Oil Filter Comparison Pix: NAPA vs. UFI | FerrariChat

Oil Filter Comparison Pix: NAPA vs. UFI

Discussion in 'Boxers/TR/M' started by kerrywittig, Jan 7, 2011.

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  1. kerrywittig

    kerrywittig Formula 3
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    #1 kerrywittig, Jan 7, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I picked up a NAPA 1774 oil filter today to at least use and then discard when I fill the motor back up with oil after this MAJOR service........I plan on putting a 100 miles on the odometer and then dropping all the oil and refilling with synthetic and a UFI. Just thought some might want to see what the actual "pysical" differences are.................cost difference...........NAPA $14.41, UFI $45...............I think the UFI is well worth another $30 when it comes to "cleaning my oil".

    Comparing Me
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  2. Shamile

    Shamile F1 Veteran

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    Dear Ferraristi,

    hmm...interesting find Kerry. I was unaware that the Testarossa filter even had a cross-reference.

    I'll still stick to my "rip-off" $75.00 from the dealer filter.

    ...given all the work and money you've spent, it is worth a cheap filter for even a couple of miles? I've heard aftermarket filters don't have the specified springs or baffles called by the OEM...that's why they're WAY cheaper.


    Shamile

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  3. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

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    No its not especially considering after all the work is when there is the highest probability of debris in the motor.
     
  4. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

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    They dont and considering their listing for the Ferraris they do have in the catalog are just the standard Ford filter that doesn't meet specs I wouldn't trust them if they did.

    Just because it has the correct thread and gasket size doen't make it a good choice.
     
  5. Shamile

    Shamile F1 Veteran

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    Dear Ferrarsti,


    I remember years ago when they took a Porsche filter made by Puralator and the "off the shelf" puralator filter...huge difference on the spring and baffles.

    OEM is just the prudent course of action.... :)


    Shamile

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  6. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
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  7. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

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    Well reasoned.



    I will go on record again


    I have seen many Ferrari motors lost due to filter failures. A few of them were failures of Ferrari filters. One of them was a client. I showed Ferrari the filter and the invoice showing them I bought it from an authorized dealer. Ferrari paid every penny to repair the motor.

    Try that at the NAPA store.
     
  8. Spasso

    Spasso F1 World Champ

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    #8 Spasso, Jan 7, 2011
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2011
    I keep seeing Fram PH2804-1 Filters being used on various Ferraris in place of the Baldwin 253. I have read of the Frams collapsing internally.

    I cut a standard Fram oil filter apart a while back and haven't bought one since.

    I'll stick with the UFI on the TR. Too bad there isn't a cross for those in a Baldwin.
     
  9. kerrywittig

    kerrywittig Formula 3
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    #9 kerrywittig, Jan 8, 2011
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2011
    The Baldwin 253 won't work on a TR.......wrong thread diameter and pitch.

    Had a Fram fail on another vehicle......Fram paid thousands for every cent needed to properly rebuild and repair engine in 6 days.
     
  10. Spasso

    Spasso F1 World Champ

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    #10 Spasso, Jan 8, 2011
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2011
    I know the Baldwin and Fram won't work on the TR but I have seen the Fram on 3x8s and some early V-12s. I seem to recall that the parts book crossed the Fram to an Allison automatic transmission which would indicate that it could handle some high pressures but I still don't trust them..

    I understand your thoughts on sacrificing a cheap filter on first start-up. I've done that on numerous engines.

    Just saying that it looks like we need to stick to the spec filters for the long run..

    BTW, the NAPA Gold filters are built by Wix. I use them on all of my BMWs and truck.
    Tear one apart and compare it to the run-of-the-mill Fram. Quite a difference.
     
  11. kerrywittig

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    #11 kerrywittig, Jan 8, 2011
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2011
    Here are Fram specs along with applications and competitors cross referencing at very bottom............

    Note that Balwin (part#s BALDWIN B157, B7009, BK6832)
    does make a few that are the same dimensionally! I need to do a little more investigating to find out if they are within an acceptable spec......

