Barrett-Jackson ejects Keith Martin/For all you Barrett-Jackson fans...

I'm sure yo mama told you dat's der always three sides to every story: his, hers, and mine.

I suspect that money has sumthang to do with all this, but what do I know?

Dale

 

Good for him for standing up for what he believes is right.

Apparently B-J is hyping and hoisting prices?

 

IMO, both parties are jerks.

 

Hmm... I seem to recall that Mr. Martin played a key role in the hype during 2003, 2004, 2005, and 2006.

Makes you wonder whut happened, don't it for 2007?

Dale

 

keep in mind the risk keith martin ran in criticizing b-j recently. barret-jackson has done a great amount of advertising in sports car market. i applaud keith for stnding up for his beliefs and hobby, even at the risk of his own business.

 

It may have began after the article in Sportcar Market about the muscle car market. I remember reading something saying that the GMC bus/truck high price may signal the drop in muscle car prices and may be looked at in the future as the turning point. He did say it would be a "soft" crash though! I like all cars but it gets to a point when even clones of the real deal are going for crazy money. I do enjoy watching because I learn quite a bit but it does get boring though seeing the same type of cars going across the block. We just need to get the other auctions televised!!!!

 

Or what's bound to happen!

I did not think the bidding frenzy at the RM Auction at the Portola Plaza in Monterey during Concorso was as crowded or as pulse rising as in previous years.

I wonder where the car market is going! Are we seeing 89-91 again?

 

I sent an email to Varsha and gang asking where Martin is this year, and why there's no mention of B-J on SCM's web site. Needless to say, my email was not responded to. I'm not a big fan of Keith Martin (especially since he launched his short-lived collector car rating system), but I'm glad he had the courage to criticize the B-J/Speed unholy alliance. And I agree with him the Russon and Steele and RM have infinitely better auction lots than B-J.

Jack

 

I give this inflated market 2 more years. I think that certain cars will continue to hold their value such as some of the shelbys but resto mod cars - I think they will sink quick!

 

I know the parties envolved.

I know the issues

Both are very valid

Martin (Wrong place to vent in the media tent)
Jackson (wrong way to deal with it "hired Goons are so inpersonal")

there is some exceptional things happening in this one and don't think it is going away quietly

The 800 pound gorilla that is B'J might be cracking a little, there are many other issues that have been mentioned to me regarding B'J and the way things happen.... by some who are very well placed
1200 cars 10 really special ones

 

I'm getting out the popcorn......

Jack

 

care to let us know what is going on?

 

Or a 2-3 percent rise in the prime interest rate whichever comes first.

 

Ok some of this is supositiion and second hand. Have heard it from several reliable sources

1 Keith Martin spends many years as one of the ring masters of the circus that is Barretts. As a comentator he is paid (well) to put out expert Sports Car Knowlege as publisher of Sports Car Market he gets the added benifit of the Speed viewers being exposed to his pub (Win Win Win)

2 Speed "Goes in a different direction" with no Alan deCanadet No Kieth this year (Alan has been doing work for ESPN and Discovery HD)

3 Kieth has spent years as "The Expert" and tried and failed to get a collector car "Standard" created via Speed and SCM. One of the main points that blocked him was that B'J didn't support him on that

4 B'J has grown arrogant in how they handle everything as the 800 pound gorilla they have such a placement now they have become a "Brand" doing other TV BS Shows like "Life on the Block" and other fluff (Customers i know as regular sellers refuse to consign due to lack of Customer Service) Steve Davis (Craig's Right hand) is the guy who says what goes into the auction and when it goes in (you might realize the big money is Friday Night Saturday and Sunday) Steve refuses to delegate and never returns phone calls

5 Keith's dismissal from regular $$ and exposure hurts him and the Dog and Pony aspect of fauning over every car gets to a latent journalist inside the publisher's brain

6 Other auctions like Russo (owned by one of Craig's former partners or employees) RM and WWG are breathing down Jackson's neck. Russo has 500 cars in this years auction, some of them top shelf. RM has the real deal cars, then World Wide Group is positioning themselves as a ligit Boutique auction because they are all picking up the quality cars leaving a bunch of cuda's and Shellby's to BJ. 100 at RM 250 next week at Kruse 500 at Russo and 1200 cars at Bj this year. Talk about saturating the market
There simply can't be THAT MANY GREAT CARS

