will glady sell you a $465 battery Maintainer by CTEK (70002821 BATTERY CHARGER USA/CDN - Ricambi America, Inc.) that monitors and adjusts the stages of your battery charging. It even has modes to re-condition your battery for long life - I got 7 years out of my last battery.

    Right now we have a FerrariChat Only Special - a plug and play replacement for US version Ferraris on the latest CTEK generation at a third the price of OEM,
    while supplies last
    http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/ferrari-parts-collectibles/508158-holiday-special-%24160-ferrari-battery-maintainer-oem-replacement.html

     
  10. Randyslovis

    Randyslovis Formula Junior

    Jul 7, 2011
    897
    Atlanta, GA
    Full Name:
    Randall J Slovis
    #10 Randyslovis, Dec 24, 2015
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2015
    My poor choice of words.
    I use the Ferrari tender. Just said charger out of habit. The tender may cycle on/off, but the net is that when it has to "top off the charge" heat is generated. Whether it is just the poor Italian batteries that are affected by this constant cycling, I cannot say. I will let you know in a few years if the Interstate battery is superior. The tech is NOT recommending I replace battery every 3 years. He is saying that IF I have to replace the battery it will be cheaper than having had an electronic failure due to a poorly charged battery. Again, it was my idea to change the battery and only on inspection did it show the "bloat". The dealer never pushed the battery replacement.
    Thanks for allowing me to clarify.
    Best
     
  11. Noblesse Oblige

    Noblesse Oblige F1 Veteran

    Nov 7, 2011
    6,114
    Three Places
    #11 Noblesse Oblige, Dec 24, 2015
    I have found Interstate batteries to be ultrareliable and reasonably priced. Last year I changed the 7 year old OEM battery in my wife's F430 as a prophylactic measure. It was fine. I just thought it was getting long in the tooth.
     
  12. Melvok

    Melvok F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Jul 25, 2008
    14,254
    Amersfoort, The Netherlands, Europe.
    Full Name:
    Mel
    #12 Melvok, Dec 25, 2015
    Super write-up Randy ... thanx.

    FNA replaced it, so still the same poor constructed pump imo .... may happen again ...

    Should we think of replacing the pump for a better one ? Any ideas on that please ?
     
  13. Aeroengineman

    Aeroengineman Formula Junior

    Oct 5, 2003
    897
    Maple Valley, WA
    Full Name:
    Dave Tegeler
    #13 Aeroengineman, Dec 30, 2015
    BTW - when I read the owners manual, it says always have the Ferrari Dealer replace the battery yet it gives all the precautions, should you happen to want to disconnect the battery. If I follow the disconnection procedures why can't remove it and replace it? Do I have to maintain voltage on the system so the computers don't forget everything? I am very low tech but this seems to match my skill base. What am I missing?
     
  14. Scuderia Verde

    Scuderia Verde Karting

    Apr 27, 2015
    50
    Utah
    Full Name:
    Rob
    #14 Scuderia Verde, Dec 31, 2015
    Randy - that was a wonderfully descriptive write-up of your experience. It's given me some things to consider as I get ready to pick up a 458 Spider in a few months. I'm actually quite surprised to read that metal shavings in the power steering fluid are such a common problem. Does anyone here recommend replacing the pump with another manufacturer?
     

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