787 fire at Boston Logan

DMC · #1 01-07-2013, 10:55 AM

http://jalopnik.com/5973753/a-boeing...-logan-airport

Smoke was coming from cargo hold, no solid cause yet. The plane was at the ramp, no passengers were aboard.

**jcurry** · #2 01-07-2013, 09:04 PM

Some rather serious systems related teething issues with this airplane.

**Jet-X** · #3 01-07-2013, 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcurry

Some rather serious systems related teething issues with this airplane.

Yep, not very reassuring, every plane has teething issues, but the A380 and the 787 have not had smooth entry into service.

**rdefabri** · #4 01-08-2013, 01:15 PM

http://www.nbcnews.com/business/boei...id=msnhp&pos=1

I'd be worried, but then I'm a nervous flyer. I hate it. I make it a point not to fly on Airbus planes if I can avoid it...

**FERRARI-TECH** · #5 01-08-2013, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rdefabri

http://www.nbcnews.com/business/boei...id=msnhp&pos=1

. I make it a point not to fly on Airbus planes if I can avoid it...

That does not make you a nervous flier just a smart one

**rdefabri** · #6 01-08-2013, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FERRARI-TECH

That does not make you a nervous flier just a smart one

Well, I spelled "flier" wrong, so I can't be that smart!

****EDIT - ok, maybe not per this site: http://grammarist.com/spelling/flier-flyer/

**FERRARI-TECH** · #7 01-08-2013, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rdefabri

Well, I spelled "flier" wrong, so I can't be that smart!

****EDIT - ok, maybe not per this site: http://grammarist.com/spelling/flier-flyer/

LOL i spelled it the same as you...spell check fixed it for me

beast · #8 01-08-2013, 08:57 PM

Another JAL Dreamliner had a fuel leak today at KBOS.

http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/01/0...logan-airport/

**tazandjan** · #9 01-08-2013, 11:50 PM

APU battery reported as the cause on the cargo bay fire. Fuel leak fixed on the other one and she departed soon after.

Just teething problems on a new aircraft.

**Bob Parks** · #10 01-09-2013, 12:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tazandjan

APU battery reported as the cause on the cargo bay fire. Fuel leak fixed on the other one and she departed soon after.

Just teething problems on a new aircraft.

Having been there on 8 new Boeing airplane programs, I have to agree with you ,Taz. I was thinking about things that happened on each one and in the old days, the public never heard about them unless there was a crash. I can and have mentioned some bizarre things that happened on some of the programs but I have a feeling that there is some skill dilution in play here. Too many new young people with thin experience in the disciplines and control.

**rdefabri** · #11 01-09-2013, 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Parks

Having been there on 8 new Boeing airplane programs, I have to agree with you ,Taz. I was thinking about things that happened on each one and in the old days, the public never heard about them unless there was a crash. I can and have mentioned some bizarre things that happened on some of the programs but I have a feeling that there is some skill dilution in play here. Too many new young people with thin experience in the disciplines and control.

I'd have to imagine there is data kept on the crash ratio by plane / manufacturer...I'd be curious to see these (although I should be careful what I wish for...I'm traveling in 2 weeks!!!).

Any idea if there's something public?

beast · #12 01-09-2013, 08:38 AM

Here is a photo from the area that the battery caught fire.

https://twitter.com/NTSB/status/2887...136448/photo/1

**TheMayor** · #13 01-09-2013, 09:16 AM

My boss just flew a Dreamliner today from Tokyo to LA. He loved it.

**jcurry** · #14 01-09-2013, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by beast

Here is a photo from the area that the battery caught fire.

https://twitter.com/NTSB/status/2887...136448/photo/1

Not related to the battery, but looks like they need some additional cabling support.

**jcurry** · #15 01-09-2013, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Parks

Too many new young people with thin experience in the disciplines and control.

On 777 the design group hierarchy was really deep. Grunts were both new hires and experienced engineers (lot of contract guys). Leads almost all had prior new airplane development experience, i.e. 757/767. Principal engineers, above the leads, typically had multiple new airplane development experience. I doubt if the 787 had the same depth, especially in the vendor teams. Many of the the new hires on the 777 had already been promoted into supervisor/managerial roles, thus the design teams lost out on a lot of the lessons learned of seasoned veterans.

**Jet-X** · #16 01-09-2013, 11:23 AM

United confirmed one of their 787 also had wiring problems yesterday.

**Bob Parks** · #17 01-09-2013, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcurry

On 777 the design group hierarchy was really deep. Grunts were both new hires and experienced engineers (lot of contract guys). Leads almost all had prior new airplane development experience, i.e. 757/767. Principal engineers, above the leads, typically had multiple new airplane development experience. I doubt if the 787 had the same depth, especially in the vendor teams. Many of the the new hires on the 777 had already been promoted into supervisor/managerial roles, thus the design teams lost out on a lot of the lessons learned of seasoned veterans.

I worked from the start on the 777 when it was called the 767-X. When it really began to jell it appeared that the company trolled through every department and office and scooped up the best and most experienced gang they could find. I never worked with a more cohesive, dedicated, helpful, agreeable, and skilled bunch of people on any previous program. Mulally had a lot to do with that, too.

nzporsche944s2 · #18 01-09-2013, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rdefabri

I'd have to imagine there is data kept on the crash ratio by plane / manufacturer...I'd be curious to see these (although I should be careful what I wish for...I'm traveling in 2 weeks!!!).

Any idea if there's something public?

Here you go!

http://www.airdisaster.com/statistics/

**Gatorrari** · #19 01-09-2013, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nzporsche944s2

Here you go!

http://www.airdisaster.com/statistics/

Well, four of the Boeings rank 3/4/5/6 and the best Airbus is 7, but newer aircraft like 777s and A330s are not included. I wonder if the 767 ranking includes Egyptair, which was suspected to be a pilot suicide?

I'm interested in the fact that one crash makes AirTran (which I fly often) seem comparatively unsafe, but that was back in the ValuJet days, so it probably shouldn't even count.

**rdefabri** · #20 01-10-2013, 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gatorrari

Well, four of the Boeings rank 3/4/5/6 and the best Airbus is 7, but newer aircraft like 777s and A330s are not included. I wonder if the 767 ranking includes Egyptair, which was suspected to be a pilot suicide?

I'm interested in the fact that one crash makes AirTran (which I fly often) seem comparatively unsafe, but that was back in the ValuJet days, so it probably shouldn't even count.

Agreed - the data isn't detailed enough to glean much.

Interesting nonetheless!