DIY major service part 2: water pump questions

Here's part 1. I promise no more butt shots : http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/boxers-tr-m/439956-diy-timing-belt-progress-we-have-liftoff.html

Time spent so far:

Engine drop, 12 hours. This was my first TR engine drop, bet I could do it in half the time next time.

Throttle cable stuck: 1 hour. For some reason I had left on one of the nuts on the very rear of the throttle cable threading. Got it off using a flashlight and every single extension in my tool box and a deep 8mm socket.

Removing bent shift rod: 1 hour. Removing the console to get to it took forever. Gave it to my neighbor who works at a machine shop so he can straighten it. Next time I will remove the alternator first so I don't catch the shift rod on the belt and pulley.

Removing timing belt cover and alternator: 1 hour. I took my time and photographed everything to make reassembly easier.

Before going further, I think I need to order more parts for the water pump. I couldn't find a DIY for this or any photos of the assembly (I'll post mine), so I have to go by the diagram below. I found this list on ferarilife of the parts supposedly needed, but I only have 152051. I REALLY want to do this correctly the first time...I want to learn from Kerry's woes and NOT do multiple engine drops!

101023 Seal diagram #2
152051 Seal diagram #3 & #27 (these are combined into a single part now)
121165 Seal diagram #12
133899 Bearing (2x) diagram #9
134947 Gasket for water pump housing (not in this diagram)

Questions:

1. Is it standard practice to stop the "rebuild" at part #3 or do you go in deeper to replace #12 and #9 as well?

2. Does the big WP housing need to be removed to do any of this?
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Thanks LP400S, this is helpful.

My TR is an '85 so supposedly the seal part # is straightforward.

The water pump housing I was referring to is the BIG housing seen right below #1. The guy on F list pulled that too and replaced the other #9 bearing, but I don't want to get into removing the chain, etc.

I took off the whole shift rod so the linkage adjustment nuts are undisturbed. I may have to readjust them anyway if my machinist can't get it back to where it was again. Just hoping to get lucky.

 

Aw man, those pictures are great! I'll take mine apart before I order more parts to make sure I get everything I need. Thanks again!

 

Removed the water pump parts, took about 3 hours. Someone had put RTV silicone on the impeller in the area around the shaft so it didn't want to budge. I had to heat the impeller with a pencil torch, then tug on the blades firmly with two pliers padded with a cloth.

The brass cup had just enough of an exposed lip that I could pry out on it with a small flathead screwdriver without scratching the aluminum housing. Once one part of the lip was bent down, it was easy to pry down the rest of the lip. Spent about an hour of working my way around the top and cleaning away the silicone they put here too. Then I used two tiny vice grips to pull on two of the center tabs and out she came!

It was a mucky mess in front of the oil seal! The weep hole was clogged too...I'm glad I decided to open up the WP! After cleaning that out I had a hard time getting the paint can tool under the oil seal lip. I finally got out a small metal hook tool and bent out a little area so the tool could slip under the lip. Once the tool was under I used Vincezo's method of prying on it with a block of wood and a screwdriver. After doing this in three different places it popped right out.

My seals look just like LP400S's above. I've bought the wrong WP seal which is a one piece and looks a lot different.

LP400S, what are the part numbers for the seals you used to do the '85 TR?
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^^^Yep! I showed the pump to one of my friends who is an engineer for an industrial water pump company, and he said that this particular design is extremely efficient and low drag. And complicated.

Please forget those last two photos...had a brain fart and took a picture of the seal in the wrong order. Why can't you edit your own posts after posting?

This is how it's put together. I was sent part 183759 (just looked at the box), when I really need 152051. 152051 includes the white ceramic, rubber-topped seal that goes into the impeller, right? LP400S, where did you source your parts?
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OK did some more research and it looks like I need part 120948A. All of the major part supply places show this being superseded by 152051, but Kerry has leaks after installing this and is now trying the 120948A. Who still sells this 120948A?
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You can't buy the pump as a complete unit. Kerry Wittig just told me that the two piece 120948A seal is still available at T. Rutlands. It was only $39 and is on its way to me.

Oh yes, I will test this thing throughly before reassembly. I plan to turn over the engine a few times (before I take off the timing belts) to make sure everything's seated properly and then use the PVC caps and tire valve setup that Vincezo used to pressure test.

The edit button disappears after a few hours...too bad.

 

The parts are supposed to arrive tomorrow. What type and brand of RTV/silicone should I use? Which of the following areas?

1. Oil seal contact with housing
2. Brass cup contact with housing
3. Impeller contact with rubber backing on the white ceramic seal
4. Impeller contact with shaft

All of the above appeared to have a light coating of some kind of sealant...it was tan in color. Did Ferrari use sealant when the engine was first built? Since Dave Helms didn't open the WP in the last major, I bet the last time it was resealed was when the chain was updated under the factory recall.