    Part Number: PH7014
    Product Type Full-Flow Lube, Spin-on
    Anti-Drain Valve NO
    Gasket I.D. 2.5"
    Gasket O.D. 2.83"
    Gasket Thickness .25"
    Gasket Usage Base
    Product Height 5.81"
    Product I.D. 1-12 Th'd
    Product O.D. 4.3"
    Relief Valve Setting PSI 12

    Applications Where Used:
    BLUE BIRD, Conventional
    Ford 6.6L Diesel Engine [1997-1987]
    Ford 7.8L Diesel Engine [1997-1987]

    FORD-TRACTORS
    5640
    6640
    7740
    7744
    7840
    8240
    8340
    NEW HOLLAND
    2450
    2550
    TR-86
    Ford 678HT Engine TR-87
    Ford 678HTA Engine TR-96
    Ford 678HTA Engine TR-97
    Ford 678HTA Engine TX-36NA
    Ford 678HTA Engine
    NEW HOLLAND-COMBINES
    Ford 678HT Engine TR-86
    Ford 678HTA Engine TR-87
    Ford 678HTA Engine TR-96
    Ford 678HTA Engine TR-97
    Ford 678HTA Engine TX-36NA
    NEW HOLLAND-TRACTORS OR LIFT TRUCKS
    2450
    2550
    THOMAS BUS Conventional
    Ford 6.6L Diesel Engine
    WARD-AMTRAN
    Conventional
    Ford 6.6L Diesel Engine
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Competitor Cross Reference

    ALLIANCE ABP/N10G-LF3443
    ALLIANCE ABP/N10G-LF3497
    BALDWIN B157
    BALDWIN B7009
    BALDWIN BK6832
    BIG A 92754
    BIG A 92774
    CARQUEST 85754
    CARQUEST 85774
    CARQUEST 89555
    CATERPILLAR 3I-1203
    COACH GUARD T08-1009
    DONALDSON P550731
    DONALDSON P559083
    DONALDSON P559306
    FLEETGUARD LF3443
    FLEETGUARD LF3443SC
    FLEETGUARD MK12407
    FLEETRITE LFR-83443
    FORD E5HN-6714-AA
    FORD E7HZ-6714-A
    FORD E7HZ-6731-A
    FORD E9HN-6714-BA
    FORD F0HZ-6731-A
    FORD F0HZ-6731-B
    FORD F0NN-6714-AA
    HASTINGS LF310
    HASTINGS LF442
    JIFFY LUBE HL7014
    KRALINATOR L281
    LUBER-FINER LFP781
    LUBER-FINER LK121F
    LUBER-FINER LK125F
    LUBER-FINER LK191F
    LUBER-FINER PH6715
    MANN & HUMMEL W1167
    MOTORCRAFT FL 811-B
    NAPA 1754
    NAPA 1774
    PUROLATOR L45194
    SERVICE 1 L39260
    SERVICE 1 OF39260
    VOLVO 3130921
    VOLVO 3946614
    WIX 24555
    WIX 51754
    WIX 51754MP
    WIX 51774
     
  12. Spasso

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    #12 Spasso, Jan 8, 2011
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2011
    I'm confused.
    PH7014 What does this fit? A TR?
    "Relief Valve Setting PSI 12" What does this mean?

    I am interested to see if the other Baldwins stack up.
     
  13. kerrywittig

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    PH7014 What does this fit?
    See below..............
    Applications Where Used:
    BLUE BIRD, Conventional
    Ford 6.6L Diesel Engine [1997-1987]
    Ford 7.8L Diesel Engine [1997-1987]
    FORD-TRACTORS
    5640
    6640
    7740
    7744
    7840
    8240
    8340
    NEW HOLLAND
    2450
    2550
    TR-86
    Ford 678HT Engine TR-87
    Ford 678HTA Engine TR-96
    Ford 678HTA Engine TR-97
    Ford 678HTA Engine TX-36NA
    Ford 678HTA Engine
    NEW HOLLAND-COMBINES
    Ford 678HT Engine TR-86
    Ford 678HTA Engine TR-87
    Ford 678HTA Engine TR-96
    Ford 678HTA Engine TR-97
    Ford 678HTA Engine TX-36NA
    NEW HOLLAND-TRACTORS OR LIFT TRUCKS
    2450
    2550
    THOMAS BUS Conventional
    Ford 6.6L Diesel Engine
    WARD-AMTRAN
    Conventional
    Ford 6.6L Diesel Engine


    A TR?
    Yes, physically.......but now we need to find out about it's internal specs.............

    I am interested to see if the other Baldwins stack up.
    Me too.................

    "Relief Valve Setting PSI 12" What does this mean?
    The number below may be able to answer that question.
    Fram U.S. Product Assistance - Call 1.800.890.2075
    Option 1 Customer Service
    Option 2 FRAM / Autolite for Application & Technical Information


    ME being Me
     
  14. Spasso

    Spasso F1 World Champ

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    Thanks for the clarification.
     