7 Have heard many sellers complain the auction has short put them. If you notice the trend in an auction is the price climbs plateaus and the I want i more than you do side takes over inching the price up. Short Put is when they don't milk the plateau but gavel it off quickly (and is maddening when one of the FOJ (Friends of Jackson) drives away with a bargin. No real proof but bad feeling and perception that they have not adressed due to lack of Give a Sh9t

Kieth does a bad move by speaking ill of the auction juggernaught that B'J+speed has become but does so IN THE MEDIA TENT WITH MANY EARS HANDY

Steve Craig and others get the goons to eject him

Now he is REALLY pissed and has not just SCM but the NYT to vent in Craig has Speed and one of the best PR men in the business (Scott Black) probably tossing and turning all night tonight trying to figure out how to deal with this one.

 

I think it might level out a little but ultimately continue upward. I doubt it will sink. Too many people who when they were young wanted these cars but didn't have the money, now have disposable income. Thats what causes this kind of craziness to begin with. I just remember what it was like in the late 80's early 90's when the big dogs like Otis Chandler and people like him starting buying up the musclecars. It ran the prices up. Then they dropped a little and here we are 15 years later with prices well beyond what they were back them.

Supply and demand.

For awhile during the mid and late 90'S prices hadn't increased as everyone was buying up the junkers and restoring them. Now the junkers have even run dry. To the point that they are "reissuing" old cars. And then came the high prices when the supply of junkers dryed up. And when I mean junkers I mean cars that 10 years earlier would have never been considered for a resto but for parts only.

Its amazing to see "'recreations" change hands at what seems to be high dollar amounts. The market is just loaded with car enthusiasts with money. Its not just speculators. And as everyone on here knows. Once cars are in your blood, whether sports cars or musclecars, its there for life. Thats why this trend will endure. Prices may not increase at the pace of the last few years but a decline in unlikely.

ED

 

Keep in mind that, given lead times, Martin wrote that editorial last summer. The key is whether he wrote it before or after he got axed from the show.

Whenever someone says that it is not about the money, remember that it is always about the money.

I started reading bike and car mags back in the 60s. It didn't take long to realize that all the so called road tests were nothing more than ad copy.

I'm not saying that the publishers are rip offs, but you gotta sell ads to pay the bills.

Keith Martin discovered a neat niche by writing witty little sound bites about cars going through auctions, instead of your standard "car tests." Thus, he was able to build his mag through small advertisers and subscriptions. As a result, he was able to publish some honest stuff. Sheehan, for example, has been able to rip newer Ferraris for years without Martin having to worry about Ferrari pulling its ads because Ferrari never had any ads in the first place.

Then about five years ago, he jumps on the media juggernaut that is Craig Jackson. While I don't know (or want to know) the details, I'm sure that both of them had a good run. But, apparently, Jackson has decided that he didn't need Martin anymore, hence the bad blood.

However, it wouldn't surprise me to see them kiss and make up for next year.

Dale

 

Craig Jackson always looks like he's just finished his third blunt of the day. And what's with Davis wearing the shades indoors? These guys just give me the creeps. Martin's attempt at a collectible car rating system (does everything have to be reduced to a score?) was ridiculous.

Here's what I'd like to know: What's the financial arrangement between B-J and Speed? Does Speed pay B-J for 40 hours of programming, or does B-J pay Speed for 40 hours of advertising? As far as I'm concerned, Bob Varsha's credibility is compromised by the whole circus. Maybe that's why Brock Yates and Alain DeCadenet aren't there now.

Jack

 

Martin getting the boot all makes for great press especially for Kieths subcriptions!!!maybe the Craig is too young to remember that Kieth was making the rounds at Scottsdale sitting up there in the front rows pen in hand long before anybody knew who he was.and he turned all those years of gathering data into his fine publication..and while im sure BJ would get a chuckle out of this,KM auction reports helped bring lots more people to their auction.while the TV and web exposure has made Kieth and his publication "small potatoes" maybe that was a "shot in the foot"..

im positive that like many others Kieth Martin also knows all the dirt and obviously theres lots of things they DONT want people to know about...from those magical "sub-numbers" the fact that many cars get bought back by the consignee when they dont hit the magic number at 10:30 at night and only other consignors are sitting around!maybe theres a llower buy fee since they purchased 10-15 lot numbers.besides that buy back price still is a "world record" for that particular type car.of course that information gets around the world via the web very quickly (long before Kieths Mag hits the press) so everbody with that car at home just loves it!....oh yeah,that seller/buyer s is grinning cause he has 4 more of the same vehicle back at the shop!

