At $143k for a 13kmi blk/blk example, I wouldn't say "well bought", but rather "strong money" being more appropriate. I disagree with your assessment especially when similar examples have gone for $20-50k less in the past 8 months alone and retail listing asking prices have been in the same selling range. The market is unquestionably moving as seen across the model line for most of the older cars (308/328/348/TR etc). If a 512TR brings $160-200k next spring, I would then join you in saying "well bought".
Au Contraire ! I too say well bought...not because I am Bias... 94 is rarest , as rare as the M if not more so Because That car and the 93 and 92...are the lowest production #'s with only 400 being brought to the states in Total..the Market is in Flux as we speak.. There will be a vacuum created shortly by the advancing prices of boxers. You may never see another 94 512TR for sale again under $250,000.00 a 94 is not a 93, to some there is a difference..just like a 52000+ boxer is not a 46000 serial # some covet the final run more than others. I know I do. Very well bought, If I may!
Mike, thanks for the back-up SherrillT, if you know of any 13K mile 94 512TR's for $90K, please PM me immediately.
As a totally unbiased observer, I wholeheartedly agree. A black 1994 512TR should be worth 10 times the amount this one went for. The only knock on the auctioned car is that it was not located in Austin, Texas. The Austin ones are particularly desirable according to my detailed analysis of market conditions.
Can someone locate the link.. I heard the 1993 at RM auctions went for $187,000.00 cant find results page
I by far am unbiased as well; neither for or against high/low prices – my car was judged Platino at this year’s meet and I would naturally welcome a rise in its value, but I try to stay realistic and unemotional about pricing as it is not a factor for owning my cars hoping they give me a some sort of future return on my money. The auction term “well bought” typically indicates a bargain or below market price (good deal) and with that being said, I respect anyone’s opinion (and we all have our opinions here) and the prices they are willing to pay (crazy as some may be), but the facts are there is no key functional, major cosmetic, or performance differentiation between 92-94 512TRs to prompt any significant price difference (bottom line it's not a 512M) during its production and at this point in being a >20yr old car it's going to be condition not year model that dictates the price of a 512TR changing ownership, given all those factors just like any other vintage car. If the buyer or anyone feels $143k is a good price you are welcome to your opinion and I am confident you can walk up to any listing seller or dealer with that amount and pick-up a like car haggle free and the car will be yours. If a like example 512TR seller scoffs at that offer they are most likely delusional, but then again we all know as the buyers and sellers we establish the actual prices and the relative value of a car based on the dollars we will accept or give up. Auction prices as I have stated before in previous posts are NOT a KEY indicator (as in this case) of the overall market and are just a soft data point in the grand sample size - as egos, bidding frenzy, or lack of interest at a given event (low prices if sellers let them go) can often give artificial highs and lows. No one knows all the actual sales as this tends to be close hold information, but from time to time we get insights, but we do see list prices and there are not many cars listing in excess of $150k. I often contact buyers privately and ask what they bought or sold their cars for and from the ones that care to divulge the information, I can assure you it has not been over $125k over the past year for your typical 10-20k mi car. I welcome anyone to show me 12-24 month trend data of consistent list in excess of $143k list prices of a 512TRs with understanding that an anomaly <5k mi car is a toss out of the sample - you will find it just isn't there. There have been a few $150-180k listed cars hit recently, but do you believe or do you buy your cars for list? I hope not, and anyone that knows exotic/ upper bracket car pricing knows there is at least a $20k delta or greater between wholesale and retail. For all of you that say the car was “well bought” (good deal) – if you were at the auction would you have really have placed a higher bid on the car assuming you were in the market and a savvy buyer? For me $110k would have been top dollar and I would have felt I gave the seller ALL the money and came out the financial loser, but winner with a nice car. If you feel that it was worth more...again your opinion.
Just my opinion But ....you are either at the front of the curve or the back. Your statements are correct for a static market. We are currently experiencing quite a dynamic market Dynamic is the front for sure. Click the next lot button on the tr results page It is another surprise , a 66 e type... Omg , how much! Unless we enter another world war, trends will continue History tells us that the years with the fewest of a model sell for more I will venture to say there are wayyy less than 100 94 512tr's in the country This is exclusivity. Exclusivity costs more and people will pay more Odd but true On A leap of faith I would have paid more if I were at that Auction.
