I don't think I'd do this with my own airplane. | FerrariChat

I don't think I'd do this with my own airplane.

Discussion in 'Aviation Chat' started by Ak Jim, Oct 6, 2015.

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  1. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
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    Brian Crall
    Aside from the airframe stresses, with a recip I'd think hydraulic locking a motor would be a real possibility. What is the risk to a turbine? Or a prop/propdrive?

    I agree. Over engineering is for safety margins, not intentional use.
     
  2. Jet-X

    Jet-X F1 Veteran

    Nov 2, 2003
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    Brian
  3. zygomatic

    zygomatic F1 Rookie
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    Chris
  4. Jason Crandall

    Jason Crandall F1 Veteran

    Mar 25, 2004
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    That doesn't look intentional. Someone "f-ed" up.
     
  5. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
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    The title of the film, the inboard, outboard, ariel and on the water camera shots suggest it was planned but then again, I guess it all could be a coincidence.
     
  6. Jason Crandall

    Jason Crandall F1 Veteran

    Mar 25, 2004
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    I just can't believe it. If nothing else it seems the pilot would at least be wearing a helmet if he was planning on doing this. I would have a race car seat and 5 point harness and flame suit on while I was at it.
     
  7. donv

    donv Two Time F1 World Champ
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    I think they were just trying to film it arriving-- it is a pretty rare aircraft, after all. This was just an added bonus...

     
  8. sigar

    sigar F1 Rookie
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    Apr 30, 2005
    3,386
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    There is no way that was intentional. Cool plane, I don't think I've ever seen one of those before.
     
  9. opencollector

    opencollector Formula Junior

    Feb 1, 2005
    424
    CA Central Coast
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    Thomas
    "Dear friends. Unfortunately we had a heavy contact by an object in the water at a planned touch and go during the Scalaria Air Challenge 2015 air show last weekend. Currently we are investigating the damage. Luckily nobody was hurt. Because there was a heavy storm a couple of hours before, we think it might have been a tree trunk. Another one has hit a motorboat only minutes before."

    "By due! Be sure, this was not an intended "part of the show"!!! (As they stated in the video) We are surely not attempting to destroy our beloved Latina!! She's still sitting on Salzburg Airport. We hope to get her "roofed" within the next weeks on her home base!"

    https://www.facebook.com/Do24ATT
     
  10. solofast

    solofast Formula 3

    Oct 8, 2007
    1,773
    Indianapolis
    Turbines can handle a lot of water. Unless you dunk the inlet you probably can't suck in enough water from spray like that to do any real damage. We used to do water injection on an engine that had an airflow of 6 pounds per second and we were doing about 5% of the inlet airflow as water just for power boosting. Doesn't sound like much but that's over 2 gpm in the inlet of an engine that has about one fourth the airflow of these engines. You could do about 10 gpm and that would just be boosting the engine...

    It depends on the specific engine and the control if big water would do too much damage. Too much water could turn to steam and steam can do more work so there is a potential for overspeed. So long as the control catches it, it might do too much, if any damage

    As to how this happened...

    They are saying they hit something in the water... Huummmm... I watched the video frame by frame and had he hit anything the boat would have jumped up. Didn't see that at all. The nose mushes in and the ship spins around..

    On landing he was nose low, which in a seaplane is pretty much a recipe for disaster. V type boat hulls, when they hit the water nose low like that are inherently unstable. It's called "bow steering" and I have lots of videos of a test boat we have spinning in it's own length when the nose digs into a wave because the hull is trimmed too nose low.

    You really want to land "step first" and keep the nose up with a lot of aft stick. Maybe he wanted to come down and do a high speed pass on the water, or he "wheelbarrowed" it by pushing forward on the controls, but it doesn't look like he hit anything. If he had hit anything with the nose that low it would have torn the bottom off and the hull would have jumped up and I didn't see that.

    I believe they had damage to the nose, but it's a lot more convenient to say you hit something than admit you screwed up.

    JMHO and qualified as such.
     
  11. Bob Parks

    Bob Parks F1 Veteran
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    Nov 29, 2003
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    I tend to agree with you. I noticed that he had full left rudder and full up elevator as it spun around. And it didn't appear that he hit anything. Dornier through history built some very good flying boats and this one must have had some of that legacy still in it.
     
  12. Jason Crandall

    Jason Crandall F1 Veteran

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    +1. I never saw him try to dodge anything. He landed wrong.
     
  13. solofast

    solofast Formula 3

    Oct 8, 2007
    1,773
    Indianapolis
    I didn't realize that he was doing a "touch and go"..

    I suspect that he "touched" with too much speed, because he was planning to go around, and that created a nose low pitch attitude. Before he could pull it back it "sucked down" on the water, which is to say the high velocity water wouldn't let go of the hull and this is caused again by the nose being lower than the step, and it basically creates negative lift under the hull. This is why there is a step on the hull in the first place, but to work there must be positive angle attack to the planing surface. Negative planing surface angle aft creates big suck down forces.

    You can also see that the nose was low and there was a lot of nose spray in the shots from the wing just before the spin as well as in the video from the observer...

    Once the nose dug in it was all over but the crying.
     
  14. Tcar

    Tcar F1 Rookie

    Hope the plane wasn't damaged badly... it's a nice looking plane IMO.
     

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