F1 fluid change in 458

Sorry,
my dealer did it for me.
I also changed power steering and rear diff fluid.
Really cheap insurance vs just waste of money. Didn't care, just happy I did it.
Randy

 

There is no F1 fluid in a 458 since the 458 has a DCT (dual clutch transmission) system that operates on completely different principals from the dry plate clutch F1 systems. Those F1 systems were manual transmissions and dry plate clutches operated by an electro-hydraulic system. The hydraulic fluid part of that is what needed to be refreshed at least every three years.

Here is what Ferrari recommends for the clutch and hydraulic controls fluid on the 458's DCT. Looking at the WSM, I did not see a recommended change interval for the fluid on the 458. None in the California maintenance schedule, either, just level checks. Check your maintenance schedule to see if there is one. If not, ask your tech. Seems like it might be a good idea to change at the same time as the gearbox oil, but Ferrari seems to think that is overkill.

Clutch system and hydraulic controls 8.45 qts.(8 l) SHELL DCT-F3.

 

Correct Terry!

Did you find out when sparkplugs are exchanged .... ( isn't it at 100.000 kms ?) ...

 

I accept my DCT is not previous generation F1 gearbox. However, I think the reference to the DCT paddle shift transmission as generic "F1" is reasonable in this setting. It is like calling every facial tissue a "Kleenex".
My service repair order that I am currently loooking at says, "Flush DCT and gear oil."
It used 8 quarts of Shell TF DCT-F3 and 4 quarts of 75W-90 Shell Spiral S5 ATE.
Total cost of fluids was @$270 US.
Again, I am not saying anyone needs to do this.
To imply that this fluid cannot be changed I believe is incorrect based on my service.
Best

 

At which km/mls are you Randy ?

At 20.000/40.000/60.000 kms., on the oem form under "L" it states: Checking the hydraulic clutch system fluid level.

Cannot find a word about changing the hydraulic fluid (yet)
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Hi Mel!!

The short answer was I did it at the 3 year service before car went off warranty. Car had roughly 5000km. Truly not even broken in.

Without giving away my age, I grew up in the days of my dad having his car's oil changed every 2K miles (3500km). Cars back then 50s/60s even had their front ends' "lubed." So, old habits are hard to break.

More honestly, what I was doing was trying to buy insurance. I planned on not getting the extended warranty for nearly 10K US. So, I reasoned that if I changed every fluid in the car - even if not called for or paid for by Ferrari maintenance program - my tech might uncover a hidden problem that could then be done at Ferrari's cost, not mine. I changed power steering, coolant, brake, transmission, rear diff and engine oil. No problems found but power steering fluid was a little "burned" and there were shavings in the power steering screen that they removed.

As an aside, I have noticed over the years that whenever any maintenance work is paid for by the manufacturer, the intervals are much longer and the work less than if it is on the consumer side of the ledger. Getting back to my dad who was an optometrist not an engineer, he was very fond of preventative maintenance. He felt that all fluids were the lifeblood of a machine. Having fresh fluids lubricating things he reasoned could never do any harm and might do some good. I am sure a controlled study with the new superior fluids would show it is a waste of time. But, and it is a big but, if it isn't I can live with the tiny cost I incurred.

Net, 15 months after factory warranty expired I am still ahead of the game being "self insured."

Best,
Randy

 

Well, being 63, I understand what you said.

I am also a big fan of preventive maitenance, but not too much.

Ready for the 90th Mille Miglia now, driving to Italy this weekend ...
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In the era of pre-paid or factory supplied maintenance, many manufacturers have claimed that certain components (usually transmissions) have "lifetime" fills. The relevant question is who's lifetime are we talking about? Usually what the factory has in mind is "will it last until the warranty expires"?

Any fluid subject to shearing forces and heat, like you'd find in a transmission, will suffer degradation as a result. My view is if there are fill and drain plugs, the device needs to have the fluids changed, and in that regard, I'm not sure I trust the factory if it says "lifetime." I don't have oil analysis to back up my guesstimate about how often to change the DCT fluid, but the early 458s are coming up on 7 and 8 years since new.

FWIW, Redline makes a fluid replacement for DCTs.

https://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=146

 

Absolutely nothing wrong with changing the DCT fluid regularly, like I mentioned above. Good news compared to the F1 cars is that each piece of the rear end now gets the lubricant it needs. In the F1 transaxles (and identical 3 pedal transmissions), the lubricant was a compromise between what the differential with limited slip needed, and what the transmission needed. Spec called for GL-5, but that is rough on brass parts like synchronizers, if good for the diff. The DCT Ferraris use different lubricants for the DCT and rear end.

If we had followed Ferrari recommendations, which a lot of owners did, we would never have changed the coolant on earlier Ferraris. That has caused a lot of damage over the years. Even the new ELC coolants are only good for 5 years max.

Mel- Spark plug change interval is 60,000 km/37,500 miles. I assume they are iridium, so should last well.

 

I got about the same answer about coolant when I asked about changing it in my 991 Porsche. "Not necessary," they said. "It's my car and my $$ if something corrodes," I said!

I wonder if the "don't change the coolant" advice given earlier Ferrari owners led to the rash of heat exchanger failures on 360s. I picked up my 2003 360 when it was seven years old. It didn't have records, so I had all the fluids changed and then done again every year since.

Overkill? No doubt, at least as to the coolant, probably, but then after I read about the heat exchanger failures, decided to have mine replaced as a precaution after the original was in the car for over 12 years. It turned out that it wasn't in all that bad shape, probably because of my overzealous coolant changes and the likelihood that the prior owner looked after coolant changes, too.

 

Affirmative, it has led to numerous trans cooler failures and even liner holing from cavitation erosion. Ferraris need either nitrites or extended life coolant (ELC) with organic acid technology (OAT) additives to prevent cavitation erosion of the liners. Nitrites (G05) only last about 2 years and the OATs (ELC) a maximum of 5 years according to the manufacturers.

Porsches, BMWs and Mercedes do no have wet liners like Ferraris, but you are correct, no coolant is permanent. The Mercedes guys told me the same thing, the G48 coolant did not need changing. I told them to change it, too. Due again this year.

 

Expected that age Vince