"Strong money" for today, but as you say the market is moving. I think we've reached the point where the hardcore classics -- 246, 365 BB, glass 308s, pre-74 911, et al are all out of the range of the vast majority of buyers, That leaves the 328/TR/512TR generation looking very affordable in comparison, and a lot of guys don't want to miss the next wave. I think an extremely nice 512TR could do $160K in 2015. (Of course... the market is feeling a little frothy right now, so who knows.) What's interesting is that a brand new 458 is looking like an increasingly bad buy, given that glass 308s seem about to eclipse it in value, and 246s left it in the dust last year. From a financial perspective, I know that I'm more interested in classic/vintage than ever, and wouldn't put serious cash into a modern car.
So if the low mileage late 512TR's are north of 140k, what does that make 92's with miles worth in the real world?
The big cherry in all this for 2015 is also China and it's appetite for classic cars. We could see prices continue to grow once China comes online. Bund Classic | China Rendez-Vous Ltd http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2013/10/18/china-classic-cars/3001091/
Well the curve is naturally a measure of time/duration and my measure is right now and going back 12-24 months looking forward 12 months, so I am sure the data shows this transaction is more of a high and not a median or a low (both meaning "well bought"). I am sure prices are still on a steady incline slope, but slopes are typically gradual unless it's the old irrational exuberance like real estate in the last decade. That said; if you, other posters, and other potential buyers are feeling it's well bought and you are in the market and honestly ready, willing, and able to pay over $143k for such a car then the market has gone white/hyper hot IMO and anyone with the means and vision should be buying up every example regardless of year that hits the market below $140k as a speculator and flip or hold the cars for 12-24mos with what should be only marginal risk for resale with decent returns. Unfortunately I do not think the market is there (yet or near term) on these cars, but it's not off the table in the future and honestly think it's more than realistic. I spoke with the current Canadian owner of that previously discussed/dogged "Blue 512TR" from the dealer in Naples,FL that was jaw boned to death in the past year on the forum and he is in the speculator mode having bought two 512TRs (blue and yellow) from our discussion on the concours field at this years meet. Time will tell and we can all revisit the never ending and annual revisted chatter on prices and the current market next year and see if truely the average 512TR prices are changing hands (not just listing) over $150k+; for me and my fellow owners of 512TRs it would be nice and more than welcomed, but at the moment I doubt it. I think your assessment is spot on and all those combined factors are pushing the market upwards. Your later comment on "extremely nice" is already valid and proven with the extremely nice 512TRs already doing well north of $160k based on recent sales at $180-200k+; again these are the <5k mi cars that are an exception not the norm.
I got 3 emails today asking about my 94 and what it wld take for me to release it. im sure all 3 parties are searching on behalf of the same buyer - someone is looking for a 94 in a serious way....
Condition dependent naturally but from what I have taken away from both buyers and sellers of reportedly clean examples is that the price is $89-105k as true selling/cash changing hands for cars that are 15-27k mi; based on 5 known sales since late last year of 92-94s. Typically you don't consider a prices older than 6mos, but there is just far too limited real number data points to get a clear definite figure, but it's a good starting basis for figuring what the upper and lower end was/is...hence my comment that $110k would have been my upper limit. Dealers are listing them for $125-150k for good non-exceptional examples.
I guess it's all relative. If you want it and you have the money, anything is "well bought" I know my TR was "well bought"!
I Predict: SOLD in 7 days or less at list especially with that automanual gearbox!!!!!!!! 1994 Ferrari Testarossa for sale by Ferrari Maserati of Long Island in Plainview,NY 11803 | duPont REGISTRY Year 1994 Make Ferrari Model Testarossa Trim N/A Mileage 17310 Engine Not Listed Exterior Color Red Interior Color Beige Drive Train Other Transmission Automanual Body Style 2 Door Doors 2 Wheelbase N/A Fuel Other Stock # NP2541 VIN ZFFLG40A0R0097028 Price $179,900
Spot on. The dealer site now shows it as "SALE PENDING" Used 1994 FERRARI 512 TR For Sale | Plainview, NYC, NY | VIN: ZFFLG40A0R0097028 Rgds, Vincenzo