Scottsdale used to be a great week of car trading before the "scenesters" elbowed away all the "real car guys"..but regardless of all this...its become the huge show that Thomas Barrett envionsed and if he could he'd probably take a bow if those 2 blondes werent crowding his coffin!

 

Seems to me that the whole Speed/Fox/NASCAR group is now pretty much running the whole damn show. Nothing but BS, mechandising, and hype. Maybe next year they will audition off Britney Spears used panties paired with KF's Ferrari with custom brake calipers.

As to Keith Martin, IMO he is FAR from the "expert" he (and others) think he is. He is a PR/Marketing kind of guy, who fortunately has people he used in the past and still uses today (such as Ray Milo) to make him look good when it comes to actually knowing things.

It's sad that there are so few real collectors in the collector car market.

 

Yep, Letsee, Reggie Jackson's cars all burned up in a fire, Harrah sold off a bunch to pay bills years ago, and Chandler's are in a museum (That's good, we can go see them at least).

 

They are Dr. Stu...they are just not on cable TV!

Or however they beam it in, these days! LOL!

 

What really bothered me today is when they dragged some pianos and guitars across the auction block. Say what you will about their financial arrangements (between BJ - Speed, etc)...I'm a car guy, just watch the show to see the cars and learn a bit about the history of the ones I don't know so well. But when they started bringing out some Beatles exhibit and other stuff I turned the show off. This isn't Ebay, stick to cars please...

And yes, as for the prices - to me only the first 2-3 days are realistic. Good cars going for fair prices. The last few days are just a joke...half a million for a Boss 429? Hey, enjoy it. FIVE million for Shelby's own car?

 

The only thing I'll say, of his behavior....you NEVER criticize a host,....in their own home ...or even after the fact.......

THat shows what he's made of.......................

 

Keith Martin is a warmed over Alfa Romeo "expert" who parlayed BJ into a bigger perceived presence as an expert in collector cars. He should be at RM if he is into real collector cars, but he is focused in on BJ and intent on redressing the slight from Jackson as Jackson clearly has come to understand that Martin is feeling left out and is really not doing him any good anymore.
Martin is not Craig Jackson's problem - the other, far more credible auctioneers are.
RM puts on a real class show and out of their 100 or so cars they have up for sale, 90 are top drawer. They allow sellers to put appropriate reserves on a car and they work very hard to extract every dollar out of every car that rolls across the block.
BJ on the other hand has become the Kmart of the auction world. More merchandise than anybody else in their BJ Mart Supercenter, but most of it (98&#37 mediocre to awful. They are guaranteed a huge slice of every sale because in order to consign at BJ you have to agree to a "no reserve" sale. This means that if your car is not fetching the money you thought in the 150 seconds it allocated on the block, you have to buy it back yourself and pay BJ 20% of the price (10% each on the buy and sell side) for the privilege of your car being pushed rapidly across the block.
BJ has found the common thread amongst its customers is a familiarity with American made muscle cars of the 50's, 60's and 70's and therefore the slate is heavy with them. BJ does no research into the cars themselves and guarantees nothing.
I am a serious collector and I have bought some fine cars at BJ over the years, but this year I went for the Automobilia portion in the mornings and left before the schlock hit the block. RM is a place that I feel comfortable at. I know that Rob Myers has checked out every car that he has accepted and that I won't be buying a bag of snakes.
Unless Craig Jackson figures out that auctions need to have genuine bona fide rare and truly significant cars to attract serious collectors, it will deteriorate into a hillbilly fest of cleaned up farm pickups. They will drag Carroll Shelby's likeness out every once in a while to stir up the troops but the truth is that the real collectors will be long gone for RM and increasingly so, Drew Alcazar's Russo and Steele.