  15. Steve Magnusson

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    #15 Steve Magnusson, Jan 8, 2011
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2011
    It means that when the pressure difference between the inlet side of the filter element and the outlet side of the filter element is greater than 12 psi, a valve opens, and allows oil to bypass the filter element completely (because it "thinks" the filter element is clogged at that much pressure difference). What's important here is if the relief valve is resettable (i.e., it will reclose when the pressure difference drops below 12 psi) or if it is a one-time "it blows open and stays open" design where it doesn't reclose if the pressure difference drops below 12 psi. This is one of the big quality differences between the Fram PH2804-1, which has the cheaper "one-time blows open and stays open" relief valve, and the Baldwin B253, which has a spring-loaded resettable 19 psi relief valve.

    If the mounting dimensions are OK, other things to ask about on any Baldwin or Fram alternative for a TR is:

    total inlet area (we know the TR UFI value)
    maximum flow rate
    maximum recommended working pressure
    minimum burst pressure
     
  16. Spasso

    Spasso F1 World Champ

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    Thanks Steve,
    I thought it had something to do with filter by-pass but wasn't sure about the mechanics of it.
     
  17. kerrywittig

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    Does anybody have a TR up in the air? Why you ask? I need a measurement of what is the longest an oil filter can be? In other words say the UFI is 6 inches.....is there still another 1 to 2 inches available before it sticks out where it could be damaged by road hazards/debris? As we all know it is tucked up under there pretty good. I would measure mine but the engine is out and in pieces at this time.....thanks............

    Lookin for a flying TR Me
     
  18. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

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    It is a little exposed as is. I would not want it longer.

    The 512 motor is lower. The filter is shorter too for the same reason.
     
  19. kerrywittig

    kerrywittig Formula 3
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    Thanks Bri,...............So it is exposed a bit huh!?! Then no longer than the UFI and if a bit shorter not that big a deal.........OK....let me see what I can find!!

    Lookin for Shorty Me
     
  20. kerrywittig

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    #20 kerrywittig, Jan 12, 2011
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2011
    Here is another alternative from Baldwin....but it is an inch longer!!!

    BT8512
    Descriptions: Hydraulic Spin-on
    Contains: 40 PSID By-Pass Valve
    Fits: Claas, Hamm, Liebherr Equipment
    Replaces: Liebherr 5612546, 7004209; Rottne 480101; Fleetguard HF28989
    Thread: 1-12
    O.D.: 3 23/32 (94.5)
    Length: 6 23/32 (170.7)
    I. Gskt.: G401
    UPC: 7 91440 06483 6


    He said "Longer"! Me
     
  21. Whisky

    Whisky Two Time F1 World Champ
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    I'm glad you said that, because I was going to ask you folks' opinion on WIX filters, that is all I have ever used on my domestic DD.

    I take it most everyone prefers Factory Ferrari filters first, then Baldwin, but where does a WIX stack up with everything?
     
  22. kerrywittig

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    #22 kerrywittig, Jan 12, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Wix alternative.................

    Part Number: 51774
    UPC Number: 765809517745
    Principal Application: Ford Tractors & Wheel Loaders
    All Applications
    Style: Spin-On Lube Filter
    Service: Lube
    Type: Full Flow
    Media: Paper
    Height: 5.205
    Outer Diameter Top: 4.282
    Outer Diameter Bottom: Closed
    Thread Size: 1-12
    By-Pass Valve Setting-PSI: 18-22
    Burst Pressure-PSI: 430
    Max Working Pressure-PSI: 215
    Max Flow Rate: 10-12 GPM
    Nominal Micron Rating: 32

    Gasket Diameters
    Number O.D. I.D. Thk.
    Attached 2.834 2.462 0.200
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  23. kerrywittig

    kerrywittig Formula 3
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    #23 kerrywittig, Jan 12, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Purolator Alternative..................

    Part# L32960
    Specifications:
    Anti-Drain Back Valve-No
    Height 5.87
    O.D. 4.25
    Relief Valve P.S.I. 18-20
    Thread Pitch UNF-2B
    Threads 1-12
    Type of Filter Spin-on

    Alternative Me
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  24. Whisky

    Whisky Two Time F1 World Champ
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    I meant how does a WIX stack up as far as filtering performance goes?
     
  25. fastradio

    fastradio F1 Rookie
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    So the correct, known to work, filter cost $30 more than a generic filter...
    What's an engine overhaul cost on a TR, due to an oil related failure?

    $30K-$40K
     

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